Phoronix IRC Log: 2010-08-26
bioinfornatics: hi i would like know if an admin could approve my first reply?
bioinfornatics: it seems i need wait that
cheriff: hello, is the PTS known to work on ARM (or a subset of it, anyway?)
jetsaredim: anyone have a suggestion for a decent video card for an Ubuntu 10.04 setup with 2x 24" monitors
markatto: NOT an ati 5k series
jetsaredim: markatto: orly?
jetsaredim: was considering a 5770
markatto: there are no open-source drivers available
markatto: well, i think there actually is but no distro ships them yet
jetsaredim: i'm not really concerned about the open/closed driver issue
markatto: and the closed driver crashes like no other
markatto: hard, kernel crashes not just X crashing
jetsaredim: i've used the nvidia closed driver before
markatto: the nvidia one is far better
markatto: if you're cool with closed drivers nvidia is definitely the way to go right now
markatto: even if ati is a better deal hardware-wise
jetsaredim: i mean - i don't mind pay a little more for a card that's going to last a few years
jetsaredim: was considering an EVGA GTX460
jetsaredim: about $210 after MIR
adm1: jetsaredim: I've got ati hardware here with the manufacturer's drivers and it's going well.
jetsaredim: adm1: how many displays?
adm1: two, but from a laptop
adm1: one is on the hdmi port
jetsaredim: what model?
adm1: Radeon 3200
adm1: jetsaredim: they've been concentrating pretty hard on the catalyst drivers for linux
jetsaredim: as was mentioned - i think the 5K series has issues
adm1: is that what you are hearing from forums or what
adm1: where'd you get the info
jetsaredim: been reading reviews on newegg saying that a lot of the 5K series has issues with dual head
jetsaredim: and that's on windows which is their main platform
jetsaredim: god only knows how bad it'll be for linux
adm1: why don't you do some searches on phoronix and phoronix forums. Linux is a different situation
adm1: Your best bet would be to talk with some 5k owners direct
adm1: that are running linux. I'm doing testing on the fglrx drivers and it's been pretty nice here
dandel: jetsaredim, the 5k has issues on installation, but not with normal desktop usage.
dandel: the problem with the radeon 5k series is that certain kernels with kms do not properly support the card because the driver did not take into account the evergreen set of chips (hd 5k series)
dandel: so, for example, on ubuntu 10.04 when you install, you need to disable kms and use safe mode graphics until fglrx is installed.
jetsaredim: oh fun
jetsaredim: so once installation is complete it should work fine
jetsaredim: is there any docs on this?
dandel: pull the fix for intel cards (namely boot with xforcevesa boot param)
adm1: dandel: you know, i bet that would work on fedora for stopping nouveau and radeon kernel modules from loading also
adm1: at install time
adm1: I've been using rdblacklist for that.
dandel: adm1, i'm talking about ubuntu for now.
adm1: is that what he's got?
dandel: yea... that's what he put a couple of hours ago.
dandel: jetsaredim, I don't know why the other guy said to avoid the hd5000 series, but i found it working fairly well at whatever i toss at it. Although, i don't have any anticipation of xvba working any time soon.
dandel: i actually have the hd5770 and have been using it on linux for over 7 months now.
dandel: it worked painlessly from the start, although, from ubuntu 9.10 to 10.04 i had some problems because of kms, but that was quickly remedied, and since then, i have not ran into many problems.
dandel: michaellarabel1, it might be a good idea to add a 32-bit tests for 64-bit systems to help with finding bugs with drivers.
jetsaredim: are there any guides on getting this setup?
jetsaredim: seems like there are a bunch of gotchas on install of 10.04
maikmerten: are the problems actually still there with 10.04.1?
maikmerten: installation issues are like what I would expect to be resolved in such maintenance releases
maikmerten: seems resolved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidLynx/ReleaseNotes/ChangeSummary/10.04.1
maikmerten: (search for "evergreen", then follow the link)
maikmerten: "radeon: add evergreen family microcode. LP: #560306 "
adm1: dandel: there's alot of people out there talking negative about the ati hardware without knowing what they are talking about
dandel: adm1, yea, and quite frankly those are the ones who encounter a problem and don't report it thus hurting others experience.
