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Zhaoxin Preparing Linux Kernel Support For 7-Series Centaur CPUs

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  • Zhaoxin Preparing Linux Kernel Support For 7-Series Centaur CPUs

    Phoronix: Zhaoxin Preparing Linux Kernel Support For 7-Series Centaur CPUs

    Chinese company Zhaoxin that continues working on x86_64 CPUs based on VIA Centaur Technology is working on supporting their "7" family processors with the Linux kernel...

    http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...-Family-7-Bits

  • #2
    I was thinking what if phoronix somehow got a chinese party approved cpu+motherboard , like this one or the huawei and checked intel security holes to see if it passed or was swiss. Or maybe he could somehow smuggle one or both for benchmarks.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by onlyLinuxLuvUBack View Post
      I was thinking what if phoronix somehow got a chinese party approved cpu+motherboard , like this one or the huawei and checked intel security holes to see if it passed or was swiss. Or maybe he could somehow smuggle one or both for benchmarks.
      You can order those boards, but they are expensive. Most of the current hardware is focused on the governmental services of the peoples republic to prevent other regimes from spying on them.

      Comment


      • #4
        Lol - I am sure that there are Plenty of Chinese engineers who can build a CPU without copying US Imaginary Property.

        The hard part has always been the mass-production (and that’s TSM, Samsung and Foxconn are for)

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post

          You can order those boards, but they are expensive. Most of the current hardware is focused on the governmental services of the peoples republic to prevent other regimes from spying on them.
          Where can they be ordered? Taobao don't even have any Zhaoxin hardware up for sale.

          Also, what about the drivers? I'm sure the CPU should work fine in a recent kernel, but what about their iGPUs? If I recall correctly, Deepin is the only distribution to bundle a non-free dri driver for Zhaoxin iGPUs. Has the support been mainlined to both the upstream kernel and Mesa yet?
          Last edited by Sonadow; 09-09-2020, 05:05 AM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

            Where can they be ordered? Taobao don't even have any Zhaoxin hardware up for sale.

            Also, what about the drivers? I'm sure the CPU should work fine in a recent kernel, but what about their iGPUs? If I recall correctly, Deepin is the only distribution to bundle a non-free dri driver for Zhaoxin iGPUs. Has the support been mainlined to both the upstream kernel and Mesa yet?
            If I remember correctly you were able to find them on Taobao, but contacts in the PRC always help.

            Idk about the iGPU, but as the CPUS are just modified VIA CPUs they should run just fine. I think the Canadian Linus did a video on a board.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post

              If I remember correctly you were able to find them on Taobao, but contacts in the PRC always help.

              Idk about the iGPU, but as the CPUS are just modified VIA CPUs they should run just fine. I think the Canadian Linus did a video on a board.
              I don't believe they are 'just modified VIA processors'. Tom's Hardware did a review on some Zhaoxin chips and found them to be quite different from typical x64 processors.

              Not having the iGPU drivers available upstream will be a big limiting factor if the goal is US tech independence. Sure, China can have its own boards, chipsets and processors. And they don't even need to be cutting edge; they just need to provide a level of performance that is good enough for most people to accept.

              But if they still have to pair it with an AMD or Nvidia GPU just to produce a display for desktop computing then it really defeats the purpose.

              It's not my place to talk about it, but Tom's Hardware claimed that Zhaoxin asked them to bench the iGPU on Windows using the Windows generic display driver for best results. That should be an indicator that getting support for the iGPU in Linux and Mesa should not be too difficult, considering that it can work against the Windows generic driver?

              On a side note, desktop Linux really needs something equivalent to the Windows generic display driver. X has the default modesetting driver, but there is nothing of that sort in the Wayland world.
              Last edited by Sonadow; 09-09-2020, 05:55 AM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Michael
                These patches for the "7" family is for the ZX-F / KX-7000 hardware.
                ZX-F is the generation codename. It is divided into two series:
                - KaiXian KX-7000 (for desktops, laptops and embedded devices)
                - KaisHeng KH-40000 (for servers and networking devices)

                Originally posted by Michael
                This family of processors will reportedly launch formally in 2021 and be manufactured on a 7nm process and support not only PCI Express 4.0 but also offer DDR5 memory support and other advancements compared to the ZX-E / KX-6000 family.
                Such were their plans, but they have changed them some time ago. What's more, we already have an early samples of ZX-F, produced in 2019:
                https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/526995

                ZX-F cores are extremely similar to VIA (Centaur Technology) CNS:
                - the same CPU ID: [00040671] => CentaurHauls Family 6 Model 71 Stepping 1 (hint: 71 = 47h)
                - 8 cores on single die area
                - 16 MiB shared L3 cache (2 MiB per core, shared across all cores)
                - DDR4 (4 channels)
                - PCI-e 3.0 (44 lanes)
                - TSMC 16 nm process (16FFC)
                - 2.5 GHz core frequency

