OpenBLAS Deciding Whether To Drop Support For Russia's Elbrus CPUs

[coder]

IMHO politics shouldn´t influence such decisions. Software should be Open and we should work together, no mater what the governments do.

What if that collaboration helps a government with a history of invading its neighbors? Would you consider it so virtuous to have been collaborating with German industries, in the late 1930's?

Cooperation between people and mutal dependence always makes it harder to start a war,

You mean like the mutual dependence that existed between Ukraine and Russia?

if we remove that by sanctions that´s a bad thing.

I think it's not something that should be done in trivial cases, or when it doesn't materially benefit the very sort of behavior that's problematic. For instance, I'm not against collaboration with Russians, in general.

What i believe will happen anyway: There will be two "techspheres" sooner or later, a chinese / russian one and a western one.

Quite possibly, though I think Russia probably has some anxiety about being overly dependent on China. That makes it something like North Korea.

We are starting to see the first uC which are developed soley in china with only chinese datasheet + non-mainlined GCC. There are even companies developing toolchains for RISC-V based CPUs based on VSCode and gcc with heavy modifications, which are not mainlined.

Well, as long as they don't violate the license, it shouldn't be a problem. That means any SDK they give anyone should be accompanied by access to the source code of their fork. And if the recipient chooses to upstream a patch from it to the GCC mainline, there's nothing they can do about it.

Sooner or later they will notice, that´s that not a sustainable development model and if a critical mass is reached, they will just maintain their own forks shared by many companies.. At that point the "techspheres" will fork..

Or, they could just create their own toolchains and kernels, as I'm sure many already are.

Short term, that might be beneficial for the west, but long-term i guess the sheer development cycle number + speed in china will outpace our western development cycles,

Who knows, but don't think "The West" is only the US and EU. There's also India, South Korea, Japan, and several more that are unlikely to join China's camp. Much of Africa and South America are wildcards, but I'd imagine they'll be somewhat split between the two spheres.

which are somehow slower, due to over-regulation.

WTF? Opensource is not really regulated.

If you're comparing China's speed to that of the West, let's just say they've been riding coattails for a while. As they're finally catching up, they'll slow down as well.

[coder]

There are Nazis in Ukraine who kill their own people. Over the past few days, the Nazis have killed several politicians in Ukraine. There are no Russian soldiers there, these are cities that were taken prisoner by the Nazis.

That's not accurate. There are some Russian insurgents already infiltrating some major cities, ahead of the main forces. Russia was discovered to have a hit list of people they want to kill or capture:

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ll-detain.html

[coder]

You invent what is not. Everyone here understood that you are not yourself. You can't continue.

Your uncritical view of your own country is disheartening. Is there nothing they say that you don't believe? Do you even understand the concept of conflict-of-interest that state media represents?

[leipero]

Why are you so threatened by the truth?

I don't find disinformation personally threatening. For me, it's like a puzzle to pick apart.

I guess if you have an agenda, and you know you're standing on weak ground, then it would be threatening for people to contradict you. And I'm guessing what's really got you worried is that Serbia doesn't have many friends in the world. Worse, it needs Russia a lot more than Russia needs it. So, good luck with that.

What part of "chill" you did not understand? I already told you why I have 0 interest in arguing with you or anyone else who behaves in the same/similar manner. I don't like to repeat myself.

[mdedetrich]

What part of "chill" you did not understand? I already told you why I have 0 interest in arguing with you or anyone else who behaves in the same/similar manner. I don't like to repeat myself.

Then stop posting and get out of the thread.

[leipero]

Then stop posting and get out of the thread.

Stop quoting me and it will happen, even tho. you are basically ignoring everything, it's still a mater of decency to me to reply.

[mdedetrich]

Stop quoting me and it will happen, even tho. you are basically ignoring everything, it's still a mater of decency to me to reply.

No thats because you can't let something go and you always wan't the last word.

The only person stopping you from posting is you

[tuxd3v]

Can you find any evidence of this, aside from Russian media and Russian sympathizers? And how many Nazis do you think live in Ukraine (a nation of 41 million)?

There are proof of Nazism in masse in Ukraine everywhere!
There are 2 types of nazis, I already provided a video of Scott Ritter, providing information about this subject:
1) the ones that are really nazis, and are infiltrated in the Government,Military and are committing crimes against humanity in donbass and other places in Ukraine.They are at least tens and tens of thousands.. at least groups like c14,Azov battalion,Right Sektor( for sure the group is bigger ).
2) the nazis that are more moderate, and are usually called the "facilitators"( the biggest majority I believe.. )

Does you know that one Ukrainian that participated in the peace talks with Russia,
Was labelled a traitor, guess what...yeah of course the nazis killed him!

