Windows 10 vs. Linux 4.15 + Mesa 17.4-dev Radeon Gaming Performance

[pal666]

Question is, is this the fault of the drivers or badly ported games?

compare with linux blob opengl to find out

[pal666]

DX->OpenGL and DX->Vulkan are translation layers that always add inefficiencies.

this goes under "badly ported"

[pal666]

stick to nvidia they have way better drivers than whatever else is available for AMD cards.

mythology of nvidiots

[pal666]

for the end user in terms of consumer experience

desperate try at rationalizing stockholm syndrome

[papajo]

desperate try at rationalizing stockholm syndrome

You are just an amd fanboy who thinks that I am a nvidia fanboy because I dont praise AMD 24/7 even if they dont deserve it... https://i.snag.gy/lNInkO.jpg

[pal666]

I dont praise AMD 24/7

of course you are not, you are busy praising nvidia

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVpOyKCNZYw

[papajo]

of course you are not, you are busy praising nvidia
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVpOyKCNZYw

That's why I separated my post and talked about user experience. I know Nvidia are a bunch of corporate a****les and I am pro libre software and stuff but I have to admit that at least for the recent few years Nvidia gives a better consumer experience, maybe this also means that they give hell to linux devs etc but as a consumer of the the end result it is just better.

I really did not have anything else to do to my system when it used to have a nvidia card... other than when I installed ubuntu 15 I had to click a graphical window (update manager) and click on nvidia drivers instead of nouveau...

From that point on everything happened on its own on the background without me needing to mess around with anything else... I could even OC my card, I could set preferences via a graphical environment I could monitor temps I could have sound over HDMI and my performance was very close to windows and in somecases virtually identical.

My experience after upgrading to a RX 580 is very different in many levels... the only pro side is that now I see the ubuntu loading screen in my native resolution... and that's it. Everything else still is a pain in the ass.

And if you ignore all the practical issues (having to experiment with unstable kernels manually set and install stuff etc having to make compromises on functionality like AMD VCE and audio over HDMI) and check out the benchmarks even with other kernel versions and drivers etc a GTX 1060 is still faster than a RX 580 sometimes by a lot.. and that should not be true (if we were on windows) https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pa...80-linux&num=3

And judging from my system I can tell that most of those average FPS are "fake" because there is a lot of jitter even if the framerate is mostly above 60 FPS... things just are not smooth.

However I believe in opensource and hope that this will get resolved sometime in the near future, I am just disappointed not towards the opensource developers but towards AMD Inc because I believe that if nvidia can maintain such good closed drivers then the least AMD should do is to help the open source community to speed up their progress which apparently they dont since polaris architecture is like on its 3rd year now almost and basic functions still dont exist in the driver...

[VikingGe]

in E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G else nvidia drivers are better for the end user in terms of consumer experience (so ideology about free software etc aside)

Oh yeah, especially their display driver that never has any tearing/presentation issues, or their multi-monitor support that just works out of the box in every imaginable scenario. Right? /s

Honestly, if it wasn't for gaming, I'd have used my GTX 670 with Nouveau. When I did, it provided a more pleasant desktop experience.

You know how I got vulkan support for my RX 580? I [...] had to manually install the packs myself through the terminal...

Blame your distro for not shipping Vulkan drivers by default, it's part of mesa. Also, RADV seems to be doing pretty damn well nowadays as far as actual Linux games are concerned (not as much in Wolfenstein/Doom though).

Relive (AMD VCE ) is still not supported..

This certainly needs some love especially now that nvenc is enjoying at least some sort of software support, but you can use it with ffmpeg if you have the vaapi driver installed. It's arguably in a bad state though, and it doesn't help that software like OBS Studio basically goes "well nope" when it comes to providing at least an option for it.

You want sound over HDMI with your RX 580 ?? huh good joke... Nvidia had it since ever..

That's been (rightfully) criticized a lot and is about to change with the next kernel. If you don't need HDMI audio, you just ignore this point.

heck with nvidia drivers I can even just monitor my graphics card temps and fan speed on their graphical window I dont have to trust the terminal "sensors" command which always seems to show the same temp and fan speed while I hear different fan noises coming out of the box...

Not sure what issues you are having with sensors, works for me, and if I want to see the numbers in a nice GUI, I just use ksysguard. Even better, I can let my fan control daemon decide at what speed to run the GPU fans at because the driver exposes the hwmon interfaces properly. Nvidia's support for fan control was... rather minimal at best, and overclocking is terrible on both (AMD: please do something about it)

And the performance... OMG its sucks... Its bellow any standards... the benchmarks you see here are by installing many things manually custom (and unstable) kernels custom firmware etc

which isn't really necessary if your distro ships reasonably up-to-date packages. I consider Mesa 17.2 combined with LLVM 5.0 to be the first version to be truly competitive in terms of OpenGL performance, mostly because that's when mesa_glthread was introduced. Everything before that had some serious performance issues in some games, everything after that (aka latest mesa-git with llvm-git) doesn't really offer much of an improvement.

I literally score 70 FPS avg in the Tomb raider bench when the graphics are set on NORMAL 1080p...and its a 2013 game... on high graphics I have seen even 12 FPS for a big chunk of the game.. On the other hand with nvidia I had small differences compared to windows

I find it hard to believe that Nvidia magically makes this pretty terrible port run as fast as the native D3D11 version. Look at this, 12 FPS on a GTX 670 where the Windows version easily does 60, and even with lowest settings I barely got above 20. As much as I like Feral's recent-ish ports (which are at least playable even with my old CPU), they really messed up Tomb Raider.

[bridgman]

However I believe in opensource and hope that this will get resolved sometime in the near future, I am just disappointed not towards the opensource developers but towards AMD Inc because I believe that if nvidia can maintain such good closed drivers then the least AMD should do is to help the open source community to speed up their progress which apparently they dont since polaris architecture is like on its 3rd year now almost and basic functions still dont exist in the driver...

Couple of things:

1. AMD developers make up the bulk of the "open source community" working on AMD drivers. This has been the case for a number of years.

2. You may be confusing what is available in open source drivers with what is available upstream. Things like audio functionality have been publicly available from day one for Polaris in both AMDGPU-PRO packages and source code repos, but that same code was only just now accepted upstream.

[papajo]

Couple of things:

1. AMD developers make up the bulk of the "open source community" working on AMD drivers. This has been the case for a number of years.

2. You may be confusing what is available in open source drivers with what is available upstream. Things like audio functionality have been publicly available from day one for Polaris in both AMDGPU-PRO packages and source code repos, but that same code was only just now accepted upstream.

bottom-line is that with a current generation nvidia card I can use NVEC to stream my games with OBS I can have audio over HDMI and my FPS is close to the windows FPS with minimal to no jitter while AMD drivers are far from that for an architecture that is like atleast 2 years old.. its not that polaris just came out the factory...

I dont know why that is.. I just know that as an end consumer my experience is significantly worse on the linux side while the other company may have better windows experience too but has not neglected the linux side or if you dont like the word "neglect" then is better on making drivers for the linux side.