                There is still no official confirmation of AVX-512 support in ZX-F, but it is almost certain.
                The main difference is probably the NCORE AI coprocessor (including NDU and NPU) in CHA and a Chrome-based GPU in ZX-F.
                Zhaoxin shifted their plans to use PCIe 4.0 and TSMC 7nm process to ZX-G in 2021. What's more, contrary to the original assumption, they don't intend to use DDR5 in the near future.
                https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...1#post12231741
                https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...chmentid=69318
                https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...6#post12361826

                Anyway, I would say that CNS and ZX-F cores are basically the same. It is not just about microarchitecture. They have very similar performance, so they must be produced in the TSMC 16 nm process:
                https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu...aseline=526995

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                  Where can they be ordered? Taobao don't even have any Zhaoxin hardware up for sale.
                  You're wrong. On Taobao, you can buy the following Zhaoxin hardware:
                  - motherboards with the ZX-2000 SoC (e.g. ZX-2800AI with the Elite 2000S1 GPU) - ARM-based
                  - motherboards with the ZX-C CPU and the VX11PH chipset (e.g. C4600, C4610)
                  - motherboards with the ZX-C+ CPU and the VX11PH chipset (e.g. C4700, C4710)
                  - motherboards with the KX-5000 SoC (e.g. KX-5540)
                  - motherboards with the KH-20000 SoC
                  - motherboards with the KX-6000 SoC (e.g. KX-U6780A)
                  - motherboards with the KH-30000 SoC

                  Just keep in mind that English phrases don't always produce the best search results. You should search for "兆芯", not "Zhaoxin".

                  There are also hardware with other Chinese CPUs, e.g. Tianjin Phytium (e.g. FeiTeng FT1500, FT2000), HiSilicon (Kunpeng 920), etc.

                  Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                  Also, what about the drivers?
                  Zhaoxin provides all necessary drivers for Windows XP-10 and Linux.
                  http://www.zhaoxin.com/qdxz.aspx?nid=31&typeid=153

                  Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                  what about their iGPUs?
                  Drivers were already publicly available in 2018.
                  https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...4#post12205314
                  https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...3#post12329913
                  https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...2#post12331602

