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Linux 6.0 Merges The AMD Performance Fix For The Old "Dummy Wait" Workaround

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  • #21
    Originally posted by HD7950 View Post
    After this patch i have a lot of slowdowns on Yuzu that I didn't have before.

    amd-pstate + schedutil + 5950x
    Switch over to the performance governor and witness how your problem magically disappears...

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    • #22
      Originally posted by dragorth View Post

      This could mean Yuzu's dev was working around this somehow, even if they didn't know they were, and the fix broke that. It could also be Yuzu is sensitive to these types of changes, which is quite probable due to the nature of emulation.
      No, it simply means that schedutil sucks, as it always has since its inception!

      (And will probably remain that way for all eternity, considering that nobody is interested in working on it anymore...)

      Comment


      • #23
        Originally posted by HD7950 View Post
        After this patch i have a lot of slowdowns on Yuzu that I didn't have before.

        amd-pstate + schedutil + 5950x
        Can you reliably isolate the source of the problem to this patch? If this is a real issue, you should report it before the patch get released.

        Comment


        • #24
          Originally posted by andrebrait View Post
          Wait, what about the old AMD systems with VIA chipsets that were supposedly affected?
          I assume that was just a guess and the real issue was actually on Intel systems. If we hear about core affecting only AMD, it is naturally to assume it was written for AMD systems, but if that assumption is wrong, the guess could have been wrong too.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by andrebrait View Post

            I have no idea what I'm talking about? That's a bold claim.

            You forget 3rd world countries exist, I see?

            Speaking as someone who lived in one for 30 years, yes, some people are still rocking 2002 era hardware. Athlon XPs or Durons aren't that uncommon. Heck, even K6-IIs and Pentium II/III/Celerons aren't that hard to find, still working.

            Yeah, they're slow as fuck and take upwards of a minute to open a web page, but that doesn't mean *no one* is using them and most certainly it doesn't mean they're useless.

            So what if a Raspberry Pi can outperform them? The best computer is the one you already have and can afford. A Raspberry Pi 4B starter kit costs over half a monthly minimum wage over there, after taxes (which are high as hell).

            And no one here said anything about preventing progress of modern computers. What I questioned would be an additional if statement, at most.
            Half a monthly income is not that much for a new PC, that's definitely still affordable.

            And that's like you said at minimum wage and it would be a single person, but two person household and even more are much more common in third world countries, so it would be only 25% of monthly houselhold income for a 2 person household. Very affordable.
            You are definitely ignoring that saving money exist and that you use the PC for at least 5 years. So saving 10% of your income for 5 month or 5% for 10 month is not as unreasonable as you make it out to be. And that's again for a single person household at minimum wage and not being able to sell their old PC to finance some of the price.

            You are also ignoring that you could still run an older Linux kernel and still a new software stack, even Linux 2.x should already support your hardware flawlessly, just wanting to run the newest kernel "because I want to" is ridiculous. But even then as of right now you could use Linux 5.10 up to December 2026. As well as all the other potential hardware you could upgrade to.
            Even on the raspberry pi side of things, like a PI zero or Raspberry Pi 3.

            Quite honestly this complain is just not justified.

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            • #26
              I have a number of health problems, and because of this I live on Social Security Disability. I cannot work. My annual income is just over 10k USD. So please do not make me want to insult you for claiming everyone can afford X. Things are not so simple in the real world. If I could work, even at minimum wage and only working part time I would make more money. And others have it even worse than I do.

              Now lets focus on the actual topic and leave the "you can afford whatever I say because I am special" where it belongs. Thanks.

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by carewolf View Post

                I assume that was just a guess and the real issue was actually on Intel systems. If we hear about core affecting only AMD, it is naturally to assume it was written for AMD systems, but if that assumption is wrong, the guess could have been wrong too.
                Got it. Makes sense. I hope they're not wrong.


                Comment


                • #28
                  Originally posted by davibu View Post

                  Half a monthly income is not that much for a new PC, that's definitely still affordable.

                  And that's like you said at minimum wage and it would be a single person, but two person household and even more are much more common in third world countries, so it would be only 25% of monthly houselhold income for a 2 person household. Very affordable.
                  You are definitely ignoring that saving money exist and that you use the PC for at least 5 years. So saving 10% of your income for 5 month or 5% for 10 month is not as unreasonable as you make it out to be. And that's again for a single person household at minimum wage and not being able to sell their old PC to finance some of the price.

