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AMD Announces Automotive-Grade Ryzen Embedded V2000A Series

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  • skeevy420
    replied
    Originally posted by peggyramos
    What notable features does AMD's recently announced Automotive-Grade Ryzen Embedded V2000A Series offer, and how do these advancements impact the automotive industry?
    Not a whole lot other than the industry certification, 10 years support time, and being based on both Zen 2 and Vega. It's the next tier up with AI that's more interesting, but the V2000A is good enough for them to develop all their Not-AI systems on and the architectures are close enough that they can copy/paste the infotainment code from the old to the new whenever they get their self-driving stuff figured out.

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  • skeevy420
    replied
    Originally posted by Jabberwocky View Post

    I'm guessing they had less time, less developers and a smaller budget than the PS4 team.

    The major costs:
    1. The final system production cost. I'm guessing the ryzen-embedded-v2000 system cost less than a traditional gaming console
    2. Developing and maintaining the ARM software stack while AMD64 has better support out of the box
    3. Additional testing and regulation due to it being "Automotive-Grade"
    The biggest cost IMO is time due to the demand for this specific feature-set.

    I personally wouldn't feel comfortable to use a OOO CPU that manages any part of my car. If it's only used for entertainment then I guess it's ok.

    I'm sure they will move to ARM, RISC-V, or like you suggested a hybrid ISA. Perhaps even AMD64 (without x86). I would be surprised if they continue using Ryzen Embedded by itself.
    I was just trying to say that AMD could mix ARM and x86 in an industrial grade product if they wanted to since they have a decade of experience in the area. That would allow them to put the mission and energy critical components on in-order ARM cores and non-critical, supplemental infotainment on OOO x86 cores.

    AMD releasing that kind of hardware to the general public is damn near useless outside of them trying to get free software development out of the community. I just mean that neither an open source OS nor a general purpose closed OS exists that is designed to schedule tasks between different CPU architectures and not sub-arches like big.LITTLE, Zen4/4C, or E/P cores so nothing would be able to fully utilize it until software catches up with. Does anything even ship with both ARM and x86 binaries? I can't think of anything outside of the PS4 hypervisor and that's useless for the hypothetical hardware I'm discussing.

    IMHO, Apple devices show that there's a need and want for this. Mixed architectures means that we'd get the in-order benefits of ARM while being able to hang onto the legacy cruft of x86. One of those "best of both worlds", "have your cake and eat it, too" situations. It makes me wonder if a dual ARM/X3D would be faster than ARM/Translator and if AMD has done feasibility studies into going that route.

    I still don't get that cake phrase since the whole point of having cake is to eat it. Am I not supposed to eat cake? If that's the case, what am I supposed to do with cake? I feel like the only honesty around cake is that the cake is a lie.

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  • Jabberwocky
    replied
    Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post

    The PS4 hypervisor is ARM, too. PS4 uses both ARM and x86. No reason a car couldn't utilize ARM for some low level stuff and fire up the x86 cores when the car is actually in use and needs to be able to play a video game.
    I'm guessing they had less time, less developers and a smaller budget than the PS4 team.

    The major costs:
    1. The final system production cost. I'm guessing the ryzen-embedded-v2000 system cost less than a traditional gaming console
    2. Developing and maintaining the ARM software stack while AMD64 has better support out of the box
    3. Additional testing and regulation due to it being "Automotive-Grade"
    The biggest cost IMO is time due to the demand for this specific feature-set.

    I personally wouldn't feel comfortable to use a OOO CPU that manages any part of my car. If it's only used for entertainment then I guess it's ok.

    I'm sure they will move to ARM, RISC-V, or like you suggested a hybrid ISA. Perhaps even AMD64 (without x86). I would be surprised if they continue using Ryzen Embedded by itself.

    Leave a comment:


  • Weasel
    replied
    Originally posted by uid313 View Post
    Mobile devices are pretty much exclusively ARM, and it looks like ARM is going to increasingly appear in servers and data centers, and in 2024 it is expected that ARM will do an entrance to PC laptops and maybe desktops with the Snapdragon Elite.
    So it looks like x86 is gradually fading and getting more challenged.

    Cars doesn't sound like something that has legacy x86 requirements so I think it would make more sense to use ARM or RISC-V in a car.

    I wonder if AMD is planning any ARM or RISC-V CPU. Is it just a matter of time?
    Do you not get tired being this delusional all the time?

    Leave a comment:


  • timofonic
    replied
    Originally posted by gentoofu View Post

    Yeah, but price. They don't want to fight for 6nm allocation while 7nm node machines are freely available and can be had for much less. Also, I think Synopsys just released auto-grade design rule guidelines for LPDDR5X/5, PCIe 5.0, and etc. back in September for AMD to be able to use. We might see another 2-3 years for AMD to get certification on functional safety and verification for reliability standards.
    Certification bureaucracy sucks, it should be made to the base product and concentrate at very software supported processing capabilities at most efficiency. This way, there will be a more universally robust product. I hate this capitalistic market segmentation, it makes innovation worse and not cheaper products for everyone.

    Synopsys is Godzilla and Cadence is Ghidorah, I don't trust them at all. Both are hardcore proprietary vendors with very vendor lock-in and tons of countless nasty monopolistic crap, fsck them. I really hope KiCad and such becomes bigger and better someday to be able compete with EDA moguls in all areas under a big common and strong EDA umbrella project.

    Leave a comment:


  • caligula
    replied
    The next thing we need is a Windows based smart car. I can't wait to drive a car that requires 30 mins to complete weekly updates.

    Leave a comment:


  • abott
    replied
    Another thing about this stuff, it's CHEAP. That certification is profit on top of stuff they already have, so of course they're gonna do it and it's not gonna be Zen 3+. Proven, extended margins, it's just a no brainer.

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  • AmericanLocomotive
    replied
    Oh look. AMD just released another new Vega part after they already have started discontinuing driver support for it.

    Phoronix, Linux Hardware Reviews, Linux hardware benchmarks, Linux server benchmarks, Linux benchmarking, Desktop Linux, Linux performance, Open Source graphics, Linux How To, Ubuntu benchmarks, Ubuntu hardware, Phoronix Test Suite

    Leave a comment:


  • mihau
    replied
    you've heard of skylake+++++, now get ready for renoir+++++

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  • gentoofu
    replied
    Originally posted by schmidtbag View Post
    That makes sense, but wouldn't Zen4c potentially have fewer transistors per core while having instructions that the automotive industry may take advantage of? I know it has a lot more per CCD but it also has more cores per CCD.
    Yeah, but price. They don't want to fight for 6nm allocation while 7nm node machines are freely available and can be had for much less. Also, I think Synopsys just released auto-grade design rule guidelines for LPDDR5X/5, PCIe 5.0, and etc. back in September for AMD to be able to use. We might see another 2-3 years for AMD to get certification on functional safety and verification for reliability standards.

    Leave a comment:

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