                  I have access to the following drivers:
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.33_x86_64.deb (SHA2: 53d591eb907791e8ac035aea8c7a6982a72c17b37e763c8200 517112394b49f5) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-10-30, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.34_x86_64.deb (SHA2: 763c045ee8ab68e95d545278cb3aca75308553cc444afe7d60 0f839cee2d2604) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-11-07, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - CHX001 中科方德3.0x64_19.00.38.zip (SHA2: 6dac1e3127f0dfc16683ca767322f55dd1c1d07242a5373e2c dcadb18f0c2f34) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-12-28, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - zhaoxin-graphics-19.00.38-i386.tar.bz2 (SHA2: 6d7edd8acec49d1ef22a8bc64250274f08e46b2388d21d8848 cc3ed55ecab16d) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-12-28, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.38_i386.deb (SHA2: 9d939ef84c4e59c18e9de70e91d31bccbf487a837073477be1 a55d7577334c2d) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-12-28, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - zhaoxin-graphics-19.00.38-x86_64.tar.bz2 (SHA2: ab83a6eeed977e08eedda403d808ed7cf4d2aa32e5546114f9 cdfcd8d7ddba4e) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-12-28, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.38_x86_64.deb (SHA2: 34458e6b71df181a9006aa871806475fafa3eb2f8ddc997320 7aa1105771cd38) - DRIVER_DATE: 2017-12-28, upload date: 2018-01-10
                  - CHX001 中科方德3.0x64-GFX-19.00.40.zip (SHA2: db1d61228814c9922e1865ef1c02c79b71976d399723be6db3 d94b86efae6155) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-01-26, upload date: 2018-03-05
                  - zhaoxin-graphics-19.00.40-i386.tar.bz2 (SHA2: 32b1f50e9713c684be8947097733ace0395e2f587b98a52916 e9cb9d0d0a1b03) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-01-26, upload date: 2018-03-05
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.40_i386.deb (SHA2: 7a887d7cfe0c07dd48243a5ad08705d1bbb93e41be0fa329d7 c0556ce50163f7) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-01-26, upload date: 2018-03-05
                  - zhaoxin-graphics-19.00.40-x86_64.tar.bz2 (SHA2: d3eee7cdbe81c39269819a3450c5f668f4b710581c8741ee5f 1ff7fa5ae268c8) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-01-26, upload date: 2018-03-05
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.40_x86_64.deb (SHA2: 909d70c6314a34cb4fda3c830e607721b25afff71523680695 5ec0916fe39830) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-01-26, upload date: 2018-03-05
                  - ZX-D 中科方德3.0_x64_GFX_19.00.45.zip (SHA2: b6df0329c3f451f8d9bcf41dcf85effc477682c3e7d1363552 11dd22cfd4040b) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-graphics-19.00.45-i386.tar.bz2 (SHA2: 71e73d9ecae21cc1fb45d702884e1cc59f89b4b7cdb1ffa5d0 c31d0f9cce9f67) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.45_i386.deb (SHA2: 5d464cfdaa5fde0151954cdbbed12b2fe2194e98ce5813eded d1e52111781fd4) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-graphics-19.00.45-x86_64.tar.bz2 (SHA2: b1651f78ae5eb09b731afa0abf85866a4f941506fd98f31f5c b12f3d85dc1b09) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.45_x86_64.deb (SHA2: b1d9a6d8b622caba0b1aa3cc3e2a82c68491659fa96a47e006 6e6046f1e4dba0) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver_19.00.45_amd64.deb (SHA2: 63291f86cfd58e40048d92480e89619673882da2222939cb16 3f57730fb5e3f2) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-11
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver_19.00.45+1nfs1_amd64.deb (SHA2: 982284fdebe368906223ed282cf41377a917e030ae3eb16302 4df6c9a3c2e5a2) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-02, upload date: 2018-05-30
                  - ZX-D+中科方德3.0_x64_19.00.46.zip (SHA2: a070819ecd5cb58d14f4a5b2fbf6d39293efd454ceefabe459 caa9e5ad5b8ec8) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-16, upload date: 2018-06-22
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-graphics-19.00.46-i386.tar.bz2 (SHA2: c57ec559919836319131daab01ca87771dcecab5bed76b16ae b10662d59fae9d) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-16, upload date: 2018-06-22
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.46_i386.deb (SHA2: 54c6f681397ac3286baa9ea62a06357d98848b8b15b1f842c1 e54cf3d4dc22a6) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-16, upload date: 2018-06-22
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-graphics-19.00.46-x86_64.tar.bz2 (SHA2: 6676d7fc3a879c1201762829afb8a088ec671987fe3a854b6a dfe8e923a548d4) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-16, upload date: 2018-06-22
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.46_x86_64.deb (SHA2: 4be505a20a3fb7e230ddab6c6c60780574e8fb317bc11361c8 057a90f7954bbd) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-05-16, upload date: 2018-06-22
                  - 19.00.47b.zip (SHA2: 045fa9c8ec4cd3279eb35737b4dc1881da1f784214c0e6cc8c 110688ac626d01) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-07-31, upload date: 2018-08-10
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.47b_x86_64.deb (SHA2: f4ada6ca5679419456a3fe1c7e4b82af0414d3058e06651be2 258256a52d1435) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-07-31, upload date: 2018-08-10
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver_19.00.47b_amd64.deb (SHA2: 2d960d349ca5ee57e62fb8ea303064b2df49f6f3e58b235812 dee1c98ac2b7c7) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-07-31, upload date: 2018-08-10
                  - zhaoxin-ZX-D-linux-graphics-driver-19.00.47c_x86_64.deb (SHA2: b4f63131053106cc5ad0df082da4f34e0acaefffe200b3eb7e 1ac1660bc3681d) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-10-10, upload date: 2018-10-12
                  - zhaoxin-chx001-linux-graphics-driver_19.00.47c_amd64.deb (SHA2: 172495e7e953d1a3f2367967959873daea87e0564a8a5b9e1e 00dd749ca8cbd9) - DRIVER_DATE: 2018-10-10, upload date: 2018-10-12
                  - zhaoxin-linux-graphics-driver-dri_21.00.13_amd64.deb (SHA2: dc339abac231df1362c2765f9f97f330311c4232c1d0173ac2 dc32d9ed031096) - DRIVER_DATE: 2019-12-12, upload date: 2019-12-14
                  - zhaoxin-linux-graphics-driver-dri_21.00.16_amd64.deb (SHA2: e2cbd6262af696aac657c18bb810034de22d2dd6cc5c518bd4 260744240ecff0) - DRIVER_DATE: 2020-02-25, upload date: 2020-03-21
                  - zhaoxin-linux-graphics-driver-dri-21.00.22_amd64.deb (SHA2: 207bd16ef4d9ee49cd0468886f120e9017613f976307f11feb fd48c8484fe2f6) - DRIVER_DATE: 2020-04-27, upload date: 2020-07-02

                  Current drivers:
                  https://pastebin.com/raw/szjxJYkd

                  Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                  If I recall correctly, Deepin is the only distribution to bundle a non-free dri driver for Zhaoxin iGPUs
                  You are wrong. Many Chinese distributions have drivers for Zhaoxin GPUs. This list includes: Kylin, NFS Desktop, UOS, etc. And no one will install some random distribution on government computers.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post
                    Idk about the iGPU, but as the CPUS are just modified VIA CPUs they should run just fine.
                    They are definitely not just modified VIA CPUs. They are much more.
                    https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...4#post12148644
                    https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbull...1#post12231741

                    As you can see, ZX-D (KX-5000) is a full SoC. It is in fact a major redesign. However, CPU cores are still based on the Centaur design. Here we can expect a more serious change with ZX-F. While ZX-D and ZX-E are close to CNR (ZX-C is de facto CNR), ZX-F will be based on CNS.

                    Comment

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