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Ethereum Ethminer Performance With Radeon & GeForce OpenCL - August 2017

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  • #41
    Originally posted by cj.wijtmans View Post

    except inflation is not a thing. inflation doesnt double in a few years. That is currently manipulation by central banks like the FR and ECB.
    inflation is absolutely real, but true it hasn't doubled unless you go back to the 80s. Prices also haven't doubled, except when counting what is effectively new tiers of GPUs such as the GTX Titans and dual-gpu cards like the 7990, but 500-600 dollar GPUs go back quite a ways(the Hercules card of 1982 had a list price of 499 USD, counting inflation would be about 1.2k in today's money), such as the Radeon 9800 XT apparently was a ~500 dollar(660 in today's money) gpu with a 218mm^2 die, and it was rather high end for the time(while still apparently being a 60W TDP card), and its die size was half of Vega FEs, and a little over half of the 1080 Ti. Keep in mind that nvidia recently had to have special work put in for getting their huge volta dies made because the area (NOT complexity, transistor count, or process-shrink) is larger than ever before, and considering that intel hasn't grown their dies like that, with the first Pentium at 293mm^2, and the i9 7900X measured at 308mm^2 that's saying something about adding a top-tier. Intel is going to be going above the ~300mm^2 dies but they're also going to be charging more than previous Extreme Edition parts for it too, so also seems like a new tier. and to top it off, the 150-200 dollar MSRP GPU market has been 200-~250mm^2 dies for a while now, examples such as the GeForce 9600 GT, 550 Ti, 650 Ti, GTX 960, GTX 1060 3GB, HD 3850, HD 4850, HD 6850, R9 270, R7 370, RX 470, RX 480 4GB. Rebrands, focus-shift, and I think memory shortages? got in the way of some generations lining up with that, and I was only counting launch-prices. things like the HD 7850/7870 got price cuts that would fit them into it, not just their rebrands that fit. edit: ps. I wonder if I should do more research and treat it like a more professional level paper on the matter and take the time to not have it all jumbled up as I found and thought of different details, and cite sources...?
    Last edited by kiaas; 08-10-2017, 02:37 PM.

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    • #42
      Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
      (EDIT1)can someone tell me how much money it would be needed to bring Clover-OpenCL into a status of supporting ethereum mining?
      If it was just for mining, and just for GCN (where the open source compilers are pretty good) probably not that much. Maybe 3-6 months for someone with GPU driver experience already, 2-3x that for someone learning as they go (but at a lower cost).

      Of course with today's HW you could go with ROCm & OpenCL, already all open source.

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      • #43
        Originally posted by bridgman View Post

        If it was just for mining, and just for GCN (where the open source compilers are pretty good) probably not that much. Maybe 3-6 months for someone with GPU driver experience already, 2-3x that for someone learning as they go (but at a lower cost).

        Of course with today's HW you could go with ROCm & OpenCL, already all open source.
        I was under the impression ROCm doesn't work on GCN 1.0 hardware? I think he had mentioned Southern Islands earlier so I think that's why he's interested in Clover. (I myself have a lot of SI hardware, but I have started to liquidate that collection.)
        And to anyone that is interested in mining on SI hardware... Ethereum mining requires 3+GB of VRAM these days so a lot of the GCN 1.0 hardware just won't work for eth, so its mostly useful for other algorithms, so HD 79xx and the rebrands are generally the oldest usable for Eth, and an R7 370 4GB is more profitable mining zcash than ethereum, with fglrx or on windows.

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        • #44
          Originally posted by kiaas View Post
          I was under the impression ROCm doesn't work on GCN 1.0 hardware? I think he had mentioned Southern Islands earlier so I think that's why he's interested in Clover. (I myself have a lot of SI hardware, but I have started to liquidate that collection.)
          Q was asking about Clover (in Mesa), not ROCm AFAIK. The compiler goes back to SI (we use it in radeonsi as well), it's just the ROCm runtime that is built around the dedicated compute block (MEC) in CI and up plus a couple of recent features like PCIE atomics.