                  You are also ignoring that you could still run an older Linux kernel and still a new software stack, even Linux 2.x should already support your hardware flawlessly, just wanting to run the newest kernel "because I want to" is ridiculous. But even then as of right now you could use Linux 5.10 up to December 2026. As well as all the other potential hardware you could upgrade to.
                  Even on the raspberry pi side of things, like a PI zero or Raspberry Pi 3.

                  Quite honestly this complain is just not justified.
                  I know they can still run older kernels. I also know regular users will just use whatever comes in the ISO. If it happens to come with an affected kernel, that's what they're gonna end up with.

                  It's also technically possible to compile your kernel from source and apply your own patches, so why upstream anything? 🙃

                  I wasn't even complaining. You read way too much into what I asked. The original article mentioned some old chipsets for AMD, I just asked what about them because I didn't see them account for in the patch.

                  And you have absolutely no idea what poverty looks like, do you?

                  Saving money is hard, if even possible, for many people. Saving money for months to buy a computer they don't need because they *already have one* that's perfectly ok for their needs? Not gonna happen. Minimum wage is far from a livable wage, even for two people, in most developing countries. They can survive, sure, but not with a good quality of living.

                  They can't save for a Raspberry Pi (specially if you have a computer or phone already) because they need to save for when inflation goes crazy and food gets expensive, or for some emergency, or if something in their house breaks, etc. I guess even in some "developed" countries, poverty conditions on a minimum income still restricts a lot what you can actually do other than saving up for emergency situations, repairs and whatnot.

                  In some places the purchase power has increased due to some economic measures, but it's far from that great.

                  I was a mid-level software engineer making around €900/month back in 2018. The people I knew who made the most made around €1400/month. I wasn't actually poor by any means, didn't pay rent, my wife also had a job paying around €420/month. We had some super shitty cars because it took me 2h to go to work by bus and I was responsible for the company laptop, and my wife had no bus that would go to where ahe worked. Plus it's dangerous for women anyway.

                  Under those conditions, living what would be considered quite privileged lives (no rent, cars already paid up, both employed in relatively high paying jobs, almost never going out, almost never traveling other than to my in-laws' farm, using everything we could to the minimum) I'd have to save for about 2 years to buy a somewhat decent laptop (assuming nothing went wrong in those two years). A Raspberry Pi alone would cost more than I can make do at the end of a single month.

                  Even though I wasn't actually poor, it was almost impossible for me to go to a vacation at the end of the year. My car broke down? There went my savings. A new leak on the roof? There went all my savings. A pipe for clogged because the previous owner of the house thought it was a good idea to flush crazy things down the toilet? There went all my savings.

                  And I *wasn't* poor. I had been, once upon a time, and I still had friends who were. Multiple generations of their families living in a single house, everybody working in some way or another, a couple of retired old people, and my friend could pnly manage to get a computer through government grants or through me giving him an old machine. And they weren't the poorest people I knew, just the poorest people I had the most contact with. They still had a house with painted walls.

                  So please stop pretending you know how deep the poverty rabbit hole goes. The fact you even think those people can save money to replace still-working hardware they already have tells me you don't have the faintest idea. Every time they afford themselves some form of "luxury" or choose to buy something like a computer, they risk not having enough to do a house repair or dental treatment or whatever the next few months or years.

                  Or sometimes even buy food or pay the electricity bill.

                  Poverty in the developed world is far, far different from poverty in the developing world. And even then, assuming those people can just save up and don't do it out of laziness is still just plain wrong.
                  Last edited by andrebrait; 27 September 2022, 05:29 AM.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by dragorth View Post

                    This could mean Yuzu's dev was working around this somehow, even if they didn't know they were, and the fix broke that. It could also be Yuzu is sensitive to these types of changes, which is quite probable due to the nature of emulation.
                    I don´t think so.

                    Originally posted by Linuxxx View Post

                    Switch over to the performance governor and witness how your problem magically disappears...
                    I know schedutil sucks, especially on Yuzu, but that is not the point. The point is Yuzu and the schedutil governor were fine on 6.0.rc7, but not now using the latest linux-mainline commit.​​

                    Originally posted by MadCatX View Post

                    Can you reliably isolate the source of the problem to this patch? If this is a real issue, you should report it before the patch get released.
                    Before wasting developers' time, I need more time to test, but the first impression was that.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by HD7950 View Post
                      Before wasting developers' time, I need more time to test, but the first impression was that.
                      If you're getting your code directly from git, you can do

                      git revert a1375562c0a87f0fa2eaf3e8ce15824696d4170a

                      and run some tests with and without this one patch.

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