NVIDIA 510.39.01 Linux Beta Brings Vulkan Dynamic Rendering, AV1 VDPAU Decode & More

[MetalGearDaner]

AV1 over VDPAU…. Means Firefox acceleration?

No, it does not. Firefox can only handle VA-API since version 80, but not VDPAU nor NVENC/NVDEC. Unfortunately this addition to their VDPAU driver is almost useless... VDPAU is a dead API, primarily because NVIDIA just abandoned it in favor of their propietary NVENC/NVDEC, it's not supported on Wayland, and also because the VA-API-over-VDPAU driver is no longer being actively developed [1].

Nevertheless, there's an interesting new project of implementing VA-API with NVDEC backend you should check out [2]. It is still in early development, but has a lot of potential!

Anyway, looking forward to the new Vulkan Video API becoming (hopefully) the mainstream in the future [3].

[1] https://forums.developer.nvidia.com/...pi-nvdec/61031
[2] https://github.com/elFarto/nvidia-vaapi-driver
[3] https://www.khronos.org/blog/an-intr...o-vulkan-video

[WizardGed]

I don't know a single person IRL who started using Linux and was happy because of their choice. Most do it out of pure necessity. Not a single one of them chose Linux because "it means privacy", or "more control over your software" or "open source". That's nonsense for the gullible.

You just met one. since 1998. once again with the personal attacks.

Where did I attack the guy? Quotes would be great. Oh, wait, none will be given. You're probably person N55 here who throws baseless accusations against me. Too bad the previous 50 or so have had zero contributions to Open Source. Most of you come here, start waging war against me because you feel righteous and then disappear (to go back to Windows/MacOS).

"This all looks quite pathetic to be completely honest."

Yeah referring to what he has found or done as "pathetic" definitely isn't a personal attack. As to your contributions I am fully aware of them. Good for you, any contribution is a net positive. That adds nothing to the discussion at hand other then you attempting to insinuate your patches somehow gives your arguments any more veracity or meaning. Oh boy this time a back handed insult, really proving my point here.

What precise reasons may I ask? According to the post "AMD hands down gives you a perfect experience under Linux while NVIDIA is nothing but bugs and troubles".

That line you have quoted is not said anywhere in his post and he even outlines some positive things he's found with the driver.

It's astonishing how you misread and misinterpreted every word I said. Sorry to say it, but I will abstain from seeing your comments ever again. I prefer to deal with people who don't make up baseless accusations, twist everything I say and even attribute the things I've never implied.

I haven't and I have responded with everything you've asked but you do as you wish. I've also done it without adding insults or throwing out my opinion or throwing down credentials in some way to try and add credence to my argument.

Let me end my comment with a couple of wonderful things you desperately wanna hear:

NVIDIA is a crap company, makes crap GPUs, it does everything to destroy Linux and its products are unusable on Linux.
AMD is a second coming of Christ and the best friend of Linux.
Linux has all the features and it has no bugs. If it has bugs they are only because of crap companies.

Hope you're happy.

I really don't care what your opinions on some tech company or what you have to say on them. nothing personal but most tech companies either don't affect me or are just part of the net negative effect tech seems to be having on our social lives. As to the kernel it does what I need it to do without much fuss in my job and at home.

what I wish is that your exploding on anyone that has an opinion on some faceless company that could care less if any person here was wiped off the planet would be toned down but I suspect I'm the fool for thinking that engaging you might work.

[pmorph]

I don't know a single person IRL who started using Linux and was happy because of their choice. Most do it out of pure necessity.

You could be right. I for example had to leave windows because it was getting really bad for my hypertension.

[bple2137]

the question is always the same: how can i get regular updates for ubuntu? like if i wanted to install this how would i go about doing it in a few minutes like on windows?

You can't unless you know how to build a package (and Debian packaging system is terrifying) or somebody does that for you in form of PPA. I cannot think of other method than installing it directly executing the run file, which isn't really what you should do, especially with beta driver. Or maybe I'm wrong and Ubuntu now ships more versions including beta?

