Phoronix IRC Log: 2010-06-12
djura-san: morgen o/
Morten_: god morgen! =)
FliPPeh: Oh god
FliPPeh: The U.S. plans to assassinate the WikiLeaks founder
FliPPeh: Way to collect karma, Obama
FliPPeh: Rhyme intendedly unintended
monreal: FliPPeh: source?
FliPPeh: Even if it just says "might" right now, I'm pretty sure it will happen. Sooner or later.
FliPPeh: Obama has lost all of the initial respect I've had for him
FliPPeh: By not keeping his promises and developing into a much worse Bush
monreal: phoronix really teaches people to rely on qualified sources.... steam confirmed! oh, wait, not so much...
FliPPeh: What, Twitter isn't reliable...?
FliPPeh: A little bit of fact and a bit of logical thinking and the case becomes clear
FliPPeh: By the way, STEAM??ßßß
FliPPeh: It's weird how every news website reporting about SteamUx always refers to Phoronix, everyone only believes Phoronix, but even Phoronix can't be trusted!
Sleepy_Coder: are you kidding? assasinate the wikileaks founder? 0.o
FliPPeh: Oh common, it's not that surprising
FliPPeh: They reveal classified, top-secret documents to the public
FliPPeh: Of course they're an annoyance that's best getting rid of
FliPPeh: No need for rock solid sources either, Bush was friendly campared to Obama in the "National Security" aspect.
monreal: sure obama is not the godlike person some people tried to see in him, but even on a really bad day he's still a much better person than bush jr was in his brightest days
Sleepy_Coder: do not want :(
FliPPeh: Luckily I live in Europe
Sleepy_Coder: I think it could be comments taking widely out of proportion... or it could be marginalized political speak meant not to cause a huge impact but still get the point across
FliPPeh: We might all be bancrupt in a few years, but noone's getting assasinated in germany :)
Sleepy_Coder: I don't want to believe our government does things like that.
FliPPeh: Sleepy_Coder: You better do :/
FliPPeh: Not that I hate America.
FliPPeh: But I think the U.S. admisitration is way harder on security than some other countries are
Sleepy_Coder: I hate all governments don't worry :p
FliPPeh: Let's hate my government together. Germany is un-bear-able.
FliPPeh: Planning to censor the freaking internet like China does
FliPPeh: And then they want to call the woman who thought of that our new president
FliPPeh: I'll leave this dying hell hole as soon as possible
monreal: she's not running for president
FliPPeh: She was considered a favourite
monreal: she was not officially nominated by anyone
FliPPeh: A shame Koehler stepped back.
monreal: but why he really did so, we will never know...
FliPPeh: What about his official statement regarding pressure and critizism?
FliPPeh: Oh god, Vuvuzelas in my neighboorhood. I hate football.
monreal: yeah, those are the real problem now :(
FliPPeh: 4 weeks...
monreal: plus, it is going to get worse
FliPPeh: oh god, germany
FliPPeh: hopes we lose.
FliPPeh: Being a traitor is fun.
FliPPeh: At least people will shut up when that happens
FliPPeh: Is it pathetic that I feel like crying over the ending of Scrubs series 5, episode 20? Oh god, it's so sad :(
s_20: no offence, but yes, that is pathetic.
FliPPeh: s_20: But... but... :(
alexandernst: FliPPeh: I understand you
FliPPeh: alexandernst: :)
FliPPeh: Windows Propaganda...
FliPPeh: "Windows®. Life without Walls™. ASUS recommends Windows 7."
FliPPeh: Does MS force vendors to do that?
FliPPeh: It seems EVERY vendor who ever made PCs with linux on it puts these on
FliPPeh: Dell. Asus.
s_20: FliPPeh: every OEM puts those on
s_20: on literally everything
s_20: even my screen has a "Designed for Windows Vista" sticker on it
FliPPeh: My laptop had one of those
FliPPeh: I placed it on my waste bin.
FliPPeh: It's particulary sad because software should be designed for hardware, not vice-versa
FliPPeh: But microsoft never plays by the rules
FliPPeh: Harddrives carry that sticker, too
FullFlannelJacke: I am running lightsmark and I notice I am getting only ~50 FPS on average while others with weaker video cards are getting 100+ FPS. Some with the same card are getting 300-400 FPS. Any ideas?
FliPPeh: Compiz running?
FliPPeh: Or any other compositing?
FliPPeh: It can really be a slowdown
FullFlannelJacke: Yes, but with it off I still get same FPS
FullFlannelJacke: I am wondering if Vsync has something to do with it?
FliPPeh: Vsync is really a downer
FliPPeh: I wonder why it's enabled by default
FliPPeh: Try turning it off!
FullFlannelJacke: I will..
FliPPeh: Explains the 50 fps
FliPPeh: Is your monitor running with 50 Hz...?
FullFlannelJacke: Also, I noticed that if one uses ossv4 as the sound driver, lightsmark crashes and forces a hard reboot! I had to go to the config file and delete the "music" line
FliPPeh: Vsync keeps the FPS in sync with the monitor frequency (main or side effect, I don't remember)
FliPPeh: OSS sound system?
