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System76 Unveils Thelio "Open" Desktops With Intel/AMD CPU Options, NVIDIA/Radeon GPUs

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  • panzeroceania
    replied
    We're definitely open to System76 including our mainboards, etc. in their product line. The result of that would be a truly made in the US and open, owner controllable PC -- a great step forward! Just waiting on System76 to accept our challenge and start working on it.

    Originally posted by isantop View Post
    I think that would be awesome! Do you happen know if there are any Mini-ITX form factor Talos Motherboards?

    that would be fantastic, I contacted the System76 support team about having a POWER9 option in addition to Intel and AMD and I suggest anyone else who is interested to do the same. This could be a fantastic opportunity. Ubuntu is already supported on POWER9 so spinning up a version of Pop_OS! shouldn't be too intensive (vs. a from scratch port) and POWER9 has the full support of RHEL also so there is definitely and existing ecosystem

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  • panzeroceania
    replied
    Originally posted by leiptrstormr View Post
    I thought it was a bit strange when they provided a SATA backplane instead of an actual machine.
    It looks like the actual motherboards will be made in the USA Gigabyte.
    I talked to their support team, and this is the range of motherboards that are currently used on Thelio, of course if you could get the case separately you could put any motherboard inside. Does anyone know if they have plans of selling the case separately?

    Thelio AMD: GIGABYTE B450 I AORUS PRO WIFI
    Thelio Intel: GIGABYTE H370N WIFI

    Thelio Major Intel: GIGABYTE X299 Ultra Gaming Pro
    Thelio Major AMD: GIGABYTE X399 Designare EX

    Thelio Massive: Asus Workstation Board WS C621E SAGE

    Leave a comment:


  • kpedersen
    replied
    Originally posted by isantop View Post

    I work for System76. We're actually pretty upfront about which components of the system are open vs. not. And everything we produce in-house is open.
    Thats great. So perhaps you could use a slogan of...

    "Thelio desktop; up to 43% open-source components"

    System76's open-source components are certainly not to be sniffed at and I believe this is the right track but I am a little bit worried that the news is going to propagate as it being "an open-source desktop" even when it is not. It is partially open-source. As is a bog standard Lenovo Thinkpad (~3% open-source).

    My big question is: Will System76 try to correct news sites when they use phrases such as "the open-source desktop" or will they stay silent in the hope and additional revenue gained by those people that are tricked and are not buying 100% open-source hardware like they thought? If it is the latter, then they are being unethical and I cannot see that being legally sound either.
    Last edited by kpedersen; 06 November 2018, 07:52 AM.

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  • isantop
    replied
    Originally posted by kpedersen View Post

    Exactly. It is classified as "Open hardware". Not "Open-source hardware" which is what they are masquerading it as.
    I work for System76. We're actually pretty upfront about which components of the system are open vs. not. And everything we produce in-house is open.

    I'm not sure if you knew, but the "S" is OSHWA stands for "Source". In any case, https://github.com/system76/thelio

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  • kpedersen
    replied
    Originally posted by isantop View Post
    Thelio (the computer) is OSHWA-certified Open Hardware (US000142).
    Exactly. It is classified as "Open hardware". Not "Open-source hardware" which is what they are masquerading it as.

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  • switchperson
    replied
    There are multiple aspects for being "open". From the hardware perspective, it would be nice to have motherboard schematics for easy repair..

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  • tuxd3v
    replied
    For this prices better go with slimbook.
    They design aplications for their laptops..

    They offer better prices and a best range of OSes, good look, very good quality, for low prices..


    Leave a comment:


  • isantop
    replied
    Originally posted by kpedersen View Post

    It will potentially be a commercial failure. The worst part is that now businesses are going to say that "open hardware" is not profitable just because these fools approached it in the completely wrong (and frankly fraudulent) way.

    I wouldn't be surprised this was just one big pre-emptive front by a company like Apple or ARM to try to kill or discredit open hardware (such as RISC-V) before it becomes a threat.
    There's nothing fraudulent about it. Thelio (the computer) is OSHWA-certified Open Hardware (US000142).

    We're definitely open to System76 including our mainboards, etc. in their product line. The result of that would be a truly made in the US and open, owner controllable PC -- a great step forward! Just waiting on System76 to accept our challenge and start working on it.
    I think that would be awesome! Do you happen know if there are any Mini-ITX form factor Talos Motherboards?

    Leave a comment:


  • madscientist159
    replied
    Originally posted by stalkerg View Post
    It's really good for the start! At least better when common vendors. But I wait for at least open bios implementation it's possible even now. (I hope it will be next step)
    No, it won't be. They chose the x86 ecosystem, which doesn't have the concept of an open "BIOS" any more for the most part. That's why Google et. al. are starting to work on LinuxBoot etc. instead of true coreboot; the amount of signed, proprietary, black box firmware needed to start any modern x86 system is now larger than some of the early Linux kernels (!).

    Again, that's why I say select something else. POWER gets you full firmware source, low level documentation, owner control, and schematics, but the form factor doesn't go below desktop right now. Certain specific ARM SoCs get you full owner control sans GPU, but the devices are designed and made in countries that might not have the best security track record, plus they tend to be weak and those available in larger form factors (servers) are back to the locked / signed / binary-only firmware situation. RISC-V is fragmented and weak, but in theory it could be the most open solution (this would however require silicon vendor and ODM/OEM decisions to create a fully open SoC and mainboard, sadly this has been very hit and miss in practice). However, putting all the shards together, it's clear that whatever x86 box you are using now can be replaced with something, if you're not locked to proprietary software. That's not a bad place to be; there was a time when that would not have been possible.
    Last edited by madscientist159; 02 November 2018, 01:55 PM.

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  • kpedersen
    replied
    Originally posted by Danielsan View Post
    I hardly believe that these prices will lead any selling, most probably in the next months we will see these prices dramatically dropping down.
    It will potentially be a commercial failure. The worst part is that now businesses are going to say that "open hardware" is not profitable just because these fools approached it in the completely wrong (and frankly fraudulent) way.

    I wouldn't be surprised this was just one big pre-emptive front by a company like Apple or ARM to try to kill or discredit open hardware (such as RISC-V) before it becomes a threat.

    Leave a comment:

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