Former AMD Developer: OpenGL Is Broken

[johnc]

That chart makes me so hopeful for Mesa in the next few years. Every other driver has some support cutoff and then a cliff, but Mesa has 40 - 80% support for every OpenGL version up to the latest.

...

huh?

[clementl]

That chart makes me so hopeful for Mesa in the next few years. Every other driver has some support cutoff and then a cliff, but Mesa has 40 - 80% support for every OpenGL version up to the latest.

I wonder wether you are reading the chart right. Mesa actually is the lowest common denominator. Nvidia's and AMD's OpenGL driver implementations are at a 100%, and even Intel's closed drivers are at almost a 100%. The only thing Mesa beats are the OS X drivers newer than OpenGL 4.1.

Mesa:
4.0 - 69%
4.1 - 50%
4.2 - 75%
4.3 - 52%
4.4 - 50%

[deanjo]

For a spec that's so "broken" it appears to work fine on all platforms with NVIDIA graphics cards. Maybe AMD just don't know howto implement OpenGL properly?

Lol, my thoughts exactly.

[deanjo]

When OS X 10.10 arrives you can expect OpenGL 4.5/5.0 to be system-wide.

Ummm, you are going to be disappointed if you think that, but you didn't hear that from me, seriously. ;D

and

OS X isn't `stuck' at 4.2. OS X 10.9 was updated to 4.2 system-wide. No other OS in the world has OpenGL throughout, as OS X.

Running 10.9.4

Core features
v3.0 (100 % - 23/23)
v3.1 (100 % - 8/8)
v3.2 (100 % - 10/10)
v3.3 (100 % - 10/10)
v4.0 (100 % - 14/14)
v4.1 (100 % - 7/7)
v4.2 (15 % - 2/13)
v4.3 (0 % - 0/23)
v4.4 (0 % - 0/10)

[deanjo]

I wonder wether you are reading the chart right. Mesa actually is the lowest common denominator. Nvidia's and AMD's OpenGL driver implementations are at a 100%, and even Intel's closed drivers are at almost a 100%. The only thing Mesa beats are the OS X drivers newer than OpenGL 4.1.

Mesa:
4.0 - 69%
4.1 - 50%
4.2 - 75%
4.3 - 52%
4.4 - 50%

Your info is outdated. I posted the current support up above.

Complete feature report from 10.9.4


Renderer: Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine
Vendor: Intel Inc.
Memory: 1024 MB
Version: 4.1 INTEL-8.28.29
Device: Macmini6,2
Shading language version: 4.10


Max texture size: 16384 x 16384
Max vertex texture image units: 16
Max texture image units: 16
Max geometry texture units: 16
Max anisotropic filtering value: 16
Max viewport size: 16384 x 16384
Max Viewports: 16
Max Clip Distances: 8
Max samples: 8


Extensions: 44

GL_APPLE_client_storage
GL_APPLE_container_obj ect_shareable
GL_APPLE_flush_render
GL_APPLE_objec t_purgeable
GL_APPLE_rgb_422
GL_APPLE_row_bytes
GL _APPLE_texture_range
GL_ARB_blend_func_extended
GL _ARB_draw_buffers_blend
GL_ARB_draw_indirect
GL_AR B_ES2_compatibility
GL_ARB_explicit_attrib_locatio n
GL_ARB_gpu_shader5
GL_ARB_gpu_shader_fp64
GL_ARB _instanced_arrays
GL_ARB_internalformat_query
GL_A RB_occlusion_query2
GL_ARB_sample_shading
GL_ARB_s ampler_objects
GL_ARB_separate_shader_objects
GL_A RB_shader_bit_encoding
GL_ARB_shader_subroutine
GL _ARB_shading_language_include
GL_ARB_tessellation_ shader
GL_ARB_texture_buffer_object_rgb32
GL_ARB_t exture_cube_map_array
GL_ARB_texture_gather
GL_ARB _texture_query_lod
GL_ARB_texture_rgb10_a2ui
GL_AR B_texture_storage
GL_ARB_texture_swizzle
GL_ARB_ti mer_query
GL_ARB_transform_feedback2
GL_ARB_transf orm_feedback3
GL_ARB_vertex_attrib_64bit
GL_ARB_ve rtex_type_2_10_10_10_rev
GL_ARB_viewport_array
GL_ ATI_texture_mirror_once
GL_EXT_debug_label
GL_EXT_ debug_marker
GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc
GL_EX T_texture_filter_anisotropic
GL_EXT_texture_sRGB_d ecode
GL_NV_texture_barrier

Core features
v3.0 (100 % - 23/23)
v3.1 (100 % - 8/8)
v3.2 (100 % - 10/10)
v3.3 (100 % - 10/10)
v4.0 (100 % - 14/14)
v4.1 (100 % - 7/7)
v4.2 (15 % - 2/13)
v4.3 (0 % - 0/23)
v4.4 (0 % - 0/10)

OpenGL driver version check (Current: 4.1 INTEL-8.28.29, Latest known: 2.1 INTEL-8.28.29):
Latest version of display drivers found
According the database, you are running the latest display drivers for your video card.

Extension verification: 
GL_APPLE_aux_depth_stencil has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_client_storage has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_element_array has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_fence has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_float_pixels has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_flush_buffer_range has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_flush_render has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_object_purgeable has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_packed_pixels has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_pixel_buffer has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_rgb_422 has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_row_bytes has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_specular_vector has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_texture_range has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_transform_hint has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_vertex_array_object has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_vertex_array_range has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_vertex_point_size has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_vertex_program_evaluators has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_APPLE_ycbcr_422 has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_ARB_color_buffer_float has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_ARB_depth_buffer_float has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_ARB_depth_clamp has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 
GL_ARB_depth_texture has been added to the extensions list of Intel HD Graphics 4000 OpenGL Engine 


[grndzro]

Holy crap, so all the stuff they have been presenting at GDC to "approach zero driver overhead" only really works on nvidia hardware.

AMD is working on their own implementation of these features.

[clementl]

Your info is outdated. I posted the current support up above.

Complete feature report from 10.9.4

So, in meanwhile they implemented 1 Opengl 4.1 extension...

[anda_skoa]

Tunnel vision

If Kronos and the OpenGL platform holders wish to become serious competitors in the high-end gaming space

Sometimes one just has to envy the ignorant for their simplified reality in their tunnel vision world

As if "gaming space" was the only application for 3D rendering. Almost as naive as people thinking of a couple of multi core CPUs when hearing High Performance Computing.

Anyway I had to laugh at this one:

OpenGL is inferior to its competitors

As if there were any competitors that come even close to the wide range of applications across the required spectrum of hardware and software platforms.
Most so-called competitors are usually highly restricted on what one can use them for, on what operating system, device type or architecture they can be deployed on, etc.

It's like calling post stamps a competitor to an actual currency ;-)

Cheers,
_

[deanjo]

So, in meanwhile they implemented 1 Opengl 4.1 extension...

Do you not get what an extension is and what a core feature is?

[clementl]

Do you not get what an extension is and what a core feature is?

Yes, I know. I meant function. The difference between what you report and the pdf I linked is that they implemented ARB_get_program_binary. Other than that they're identical.