          Originally posted by kiaas View Post
          And to anyone that is interested in mining on SI hardware... Ethereum mining requires 3+GB of VRAM these days so a lot of the GCN 1.0 hardware just won't work for eth, so its mostly useful for other algorithms, so HD 79xx and the rebrands are generally the oldest usable for Eth, and an R7 370 4GB is more profitable mining zcash than ethereum, with fglrx or on windows.
          True, good point.
          Last edited by bridgman; 08-12-2017, 02:29 AM.

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          • #45
            Originally posted by kiaas View Post

            I was under the impression ROCm doesn't work on GCN 1.0 hardware? I think he had mentioned Southern Islands earlier so I think that's why he's interested in Clover. (I myself have a lot of SI hardware, but I have started to liquidate that collection.)
            And to anyone that is interested in mining on SI hardware... Ethereum mining requires 3+GB of VRAM these days so a lot of the GCN 1.0 hardware just won't work for eth, so its mostly useful for other algorithms, so HD 79xx and the rebrands are generally the oldest usable for Eth, and an R7 370 4GB is more profitable mining zcash than ethereum, with fglrx or on windows.
            no i am not interested in GCN1.0 hardware in general i am more interested in RadeonSI+AMDGPU is for me the default driver of all hardware GCN1.0-1,4---

            I know that ethereum need a 4GB vram gpu. This means 4gb edition of 290 or the 8gb 295X2 is the minimum.

            but it is still GCN1.0 hardware.

            my main motivation about Clover is this point: Bridgman: "it's just the ROCm runtime that is built around the dedicated compute block (MEC) in CI and up plus a couple of recent features like PCIE atomics."

            my CPU FX8320 for example is not supported amd only support ryzen and up...
            Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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            • #46
              Originally posted by bridgman View Post

              If it was just for mining, and just for GCN (where the open source compilers are pretty good) probably not that much. Maybe 3-6 months for someone with GPU driver experience already, 2-3x that for someone learning as they go (but at a lower cost).

              Of course with today's HW you could go with ROCm & OpenCL, already all open source.
              so we talk about 12000-25000€ to kill the planet obsolescence of "dedicated compute block (MEC) in CI and up plus a couple of recent features like PCIE atomics"

              in 2 month maybe not a problem any longer for me to spend money on this anti-obsolescence project.
              Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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              • #47
                Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
                I know that ethereum need a 4GB vram gpu. This means 4gb edition of 290 or the 8gb 295X2 is the minimum.
                but it is still GCN1.0 hardware.
                If it helps, the 290 is actually GCN1.1 / CI / gfx7 and has a working MEC block. It's a bit limited in the sense that it only has one MEC block (Kaveri has two) and the microcode store is fixed-size so it can't run the HW scheduler under ROCm, but for things like mining I don't think you would want HWS anyways.

                (for those interested in the details on Kaveri we run HWS on one MEC block and compute on the other)

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                • #48
                  Originally posted by bridgman View Post

                  If it helps, the 290 is actually GCN1.1 / CI / gfx7 and has a working MEC block. It's a bit limited in the sense that it only has one MEC block (Kaveri has two) and the microcode store is fixed-size so it can't run the HW scheduler under ROCm, but for things like mining I don't think you would want HWS anyways.

                  (for those interested in the details on Kaveri we run HWS on one MEC block and compute on the other)
                  good... so we maybe do not talk about a clover update but instead we talk about a backport of ROCm for these chips?

                  just tell me how much money we need to pay for a working prototype of open-source gpu ?
                  maybe this is the better way instead of battling obsolescence
                  Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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                  • #49
                    Hi there,

                    I started maintaining ethminer some time ago. OpenCL should not be much different, but at least you should have access to binaries for main operating systems.

                    https://github.com/ethereum-mining/ethminer

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                    • #50
                      How come NVIDIA GTX 1070 is better than the 1080?

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