dandel: ati drivers have improved a lot over the last 6 years.
dandel: right now i am running the opencl benchmark to see what i get
dandel: michaellarabel1, smallpt-gpu [OpenCL Device: GPU - Resolution: 1280 x 1024 - Scene: Caustic] gives negative results
dandel: lol: -53879446.77 Samples/sec
dandel: and mandelbulbgpu needs a warning at runtime that it can take several minutes to complete
michaellarabel1: yeah on some runs the test reports negative value, haven't figured out why yet
Ivanovic: michaellarabel: have you considered a buffer overflow?
Ivanovic: since this is a *really* large number (okay, really tiny in fact)
dandel: if that's the case, it might be best to divide then add
michaellarabel: the patch should be in the install directory if you want to try it out
dandel: i'll take a look into that.... right now i'm still in the middle of the other cl tests.
dandel: anyways, OpenCL tests on ati drivers will say that they are on Stream v2.1 instead of stream v2.2 (i think they failed to update the binaries)
dandel: at least when working with 32-bit binaries.
dandel: 64-bit binaries work properly.
dandel: smallpt-gpu [OpenCL Device: GPU - Resolution: 1280 x 1024 - Scene: Caustic3] had a result of Average: 48458107.83 Samples/sec
dandel: michaellarabel, i think the caustic test failed because of overflow
dandel: michaellarabel, it appears ati has bugs with gluxmark v2 lol.
Bakou: i cant build gnash on gentoo, the ebuild isnt findint the right version of boost
Bakou: keeps saying its blocked by boost version 0
Bakou: im really getting sick of gentoo
Azerthoth: Bakou, what version of boost is it looking for?
Bakou: it just says
Bakou: [blocks B ] dev-libs/boost:0 ("dev-libs/boost:0" is blocking www-psh-0.8.8)
Bakou: but i have 1.35 and 1.41 installed, with 1.41 eselect'ed
Bakou: i dont know what else it could be besides an ebuild/gentoo bug
Bakou: really frustrating
Bakou: this exact type of stuff makes me want to change distros
Azerthoth: thats not a boost version it cant find, thats saying you cant have boost and www-psh installed at the same time
Bakou: but gnash requires boost
Bakou: ok let me try emerging www-psh
Bakou: no ebuild for www-psh..
Azerthoth: which is odd as www-psh isnt in main portage tree
Azerthoth: one sec. lemme look at ebuild
Bakou: yeah im having troubling grasping this
Bakou: last night
Bakou: i was trying to install gnash with boost 1.35 only
Bakou: then it required me to update to 1.41
Bakou: but it said boost 1.35 is blocking 1.41 i think
Bakou: then it let me emerge 1.41 on its own np
Bakou: im finding it just a bit ridiculous
Bakou: this ebuild in specific
Bakou: then compiling boost with -j3 froze my window manager
Bakou: was not too happy about that
Bakou: no results found for www-psh in portage or portage overlays
Azerthoth: not seeing anything thats calling in a non existant package
Bakou: sooooo wtf?
Azerthoth: equery g gnash
Bakou: ok this is producing like 100 pages of output
Azerthoth: thats for all versions of gnash, each version has 30-40 deps depending on USE flags
Bakou: still going ><
Bakou: maybe i should specify the version
Bakou: are you running gentoo? can you build gnash?
Azerthoth: can always file a bug
Azerthoth: I have zero interest in gnash
Bakou: i was ok with adobe flash
Bakou: until they only fixed their security holes in 32bit
Bakou: now i have some serious problems
Azerthoth: I made one USE flag change and moved on
Bakou: it works ok in 32bit firefox
Bakou: but then scim doesnt work
Bakou: and id rather just do it properly rather than doing some crappy 32bit scim workaround
Azerthoth: dont use that either
Bakou: chromium bin
Bakou: does work with scim
Bakou: even though id assume its 32bit?