You better prepare system snapshot with Timeshift or something.

Btw it's trivial on Arch and still easy if there was no up-to-date build in the official repo.

[bple2137]

I'm running XFCE without compositing under Fedora if that matters.

It does actually. Compositing on NVIDIA on Xorg sucks, but for most actually useful things it's managable I aggree. I just got used to a bit smoother UI. It feels like I would use a decade old PC that's horribly bloated.

How would NVIDIA fix bugs? I don't know, they could possibly ask other vendors how to get drivers working on Linux.

Sure, I will check what's crashing and report bugs if they remain for some time. Although nvidia's developer forums doesn't seem quite encouraging to be honest. I remember reporting Intel bug (laptop screen flickering) on Kernel's Bugzilla and it was enough to send dmesg so that some Intel employee could make a +2 -1 patch in a day. Tested, confirmed, mainlined very quickly. Maybe I was just lucky and it's just my case being trivial, but I generally never felt any reason to report Intel bugs and I used plenty of HD graphics laptops.

Seems like 1 year old GPU is too new to have good driver support

[Lbibass]

Depends on scene. Sometimes DLSS performs better; sometimes FSR performs better.



Redacted

In addition, DLSS is less blurry than FSR in almost every case. DLSS is better than FSR when it comes to image quality for most cases. It's just a matter of integrating it into games that makes it problematic. And that you have to own an Nvidia GPU. Looking forward to Intel's XeSS when that launches, as it should be possible to use that on every GPU. And I'd expect to have that be well supported in Linux as well, given their previous history.

I don't like Nvidia. But, they do things that most other companies don't. And I do have to give them some modicum of respect for that.

[Myownfriend]

Screen capture with OBS no longer works
It worked before with the Flatpak version of OBS. It was slow, though.

Flatpak OpenGL hardware acceleration in Wayland on Nvidia may have never worked. It apparently has something to do with the Freedesktop SDK.

https://gitlab.com/freedesktop-sdk/freedesktop-sdk/-/issues/1341

Though somebody pointed out that it seems to be working with these drivers.

On top of that, the PRs that allow OBS to run on Nvidia's drivers are part of the unreleased OBS 27.2.

I'm really hoping the Fedora 35 packages for this driver shows up on RPM Fusion soon.

[gardotd426]

Let's sum nvidia up:

- blurry DLSS that sometimes loses to generic FSR when comes to performance,
- thievingly expensive,
- binary blob POS out of kernel drivers,
- the most annoying and brainwashed fanboys

LMAO What?

Before the "fanboy" accusation gets thrown my way, let's list the AMD parts I've purchased in just the past 2.5 years alone:

- Ryzen 3 3200G
- RX 580
- Ryzen 5 2600X
- RX 5600 XT
- Ryzen 5 3600X
- RX 5700 XT
- Ryzen 7 3800X
- Ryzen 7 5800X
- Ryzen 9 5900X

Let's list the number of Nvidia products I've purchased in my entire life:
- Nvidia RTX 3090

And that's it.

So let's see:

- blurry DLSS that sometimes loses to generic FSR when comes to performance,

That's objectively false. Not only has it been looked into by respected reviewers like Hardware Unboxed and the like, but I've taken screenshots comparing DLSS and FSR (since Nvidia cards can use both, so even if it were true that DLSS lost to FSR, it wouldn't matter), and DLSS wins every single time, and the performance improvement is objectively larger with DLSS. Running a game at 1440p with DLSS scaling it up from like 900p gives a better-looking image than FSR scaling it up from 1080p.

Plus again, Nvidia GPUs can use FSR too. And anyone that knows anything about GPU architectures would know that of *course* DLSS gives a better performance improvement than FSR, since DLSS uses dedicated hardware (tensor cores), while AMD has no dedicated hardware for FSR.

