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It's Still Undecided Whether Ubuntu 20.04 LTS Will Support 32-bit x86 (i386)

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  • #21
    Hmm, this would exclude both Pentium M and CoreDuo (aka e.g. most of the Thinkpad T60/x60). These do have enough ram - and a GL2.0 capable GPU. Additionally, many libraries are needed for 32 bit anyway because of wine etc. And ARM+MIPS 32 bit will be with us for long time (even today, many new routers and cheap Smartphones are 32 bit only, also many single board computers flying around)

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    • #22
      Originally posted by mifritscher View Post
      And ARM+MIPS 32 bit will be with us for long time (even today, many new routers and cheap Smartphones are 32 bit only, also many single board computers flying around)
      No one is talking about dropping arm 32bit, yet. But even the past 5 years of the lowest end phone arm is 64bit based on A53, eg SDM410 (2014H1) or newer. You can get arm 64bit sbc now for $5 too, eg la frite.

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      • #23
        Originally posted by ElectricPrism View Post

        Desktops sure, but what about Servers?
        Well, Ubuntu 18.04LTS will be supported until 2028. If you're going to constantly upgrade your software, you should deal with the fact that you sometimes have to upgrade your hardware. If you're concerned about what happens in 2028, you have some time to figure it out.

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        • #24
          If I look at https://www.techstage.de/ratgeber/Ka...l-4310986.html (german), most of the little smartphones are still A7 ones. Additionally, there is a _huge_ base of rasPIs 1/2. And I don't think that dropping one 32 bit architecture helps such much.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by ElectricPrism View Post

            Desktops sure, but what about Servers?
            Yes.. I'm definitely sure they will run the latest Ubuntu on those 15 year old legacy machines.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by calc View Post

              No one is talking about dropping arm 32bit, yet. But even the past 5 years of the lowest end phone arm is 64bit based on A53, eg SDM410 (2014H1) or newer. You can get arm 64bit sbc now for $5 too, eg la frite.
              A ton of consumer-level ARM boards that are easily bought and that we can install normal linux on are 32bit though. Most mainstream ARM64 devices like phones only run variations of Android that have to be built specifically for that device

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              • #27
                Originally posted by brent View Post
                This discussion about dropping official Ubuntu 32 bit x86 support has never ever been about dropping 32 bit multiarch. I don't know where people are getting that from. It's getting silly to explain it in every thread again.
                I'll tell you where these rumors come from - from Canonical developers.
                https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ub...ay/040310.html

                Bryan Quigley said (Wed May 9 20:07:23 UTC 2018):
                The first step would be to all agree on dropping images/installers but we
                should keep the end goal of dropping the port in mind ideally soon as well.

                On the list of known blockers for removing the i386 port are Steam and
                Wine.
                So next time please "explain it" to Ubuntu devs too.

                Almost no one will cry for dropping a 32-bit kernel. The problem is that they are also considering abandoning the entire 32-bit userland as well, which is a terrible idea. Although I don't believe that they would take such a step in the near future, they shouldn't even consider anything like that at all.

                I've already explained why solid support for multiarch is so important.
                https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...20#post1024120

                Originally posted by the_scx View Post
                To build a 32-bit version of WINE, you need the 32-bit chroot environment. To run a 32-bit Windows game (EXE PE32), you need the 32-bit version of WINE, which in turn requires 32-bit libraries, e.g. OpenGL (mesa-libGL, nvidia-x11-drv-32bit, etc.) and OpenAL libs, as well as i686 libc library of course.
                To better imagine, let's look at EL (RHEL and its clones, such as CentOS, SL, OL, etc.). The WINE packages from EL7 main repo are broken by design. Pure 64-bit WINE is not a supported configuration. Of course you can install 32-bit version of WINE from somewhere (e.g. PlayOnLinux or custom i686 RPM package) or even try building 32-bit WINE yourself, but then you will face further difficulties. As it happens, EL does not provide all the necessary dependencies for 32-bit version of WINE. In particular, the openal-soft and nss-mdns are missing, so you have to build them on your own. Keep in mind that EL7 did not abandon 32-bit software completely, but only limited its use. It means it can be much worse. If Ubuntu goes this way, users won't be pleased.


                The EL example shows one more problem. To build 32-bit applications you actually need a 32-bit system in chroot - vide: mock config for i686 and 32-bit base system (repos for i686 arch), such as CentOS altarch-i686.

                Please keep in mind that you need a lot of tools and libraries to build complex software. Just GCC/LLVM Toolchain, Boost, ICU, and a few other libs are usually not enough.

                TL;DR To run 32-bit Windows application under WINE, you need a 32-bit version of WINE (pure 32-bit WINE or mixed 32-/64-bit with enabled WoW64 support), which in turn requires 32-bit version of essential libraries in the system.
                IMHO, today pure 64-bit OS is practically useless on desktop.
                Anyone who thinks that this problem can be solved through simply cross-compilation is simply naive.
                Last edited by the_scx; 19 February 2019, 06:04 AM.

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                • #28
                  I was hoping for a 16-bit build actually. My 80286 desperately needs a new OS, MS-DOS is getting really boring.

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                  • #29
                    Sound like january to april next year would be very interesting. First Microsoft to drop Windows 7 and then Canonical this

                    If others would join ship, so that we have busy 3. and 4. quartals also then year 2020. could be remembered in history as YoD
                    Last edited by dungeon; 19 February 2019, 07:57 AM.

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                    • #30
                      well, at least I can compile my #t2sde for whatever I want. Including real actual 386, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afwIZDtrRj4, SPARC v7: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3O1YVUI9N4 and last but not least my Sgi Octanes ;-) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU_RV8uoTIo

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