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AMD Radeon Navi 2 / VCN 3.0 Supports AV1 Video Decoding

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  • #31
    Originally posted by cjcox View Post
    IMHO, we need the industry as a whole to move away from patent encumbered codecs. We need to stop having to rely on the "promise not to sue".
    That's just not how this works. Even if somehow everyone who develops video coding techniques vowed not to file patents, the state of the art would still be encumbered for 15-20 years.

    The promise not to sue is actually the best outcome, as long as software patents are enforceable.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by microcode View Post

      That's just not how this works. Even if somehow everyone who develops video coding techniques vowed not to file patents, the state of the art would still be encumbered for 15-20 years.

      The promise not to sue is actually the best outcome, as long as software patents are enforceable.
      What a hopeless world. I hope you are very very very wrong. It's like saying at least COVID-19 might end us if we're lucky.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by cjcox View Post

        What a hopeless world. I hope you are very very very wrong. It's like saying at least COVID-19 might end us if we're lucky.
        That a patent has been filed for is actually good - it means no one else can patent the same thing. A promise not to sue is pretty binding if it is writing. There is also the possibility of filing for a patent and not paying to receive it, and I think you can return it at various points to the patent office, but then AOM wouldn't have a good defence against (or receive sweet protection money from) the MPEGLA mafia.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Danny3 View Post
          In any case, the GPUs should have the hardware decoding capability that will apply to any OS.
          The driver might or might not work on Win7 though, with it being EOL I would be surprised if modern AMD drivers still support it.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Danny3 View Post
            That's good, but there are a lot of questions still remain about this:
            Which is the maximum supported resolution (2K / 4K / 8K) ?
            Which is the maximum supported frame rate (30 / 60 / 120 FPS) ?
            Which is the maximum supported bit depth ( 8 / 10 / 12 bit) ?
            Hopefully AMD will come with clear answers to these questions and it would be great if they give it for other codecs too like AVC and HEVC.
            If i understand it correctly does mean AV1 hardware support that it will support at least the 'Main Profile'
            From Wikipedia
            "The Main profile allows for a bit depth of 8- or 10-bits per sample with 4:0:0 (greyscale) and 4:2:0 chroma sampling"

            While vp9 as example did you need Hardware that had 'profile 2' for 10bit (and with that to watch HDR on Youtube.
            Well i think for the rest of the information will you need to wait for a leak or till the presentation at 28.October

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            • #36
              Originally posted by rene View Post
              some phorum expert recently told me here video codecs are all mostly the same and this is "just a little mit of microcode", ... lol ;-) https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...e3#post1204575
              that's not what he said, you little weasel

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              • #37
                Originally posted by AmericanLocomotive View Post
                Hardware development starts about ~3 years before the release. So any chip released today, started development 2017. Then it's usually about a year from when the very first prototype chip rolls off the line to an actual production-ready product. Once that initial prototype chip is "taped out", the design is basically not changing. Then before you get that first tape-out product, you have months and months of simulation and design verification. Any change to the chip or architecture means more months of testing and verification. With the AV1 spec being locked in only 18 months ago, it's honestly pretty impressive we already have decoders in products as complicated as dedicated GPUs. It basically means they were building hardware with an incomplete spec that could change. Very risky move.
                Or that they moved enough of the decoding logic to firmware/microcode.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by OneTimeShot View Post
                  That a patent has been filed for is actually good - it means no one else can patent the same thing.
                  you can't patent things already in use.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
                    that's not what he said, you little weasel
                    ... Not ..?

                    Most of the raw pixel graphics processing parts (transforms/filters/motion compensation) are the same between codecs. The big differences are in the protocol encoding/decoding algorithms which is done with a programmable coprocessor.

                    As long as a codec doesn't add new graphics transforms you can use the same hardware. So (e.g.) MPEG-2 is just a firmware program using hardware that supports h264. AV1 and VVC will actually share a lot of hardware - the pixel stuff has been out of patent for a while now.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post

                      "Then what" is kind of a chicken and an egg problem. The problem lies more in the lack of supported consumer devices in regards to both HEVC and AV1. Aside from my PC and maybe my phone, nothing I own actually supports either...but it all supports x264 so regardless of how good other things are, better the devil you know...you know. If the next-gen game consoles don't support them, no one else mainstream will either for the next few years. Game consoles are one of the most used end-user devices to watch videos on outside of PCs and phones so what they support drives a lot of what the rest of the market will support and run with.

                      Until we see more HEVC or AV1 consumer devices we won't see more HEVC or AV1 support in other areas like PC software and hardware...or the other way around depending on what day of the week it is.
                      Right, that's why I hoped for a faster adoption of AV1 as it seemed to have more industry weight and legal clarity behind it. Decode support in hardware is a start but without encode support it will take longer in the consumer space to make any impact. Widespread decode support would allow the streaming platforms to use it more widely though. But with the current insane pricing levels of graphics cards even that is going to take a while as the market penetration is rather slow when looking at the average user... maybe if the next APUs from Intel and AMD will support it, market penetration will accelerate a bit.

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