FSR isn't even a competitor to DLSS. It's a competitor to NIS, which can be enabled in ALL GAMES, not just Windows games running in Proton/Wine that use a third-party unofficial fork (since FSR has not been upstreamed in neither Proton NOR Wine, and actually the MR to add it to Proton is now closed, and so official FSR will only ever be able to work in Wayland in the future, because they're moving to a gamescope-based solution).

- thievingly expensive

Um, what? That's true for both AMD *and* Nvidia GPUs. Dude RX 580s are selling USED for more than their original launch MSRP from 2017.

RDNA 2 GPUs are going for DOUBLE their MSRP, just like Nvidia GPUs are. The 6800 XT is supposed to sell for $649 US, it's on sale at Best Buy for $1319.

The fact that you're calling Nvidia "thievingly expensive" when AMD is going through the EXACT same "MSRP is meaningless and GPUs go for double MSRP" as Nvidia is right now. And before the GPU apocalypse, the RTX 3080 was the best value GPU released in GENERATIONS. Like, your hypocritical and blatantly false statements prove who the actual fanboy is.

- the most annoying and brainwashed fanboys

See above.

[gardotd426]

When I was using AMD, no matter what kind of session, it was stable. I've never seen Mutter going down on Wayland, and I was using it daily for 8 months. Crash recovery would be a good thing to have just in case something goes wrong.

Was it a good idea to buy a NVIDIA GPU?
No. It sucks. I didn't touch any NVIDIA hardware for a decade after I ditched my old PC around 2012. Once I helped a friend to get PRIME going on his laptop and it wasn't pleasant experience. The support for NVIDIA hardware is worse than it remember it back in 2007. It was problematic to install, but it was running fine when configured properly. Now it's easy to install, but the experience with GNOME or KDE Plasma is just terrible. So NVIDIA...

Literally the opposite experience. I ONLY every bought AMD GPUs since I've moved to Linux, because of all the propaganda. I ran Vega, Polaris, and two different RDNA 1 GPUS (5600 XT and 5700 XT). I had literally DAILY(actually multiple times a day) driver crashes that forced a hard reset. Found an issue thread on the `amdgpu` kernel driver gitlab issue tracker with literally hundreds of people reporting the issue (which means it must have affected thousands, since only a small percentage actually report these issues to GitLab issue trackers). Over 2.5 years after launch of RDNA 1, the issue is still not fixed. There have only been a handful of comments from any AMD kernel driver devs, all of which have been useless. And the issue remains open.

What's worse, is that there are dozens of other open issues that are either the same bug or a different bug that causes the same symptoms (a full driver crash forcing a hard system reset by holding down the power button, with ring gfx timeout error messages in the journal logs). Affecting several generations. Vega, Polaris, RDNA1, and RDNA2. And yet no action from AMD. There's one issue with this poor lone soul posting the bug report and it was over a YEAR ago, and not a single reply has come since. Not a single AMD dev has even bothered replying to him.

And I'm not exaggerating, there are dozens of these issues, affecting countless GPUs (both integrated and discrete, across several generations), and not a single one of them has been closed.

It was this bullshit right here that caused me to decide I was going with Nvidia this generation, because I knew even 4-5 months before launch (and I stated this publicly on r/Nvidia) that AMD would match Ampere with RDNA 2 (in rasterization). I got called an AMD fanboy, but I was exactly right. I wasn't guessing, I knew already. But I STILL decided to go with Nvidia because of the fact that my AMD system was literally unusable because of the stability issues, and AMD's kernel devs had zero interest in fixing any of the issues (on a side note, if the bug is in Mesa, you're probably in luck because the RADV guys are fantastic about bug reports, but AMD has literally nothing to do with RADV and make zero commits to it).

I also knew that getting a GPU was going to be near impossible, and my 5700 XT even ASIDE from the stability issues was not able to keep up with my 2 1440p 165Hz monitors in games (no I wasn't trying to run across both monitors, just mentioning that I have 2 because it's important later). And this was even BEFORE the mining boom and the GPU apocalypse we are still in.