Bakou: it cant display any asian characters
Bakou: and it doesnt find the flash plugin
Azerthoth: googles great data miner ... no thanks
Bakou: maybe chromium-bin is 64bit somehow
Bakou: thats how it appears
Bakou: yeah well, im in pretty deep
Bakou: i already use gmail
Bakou: couldnt be worse than that :P
Bakou: anyway, its a rather unpleasent situation precipitated by adobe's callousness~
Bakou: i cant find a single reference to a package www-psh anywhere on the internet lol
Azerthoth: file bug report
Bakou: [blocks B ] dev-libs/boost:0 ("dev-libs/boost:0" is blocking www-plugins/gnash-0.8.8)
Bakou: see now the error is different
Bakou: guess so eh
Bakou: never done that yet
Bakou: usually i just post on the forums
Bakou: this was the intial error
Bakou: gnash requires boost, but boost blocks gnash
Bakou: total nonsense
Azerthoth: maintainer is email@example.com
Bakou: maintainer of this ebuild?
Bakou: ok thanks
Bakou: ill just email him
Azerthoth: also firstname.lastname@example.org
Bakou: whats the typica stuf they want you to submit with bug reports, emerge --info outut?
Azerthoth: yup, and the error report itself
Azerthoth: and anything that you may think is relevant
Bakou: hey cool, gmail added the free calls on the internet to canada
Azerthoth: eselect boost list as an example
Midler: should i get nvidia geforce 210 or radeon HD 5450 for an htpc?
Azerthoth: ATI == A(nother) T(errible) I(nvestment)
stlsaint: Midler: are you running linux or windows?
Midler: i was thinking of making a htpc
Midler: the ati one was cheaper
Midler: and has more GPU power
Midler: and perhaps audio threw hdmi
Midler: the nvidia one was just because its nvidia =)
Midler: Azerthoth: my first pc had a radeon x800which still works fine
Midler: actually, my brothers nvidia card just broke
Bakou: ati isnt that bad
Midler: and now he is borrowing my old x800 card
Bakou: but keep in mind
Bakou: for the 5000 series, the only drivers that work properly realy are for win7
Midler: wont they release new drivers?
Bakou: if your using any other OS, prepare for random bugs
Bakou: they do every month
Bakou: and they rarely fix any real problems
Midler: its to be htpc
Midler: so printing a movie on my screen should works key?
Bakou: there are open source drivers too for linux but for the 5000 they arent finished
Bakou: yeah i think the binaries could handle that
Midler: perhaps also playing HoN
Bakou: i wouldnt count on that
Midler: but mostly to view cinematic in in fullHD
Midler: i have this pc to play on
Bakou: if you want real video acceleration
Bakou: get nvidia
Bakou: or use win7
Bakou: or wait
Midler: well, my thinking is
Midler: if it get better by time
Midler: its worth it
Bakou: you could prolly get by with the ati binaries
Midler: thats what iam thinking of to use
Bakou: if you use nvidia binaries
Bakou: im actually 100% positive HoN and ful vid accel will work
Bakou: im not really sure about ati :P
Bakou: if you want to step back
Bakou: and get a ati 4000 series
Bakou: youll be in a lot better shape in linux
Bakou: because the open source driver is shaping up to look pretty awesome
Bakou: but its only for 4000 and below
Bakou: dunno when the 5000 part will really start to work
Bakou: could be next month
Bakou: could be next year
Bakou: you dont need a 5000 for htpc anyway
Midler: gainward, xfx or what
Midler: should i pick
Midler: its the same grapichcard
Midler: only price differ
dandel: michaellarabel, xfx 5450 will do fine.
dandel: the only catch is that the 5000 series needs a bit of work to configure initially.
