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NVIDIA BIOS Signature Lock Broken - What Caused Open-Source Pains For Years

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  • #31
    Originally posted by tildearrow View Post
    Let's be honest: nouveau was made without help from NVIDIA.
    Not entirely true. Nvidia had/has an interest in Nouveau: they need the video card to be boostrapped to the point it can display enough for the user to be able to grab the official drivers and install them. At least that was the story some years ago when I read it.

    I know that level of "support" is largely irrelevant, but there was at least some level of interest from them.
    Last edited by bug77; 21 August 2023, 07:40 PM.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by bug77 View Post

      Proves my point perfectly.
      It was Ford, but it had nothing to do with seatbelts, it was about the gas tank. It was not about refusing to implement something, it was about pointing out the recommended modifications were excessive (they agreed to do what they deemed made sense). And it was not their decision to make, it was their argument with NHTSA recommendation. They did what they were told to do after presenting their arguments. Other than that, you're spot on.

      (Look it up if you don't believe me, the document is available to the public and it's only 7 page long.)
      Ok, that's what it was. the details were fuzzy but it's one of those things they teach you in University as an example of not doing the right thing even if it costs you. Hey, at least they didn't pull a Volkswagon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksw...ssions_scandal I guess once we get to peek more under the hood we may find out yet is NVidia of AMD are adding software kludges in firmware/drivers to cripple user products. They did do that with Bitcoin mining didn't they? Shall we start taking bets?

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      • #33
        Originally posted by erniv2 View Post
        In other news! Aliexpress starts sellings 3080 RTX cards at bargin prices, turned out they where reflashed 2060s and crash when a game requires dlss2 ~~.
        Cui bono ?
        - a few enthusiasts
        - frauds as you point (would those let such a tool out ?)
        - technologically sanctioned countries, who will happily take any chance to uncap the restricted hardware they bought (full price?).
        - ?

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        • #34
          Originally posted by bug77 View Post

          Not entirely true. Nvidia had/has an interest in Nouveau: they need the video card to be boostrapped to the point it can display enough for the user to be able to grab the official drivers and install them. At least that was the story some years ago when I read it.

          I know that level of "support" is largely irrelevant, but there was at least dome level of interest from them.
          Heee ? ever heard about standards like VGA or VESA ? even the worst graphics card can boot to a vga console or a fbcon framebuffer x11 server.

          If not you would not even be able to see a post screen or enter the BIOS/UEFI, i dont realy know how it works but the new UEFI vBIOS is called GOP or something like that wich should also be a standard somewhere, and linux can grab it with the EFI simple framebuffer driver, there is no need for a hardware specific driver to boot a system, the driver is there to access special hardware accelerated features, wich in the case of nouveau fails cause it cant access the reclocking and or gpu shaders etc.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by kozman View Post
            How long do you wanna bet before NVidia gets this software and works to lock it out of 5000 series and later? I hear the sound of cash registers and eBay transactions off in the distance already.
            We won't have issues with 16xx+ since the new GSP will handle it.
            But if this can somehow clarify the path for the deadlocked era, we might rejoice the year of open source Nvidia and perhaps the year of wayland, sooner than otherwise (the other case of waiting them to get obsolete)
            But still, official company help FTW

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            • #36
              Originally posted by mirmirmir View Post
              It should be required by law for companies to release firmware source after a product is no longer supported
              Hear, hear.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by kozman View Post

                I will do you one better. It should be law that both the firmware and driver source for discontinued products be released either at EOL or after 10 years since the product was released. This will do more to keep abandoned products out of the landfill and give hobbyists and enthusiasts the right to keep a dead product alive if they so choose. Tack this law squarely onto the Right To Repair law in EVERY COUNTRY!
                It would also be necessary to put into those laws the requirements for those companies to release all necessary information and software tools for signing changed firmwares and/or a way to turn off firmware signature in the hardware.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by bug77 View Post

                  Not entirely true. Nvidia had/has an interest in Nouveau: they need the video card to be boostrapped to the point it can display enough for the user to be able to grab the official drivers and install them. At least that was the story some years ago when I read it.

                  I know that level of "support" is largely irrelevant, but there was at least dome level of interest from them.
                  From what I understand, they did/do some work on Nouveau to make sure it worked/works decently well on Tegra chips, as some of their Tegra customers demanded open-source drivers.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by kozman View Post

                    Ok, that's what it was. the details were fuzzy but it's one of those things they teach you in University as an example of not doing the right thing even if it costs you. Hey, at least they didn't pull a Volkswagon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksw...ssions_scandal I guess once we get to peek more under the hood we may find out yet is NVidia of AMD are adding software kludges in firmware/drivers to cripple user products. They did do that with Bitcoin mining didn't they? Shall we start taking bets?
                    Well, it would be stupid if they taught that, since that's not what Ford did...

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by justinkb View Post
                      Let's be honest, nouveau never was that good, even for GPUs which weren't locked down
                      Which is why any self-respecting FOSS enthusiast doesn't buy nvidia products. AMD or intel GPU's only please. Linus had the correct sign language.

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