So I tried to get a 3080 on launch morning, hitting F5 on every site imaginable trying to get a card, any model. It was a bloodbath. So the next week, 36 hours before the 3090 launched, I drove 3 hours to my hometown of Cincinnati to camp out at Micro Center. There were already 3 people in line. An hour after I arrived, there were 30, so thank god I got there when I did. Because they got 10 cards. 4 ASUS TUF and 6 EVGA XC3 Ultra. I got the EVGA XC3 Ultra.

I had the GPU installed in my system by 930 AM on the morning of the launch. Now with AMD, even getting a GUI in this situation would require making sure to grab the latest RC kernel (IF it has support), grabbing the latest linux-firmware files from the git repo, and running the latest development version of Mesa, and even then you will be missing things like DPM control, overclocking, NGG, etc.

But not here. There was already a driver release with full support for the 3090 before I got home, I installed the card and the drivers, and I have not had a **single** driver or GPU-related crash yet, in like 16 months. At all.

Running KWin with my two 1440p 165Hz monitors feels infinitely smoother than with AMD. I have zero issues. Game performance is fantastic, and has improved by leaps and bounds in the last year (in Windows games using DXVK and vkd3d-proton). Vulkan games like Doom Eternal using Ray Tracing and DLSS at Ultra Nightmare running at 200 fps at 1440p is something to behold. The experience has been night and day.

Also, I've not had a single bug on the level of the bugs I experienced with AMD (which compromised basic stability), but even the little papercut bugs I HAVE had, I've *always* gotten a response from Nvidia when using either the [email protected] email or using the Linux section of their forums.

There are downsides to Nvidia, and there are downsides to AMD. You talk about "never again" with Nvidia and how awful it is, meanwhile I've had the opposite experience (only I would buy AMD again because I'm not a fanboy), and not only that, but I have spoken to several people who have had the same experience I have, who bought into the propaganda, only ever bought AMD, but had such horrible experiences (and it wasn't hardware, it persisted across several RMAs and even different models from different AIBs), they moved to Nvidia, and haven't had any of those same issues.

Nvidia and AMD both treat Linux as second-class citizens. But AMD's kernel driver team is absolutely shameful in how little they do to respond to bugs. I still recommend AMD GPUs to people, regularly, but I'm not going to hide the issues I've had, or that thousands of others have had.

[Cybmax]

You can't unless you know how to build a package (and Debian packaging system is terrifying) or somebody does that for you in form of PPA. I cannot think of other method than installing it directly executing the run file, which isn't really what you should do, especially with beta driver. Or maybe I'm wrong and Ubuntu now ships more versions including beta?

You better prepare system snapshot with Timeshift or something.

Btw it's trivial on Arch and still easy if there was no up-to-date build in the official repo.

Using the .run package works just fine on Ubuntu if you are not horribly daunted by using manual commands... Easy as windows? Nope.. But i tend to test whatever nVidia driver they got due to hacking around with various Wine/DXVK/vkd3d stuff all the time.

I only use the .run driver these days, and what i do is somewhat cumbersome, but very reliable.
sudo dkms remove nvidia/495.46 -k all
sudo update-initramfs -k all -u
reboot to safe mode -> Choose "Networking" (to mount filesystems) -> choose root
I prefer to install the driver using my own user, so
su - username
sudo ./NVIDIA-xxxxx.run
Answer "YES" if you want to use DKMS, and YES to 32-bit libraries - NO to generating xorg.
After the setup is done, you can install driver for other kernels if you are using it - eg. sudo dkms autoinstall -k 5.11.xxx (or whatever)
Finish up by running
sudo update-initramfs -k all -u

reboot

Easy? Nah.. probably not, but i have done it so many times so i am not scared. Can you mess stuff up and never see your desktop again? Sure.. Comparable to the "windows experience"? Well.. depends if you are running DDU cleaner from safemode and whatnot (which you kinda need to do especially if you are downgrading)..

Things are usually not easy until you have done it a few times. Building software with Ubuntu Launchpad is not overly hard either.. Loads of templates usable for making your own backports there, but most things seems very hard until you have done it a few times.