Also, why do Putin's list of demands for ending the war say nothing about Nazis? Same thing with his list of demands that he released, before the invasion began. It proves the whole Nazi thing is just a ruse.

Should Russia fight this war alone?should be only Russian soldiers fighting..?
I don't know all the story nor the Political will, or the geostrategic interests of Russia.
I do believe they should hunt down the nazis,
But I also know that its not a equal fight.. because the nazis are using civilians as shields and Russians can't shoot..this fact will hinder a lot the Russian performance on the ground, and for sure the number of deaths from Russia will be amplified due to this factor alone..
Maybe because its very difficult to fight someone that uses humans as shield, Russians are backing down, I don't know.. and I also don't know if they are backing down..
You continue to forget that those are Russian Interests not Putin ones..

Now, what I think is that Europe should have had from the beginning, a common stance on this subject, and fight nazism together, instead they opt to go in the group of "nazi facilitators".. since even weapons are being delivered from EU...yeah from the UK that's right..

What should we call the UK people when they are delivering weapons for the Nazis, can you answer this simple question??

https://www.theguardian.com/zzzzzzzz...zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

So you are saying nasty things from the Russian media, and then you post a link to the UK propaganda machine?
fake news links from UK, omg..
Does you think that the Europeans doesn't know the level of propaganda that the UK Media is?
If you think so, ...you are very very wrongly informed..we do know, we in the EU even joke about it!

[rabcor]

Mentally ill is what Putin is doing. For example bombing civilists or even an atomic power plant! How can you relativate such an action and saying: "Hey, it's Open Source, who cares?" The only one profiting from the Russian CPUs is Russia and if Russian military is profiting from this, then all Russian enemies will suffer from this.

Ok, why don't we cut off China too then, I don't like some of the things their government is doing.

Hey wait, I don't like some stuff USA is doing either, yes, lets cut them off too.

What was that thing France did again? Oh, let's cut them off too.

Hey you know what, why don't we just stop software development entirely! I mean it'll always benefit at least one tyrant anyways, right? Why not just stop it all? Maybe we should just stop all international trade too, why not? It'll always benefit other countries which have governments that do things we don't like.

-----

Quit going down this slippery slope man... Don't let your life and your opinions be dictated by the fucking narrative and use that brain of yours to think for yourself for once. This isn't really complicated.

Also, while you're so busy demonizing Putin, you're advocating actions that harm innocent Russians that have done no harm to anyone and never had anything to do with this war. It's not just Russians either, USA decides to ban oil purchasing from Russia, EU and NATO follow along, who suffers? We do, as oil prices skyrocket like nobody's business. For every action governments, corporations and organizations decide to take to 'support' ukraine (without actually supporting ukraine and just paying them lip service really), the ones who suffer for it are us, the civilians who have and want absolutely nothing to do with that fucking war, and of course, the russian civilians as well, who are in the same fucking boat.

Now that's just how politics are played, big man decides to do some shit, we're the ones who have to pay to support it whether we agree with it or not. The open source community is free though, and as a free community we should be above petty politics.

[mdedetrich]

There are proof of Nazism in masse in Ukraine everywhere!
There are 2 types of nazis, I already provided a video of Scott Ritter, providing information about this subject:
1) the ones that are really nazis, and are infiltrated in the Government,Military and are committing crimes against humanity in donbass and other places in Ukraine.They are at least tens and tens of thousands.. at least groups like c14,Azov battalion,Right Sektor( for sure the group is bigger ).
2) the nazis that are more moderate, and are usually called the "facilitators"( the biggest majority I believe.. )

This is complete and utter BS. The nazi equivalent party in Ukriane (Azov Battalion) has around 1-2 thousand people inside of it and their equivalent parliamentary party in the last elections received ~2% of the vote which is inline with most European countries (every European country has Nazi's in it). There are more Nazi's within Russia and I don't see Putin doing anything about it (in fact he hires them as a mercenary army, see Wagner Group).

The only slightly concerning thing is that Azov Battalion was incorporated into the Ukrainian army but this was likely as a result of Zelensky not wanting to have another fight when there were far bigger problems (i.e. Russia). Furthermore he only did this when Azov Battalion refused to de-materialize so this was the most peaceful way to handle the situation.

This is just an excuse that is used by Putin to gather support from a generation that fought Nazi's in the past and Putin being butthurt that Ukranians worked with Nazi's 50 years ago to fight Russia because they were less concerned with Nazi's rather than Russia at the time (which says enough).

If anything, the situation with Donbas and Putin's Nazi rhetoric is making the situation worse by making people's opinions more extreme but this goes hand in hand with Russia's propoganda of which one goal is to deliberately create divisions within nations. I mean going on Putin logic why doesn't he invade Finland or Estonia or Latvia or Lithuania then? They have Russian's in those countries and also some Nazi's as well!