System76 Shares With Us More Details On Thelio Open Hardware, Pricing Starts At $1,100 USD

[steve007]

A bit outdated, but...

https://www.cars.com/articles/the-2015-american-made-index-1420680649381/

Less than ten cars assembled in the US are more than 75% domestic content. Ford isn't even on that list with any vehicle.

Ouch, I just found the 2018 report. They changed their methodology, so direct comparison would be invalid, but now the number 1 (Jeep Cherokee) has only 72% domestic content.

[WolfpackN64]

It works properly starting with version 64 AFAIK, but it's dog slow because of the lack of JIT. Mozilla doesn't really care about owner controlled platforms, they are more interested in x86/Windows and ARM/Android at this point, which is both concerning and disappointing. I don't know if community requests can change that attitude or not, sadly -- Firefox was a great browser back in the day but lately it seems to have gone places that are the opposite of what it used to be.

I hope they'll put in the investment towards POWER9 one day. I still prefer Firefox over Chrome.

[madscientist159]

I hope they'll put in the investment towards POWER9 one day. I still prefer Firefox over Chrome.

There's someone already planning to work on it [1], but from outside the Mozilla part of the project. My main concern is that with their current public stance on what hardware / OS they want to support, they won't be willing to consider upstreaming the support once written. Hopefully they will, but it may take some convincing.

FWIW we've offered free access to POWER9 hardware for both Firefox and Chromium to help speed adoption. Have yet to have either one take enough interest to even take up the offer, though at least Chromium uses the IBM-sponsored / upstreamed V8 JIT engine so the overall maintenance burden is lower for the time it remains out of tree.

Might not hurt to reach out to classilla and let him know you want to see an OpenPOWER JIT for Firefox. If anyone can offer assistance that might help as well; it's a large project for one person to handle AFAIK.

[1] https://github.com/classilla/tenfour...ment-416082387

[freespirit]

Lack of JIT is hardly a dealbreaker anyway, every sane website is fast enough with interpreted JS. Block ads and don't use cancerous websites. And no, games do not belong in the browser.

i don't agree
imagine you have 2 options spend 700$ for a complete x86 system you can use every software you need or to spend 2000$ and have a really bad experience with website, do not have some other software you have with x86.
sure x86 is closed not secure blablabla, i agree and that's true, but no one have money for free, and if someone have to spend all that money, i think all programs we use should work as other platform

so for me firefox is a dealbreaker, and i'm not the only one, i will buy a raptor machine only when firefox on debian will be fully working, otherwise i've used x86 for decades, i can live with it for another one even if i don't feel confortable with that

There's someone already planning to work on it [1], but from outside the Mozilla part of the project. My main concern is that with their current public stance on what hardware / OS they want to support, they won't be willing to consider upstreaming the support once written. Hopefully they will, but it may take some convincing.

FWIW we've offered free access to POWER9 hardware for both Firefox and Chromium to help speed adoption. Have yet to have either one take enough interest to even take up the offer, though at least Chromium uses the IBM-sponsored / upstreamed V8 JIT engine so the overall maintenance burden is lower for the time it remains out of tree.

Might not hurt to reach out to classilla and let him know you want to see an OpenPOWER JIT for Firefox. If anyone can offer assistance that might help as well; it's a large project for one person to handle AFAIK.

[1] https://github.com/classilla/tenfour...ment-416082387

i've talked with one firefox core developer on irc, he told me if someone will do the JIT they will review and upstream
i hope raptor could help in doing it

[madscientist159]

i've talked with one firefox core developer on irc, he told me if someone will do the JIT they will review and upstream
i hope raptor could help in doing it

That's encouraging! While I can't guarantee anything yet, let me see what we might be able to do in terms of assistance...

[classichasclass]

There's someone already planning to work on it [1], but from outside the Mozilla part of the project. My main concern is that with their current public stance on what hardware / OS they want to support, they won't be willing to consider upstreaming the support once written. Hopefully they will, but it may take some convincing.

FWIW we've offered free access to POWER9 hardware for both Firefox and Chromium to help speed adoption. Have yet to have either one take enough interest to even take up the offer, though at least Chromium uses the IBM-sponsored / upstreamed V8 JIT engine so the overall maintenance burden is lower for the time it remains out of tree.

Might not hurt to reach out to classilla and let him know you want to see an OpenPOWER JIT for Firefox. If anyone can offer assistance that might help as well; it's a large project for one person to handle AFAIK.

Hi, someone pointed me to this post. The reason TenFourFox's JIT exists outside of the Mozilla tree was because it was for a platform it didn't support anymore (PowerPC OS X uses a different ABI than SysV), and this and the big-endian support required hacks to IonMonkey that I was concerned would not be acceptable. As written it wouldn't have been that helpful for PPC Linux anyway because at minimum the trampoline and some other pieces would need to be rewritten. I always had the policy of upstreaming what was generally useful, and we did do this, particularly for AltiVec stuff.

However, since ppc64le Linux is definitely a workable tier 3, the idea is absolutely to upstream the work when I'm done and then have it live in the Mozilla tree as part of Firefox. I have Mozilla security access and a good working relationship with the JavaScript team, and I expect it to be relatively straightforward to get in there when it's finished.

But I certainly wouldn't mind people willing to work on other parts. Right now I'm trying to finish up the high-level portions so I can determine what needs to go into the macroassembler and the low-level assembler. Not much of the TenFourFox JIT is transferrable, but it's useful as a blueprint even if the code doesn't really translate directly.

Cameron Kaiser

[madscientist159]

The reason TenFourFox's JIT exists outside of the Mozilla tree was However, since ppc64le Linux is definitely a workable tier 3, the idea is absolutely to upstream the work when I'm done and then have it live in the Mozilla tree as part of Firefox. I have Mozilla security access and a good working relationship with the JavaScript team, and I expect it to be relatively straightforward to get in there when it's finished.

That's great news! Very glad to hear this and looking forward to the results. If anyone wants to help and needs access to a POWER9 VPS please feel free to contact me directly as well.

[johanb]

https://thel.io/

Dug around on the system76 page and found this link which is supposed to be the site for their new open hardware.

It's just some fantasy story PR bullshit which doesn't contain a single piece of information, why do they spend money on such worthless crap?

[panzeroceania]

They only used Gigabyte in the past because their computers are based on Clevo hardware implementations (laptops, computers). So they didn't really "use" Gigabyte, they "put up" with Gigabyte as Clevo had chosen Gigabyte. I'm not saying they won't be using Gigabyte for Thelio, but it doesn't have to be as they were free to choose their own supplier this time.

I talked to their support team and these are the motherboards they are using


Thelio AMD: GIGABYTE B450 I AORUS PRO WIFI
Thelio Intel: GIGABYTE H370N WIFI

Thelio Major Intel: GIGABYTE X299 Ultra Gaming Pro
Thelio Major AMD: GIGABYTE X399 Designare EX

Thelio Massive: Asus Workstation Board WS C621E SAGE