Midler: once ati
Midler: next nvidia
Midler: what a war T.T
Midler: dandel: what kind of configure?
dandel: just simply forcing vesa graphics until fglrx is installed
dandel: once that is installed, use the latest release of xbmc and your set with htpc
Midler: so in basic
dandel: just don't enable vsync (usually not required)
Midler: u mean i need to install amd:s drivers
dandel: for now
dandel: the open source drivers will be ready in about 2 years lol
Midler: which i will do for either of the card i choose
Bakou: just pray fglrx doesnt randomly screw up
Midler: i mean
Midler: choosing the manufacturors driver
dandel: go to www.amd.com and on the right
Midler: yes i know
dandel: just select what closest matches the system :)
Bakou: i still think you should go with a 4000 series
Midler: its just iam choosing between the two cards
Midler: a hard decision
dandel: i run ubuntu 10.04 with a 5770, ddr3 and an athlon ii x4 and 2.9 and i have no problems with decoding 1080p.
Bakou: are you buying from a friend or something?
Midler: nvidia, because its nvidia and it works
Bakou: get an older ati card
Bakou: then youll have super sweet video drivers
Bakou: especially when mesa 7.9 is out
Midler: ati, better GPU and all, however, might take some time for the driver to age up
Bakou: i already tested it, the 2d accel is nice
dandel: 2d accel just plain works on linux
dandel: smplayer + mplayer (repo) + set to gl2 and it works wonderfully
Bakou: well thats not 2d accel :P
dandel: if your talking about xv, that also works
Midler: whats the difference between manufacturors (asus, xfx, powercolor etc etc..?)???
Bakou: warranty, price and cooler
dandel: i recommend xfx because of double lifetime warranty
Bakou: i heard xfx is in financial trouble tho
dandel: their cards also work really well
Bakou: i got my ati 5850 from gigabyte
dandel: cpu usage: 18% at 800mhz clock with 1080p mpeg4
Bakou: and i always get my mobos from gigabyte now
Bakou: they rock
dandel: and i got the video running with xv
Bakou: and their boxes crack me up
Bakou: i remember i got hd accel working like
Bakou: on my amd 64 with nvidia 6600gt
Bakou: with XvMC
Bakou: way back in the day
Bakou: then years later i tried fglrx and it kept blowing up in my face
Bakou: ive seen all kinds of wierd fuckups from ati drivers too in winxp and win vista
Bakou: i really dont trust their drivers
Bakou: their cards are fine
dandel: actually, i switch to opengl 2 (yuv) and my cpu drops to 9/13/18% fluctuation.
Bakou: nvidia driver engineers are just way more on the ball
dandel: Bakou, it's not as though ati's are not working on the problem, it's just that your comparing apples to oranges.
Midler: powerconsuming is different for the same card
Midler: one is saying 300W
Midler: another 350W
Bakou: sometimes i wonder
Midler: and a third 400W
Bakou: they might have different clock speeds
Bakou: but that is a big difference
dandel: different clock speeds and they might be mentioning different power supplies to improve system quality.
dandel: what brands?
Midler: powercolor and saphire
Midler: ddr3 memory
Midler: pwrclr has 350w
Midler: and saphire has 500W
Midler: the exactly same specs
dandel: go with sapphire, they are one of the launch partners from amd.
Midler: what waranty do they have?
dandel: anyways, having a higher wattage power supply does not mean you are going to use more electricity.
Midler: saphire one cost 170SEK more than pwrclr
dandel: it just means that you can expect the power supply to take more individual devices (like more hard drives)
Midler: i might go with powercolor
dandel: how many watt power supply do you have now?
dandel: the second reason to go with a larger power supply is to take into account capacitor aging which will make the power supply use more electricity.
Bakou: i fixed gnash
Bakou: turns out it just will not compile if you have any old boost
Bakou: even if its not eselected
Bakou: so apparently eselect is completely useless
Bakou: but whatever, 64bit flash!
r4: ql is so annoying
r4: crashes for no reason
Bakou: whats ql
Bakou: what language is that written in anyway
Bakou: its not like a flash thing is it?