Almost A Decade Later, RadeonHD Stories Still Coming To Light

[libv]

I said right from the start that the plan we were following was worked out with Alex and Dave; you just didn't want to believe me and so later I suppose it might have seemed like a conspiracy to you. From my perspective I worked with Dave & Alex first and then we brought in SUSE (the opposite of your perspective, of course)... I had this crazy idea that everyone could just work together, but it was more difficult to keep everyone in agreement than I had ever imagined.

That's really the whole story.

You never communicated to us at SuSE, and you kept on telling that Alex was only doing the -ati work to give us documentation, for ages.

You also said last time that you had our preliminary proposal, before you went to talk to Dave. Are you retracting those statements now?

How many counterpoints do you want?

This is your smoking gun right here - AtomBIOS was part of our plan from the start. Not something we introduced later. Same for KMS as well, although we agreed it wasn't practical to start with KMS given the (as I discovered) limited state of AtomBIOS documentation and support.

AtomBIOS was never talked about, until you turned up out of nowhere, it is not what i signed up for, it was not what AMD signed up for when they signed SuSE.

As for KMS, KMS was nowhere in Q2 2007, it was a very early brainfart at best.

Get your timeline _and_ your facts straight, or retire already and live happily far away from humanity, but stop endlessly twisting things.

[libv]

I said right from the start that the plan we were following was worked out with Alex and Dave; you just didn't want to believe me and so later I suppose it might have seemed like a conspiracy to you. From my perspective I worked with Dave & Alex first and then we brought in SUSE (the opposite of your perspective, of course)... I had this crazy idea that everyone could just work together, but it was more difficult to keep everyone in agreement than I had ever imagined.

Let's turn this around. So now you are stating that you had a planned to work with redhat and alex from day one, and you worked towards that plan in motion at every possible junction. This proves me quite right when i sensed from the start you were not playing a straight game, but those instincts were dismissed, with this email that i just posted as the culmination, and the end.

And stop endlessly editing your post. This is part of the twisting game you always play.

[bridgman]

Stop lying, i know it is your trade, but stop it.

With respect, I could say the same. You are publishing what you remember, which is fair, but what you remember isn't necessarily the same as what happened. There were a lot of people involved, each with slightly different recollections of what happened.

Put them all together and you get "reality TV"

[libv]

With respect, I could say the same. You are publishing what you remember, which is fair, but what you remember isn't necessarily the same as what happened. There were a lot of people involved, each with slightly different recollections of what happened.

I published what i had written in July 2008, i clearly marked what i have changed. This email is the result of me painstakingly going through email traffic to filter out what i could prove. You know how exact and perceptive that exec is, and i was fully prepared to back my statements up with email communication.

[bridgman]

AtomBIOS was never talked about, until you turned up out of nowhere, it is not what i signed up for,

Yep, no argument there. I didn't understand until late 2007 or early 2008 (when I found your blog) what an unpleasant twist this would have been for you. I don't know exactly what I would have done differently if I had known your views & background from the start but I sure would have spent more time looking for disconnects and trying to resolve them.

it was not what AMD signed up for when they signed SuSE.

Hold on here, I was the one who did all the contract work to involve SUSE for the graphics work. I agree that AMD (the CPU side) probably were thinking about SUSE driving more of the technical direction when the first discussions happened.

As for KMS, KMS was nowhere in Q2 2007, it was a very early brainfart at best.

Yep, no argument there - I think Dave had been working on it a bit privately but there was no infrastructure and no adoption -- that didn't really come until later in 2008.

Get your timeline _and_ your facts straight, or retire already and live happily far away from humanity, but stop endlessly twisting things.

My timeline is solid - but you do like to word things to imply something different from what actually happened. Yes I was aware of your "early proposal" around the time I started working with Dave & Alex but as I have said multiple times there was not much detail in the copy I was given, just that SUSE would write a driver and it would be done in these stages. At that level of detail we all wanted the same thing. You called me a liar the last time I said that, so presumably you will do it again now.

[bridgman]

I published what i had written in July 2008, i clearly marked what i have changed. This email is the result of me painstakingly going through email traffic to filter out what i could prove. You know how exact and perceptive that exec is, and i was fully prepared to back my statements up with email communication.

Yep, I went through the same exercise with him as I have said before, although my notes were earlier in 2008 (Jan/Feb). The outcome of all that was our discovery that there had been two distinct plans, and that you had been told your plan was accepted and I had been told my plan was accepted after I presented it to Dirk and obtained funding.

You were told that you guys were in charge of technical direction and we were there to give you documentation; I was told that we were in charge of technical direction and were responsible for the project. I don't remember if you were on the call with (Sandy ?) when we discovered the disconnect re: which plan had been approved but I do remember it being a big shock and everyone thinking "crap, that explains a lot".

[darkbasic]

John, i can back it up with quite a few emails

Then please do, otherwise you will both keep pointing fingers toward the other forever.

[starshipeleven]

Then please do, otherwise you will both keep pointing fingers toward the other forever.

This, post proof or go home, really. Pointing fingers is only wasting everyone's time.

[dungeon]

Some people have strong memory and their POV of course, so it does not matter if something happened yesterday or 10 years ago . I guess lucky one are capable to forget what happened even today...

And luckiest one, pretend to does not even see that amdgpu-pro's driver has amdgpu dri driver and that it is really named like that... Instead of just saying "OK, you are right we spread confusion here by changing peoples mind for no reason" they will claim the opposite how i am the one who actually spread confusion by calling things how these are named ... so even with a obvious proof thing goes to no avail

Should we even try to discuss even a bit more complex matters with this kind of ignorance?

[alexThunder]

TL;DR?