FliPPeh: Better switch to ALSA
FliPPeh: OSS nowadays is just a wrapper for ALSA
FliPPeh: So there is probably no benefit
FullFlannelJacke: Lightsmark kept crashing over and over on its 3rd run..I looked in logs and saw callbacks to oss
FullFlannelJacke: turned off the music in lightsmark config and now it doesnt crash
FliPPeh: Try switching to ALSA
FliPPeh: It's the better ichoice n general
FliPPeh: choice in*
FullFlannelJacke: ALSA sux too. I switched from Alsa because of tons of callbacks in my logs..However, newer versions of OSS also are giving me callbacks
FliPPeh: OSS is deprecated :/
FullFlannelJacke: What is the purpose of Vsync? I mean I know what it does, but whats the benefit?
FliPPeh: It's purpose is reducing screen artefacts
FullFlannelJacke: I think you are thinking of the old OSS. The new OSS (version 4) is still in active development.
FliPPeh: Like when you turn around in an FPS, the upper and lower half of the screen are not in sync
FliPPeh: Vsync does that.
FliPPeh: keeping them synced
FullFlannelJacke: im gonna turn it off and re-run lightsmark
FliPPeh: It should work :)
FullFlannelJacke: Hmm Lightsmark is still freezing me and causing hard reboots
FliPPeh: FullFlannelJacke: "hard reboot"?
FliPPeh: Kernel Panic?
FullFlannelJacke: I guess so. No keyboard combination will stop it. it's a hard freeze
FliPPeh: When it happens, try turning on the numlock LED, capslock LED
FliPPeh: If they don't respond, you've got a panic
FullFlannelJacke: I had my card overclocked. going to unclock it and try again
FullFlannelJacke: Yeah I guess so. But i dont see anything in he logs that tell me what went wrong
NigeyUK: mastertheknife, :)
s_20: the prodigal son hath returned
NigeyUK: s_20, :D
NigeyUK: miss me? lol
s_20: it just wasn't the same.......
NigeyUK: aww, had to go away for a week, but im back
Nevtus: NigeyUK: get any interesting emails through the steamonlinux.com site yet?
NigeyUK: hey nevtus
NigeyUK: not really, but i do have a shit load of email to check from the week i was away
FliPPeh: ON LEENUKS?
NigeyUK: water + heat = steam ;)
FliPPeh: Oh yes
s_20: .oO( == vapour )
mastertheknife: hey nigey
FliPPeh: I think "SteamUx" would have been a better name!
NigeyUK: Nevtus, ive been surprised by the poll results though
NigeyUK: hey mastertheknife !!
mastertheknife: no see in a long time O_o
NigeyUK: took the gf away :)
NigeyUK: hey mastertheknife i got an email to forward to you, its quite funny.. but very lame to say the least lol
mastertheknife: sure why not
mastertheknife: mastertheknife at gmail
NigeyUK: oki dokie :D
FliPPeh: Get your own domain!
Nevtus: hmm, that poll has had quite a bit of voting since the last time I checked
FliPPeh: @flippeh.de !
Nevtus: does phoronix have an unoffical tf2 server yet?
mastertheknife: haha yeah we need a tf2 server
mastertheknife: nigey you got tf2?
FliPPeh: We do.
NigeyUK: i got tf2, but wine is not playing nice with my sound card atm :(
mastertheknife: NigeyUK its probably because wine is trying to use PulseAudio
FliPPeh: I had that just yesterday
mastertheknife: TF2 broke for me ever since last update
FliPPeh: Still works for me :x
mastertheknife: everytime that popup in the bottom comes up (e.g. new achievement) etc
NigeyUK: yup, im gonna remove pulse altogether i think, its screwing up all my games now :(
mastertheknife: fps goes to like 0.5 fps and i have to open console and blindly type exit and hit enter
mastertheknife: NigeyUK: Yeah pulse is definitely not stable
Nevtus: having a tf2 server for us would probably make things fairer since we'd all be battling with wine to get the damn thing running :P
mastertheknife: NigeyUK: You should keep alsa only
mastertheknife: alsa with oss emulation enabled
FliPPeh: Luckily I never get achievements - got most "easy" ones
NigeyUK: aye mastertheknife thats what i'll do i think
mastertheknife: FliPPeh: Its really annoying to restart tf2 so often, because many times the server is full
NigeyUK: etqw lags badly with pulse
r4: tf2 practically runs flawless in wine for me
mastertheknife: NigeyUK: I have definitely no problems with alsa, and tf2 works nicely with it
mastertheknife: I even have voice (mic) working perfectly fine.
NigeyUK: Nevtus, if i still had a uk dedicated server id chuck a tf2 server up :/
mastertheknife: The problem i have with tf2 now is since latest update.. everytime i get achievement or the popup in the bottom shows up, fps goes to like 0.5 fps
FliPPeh: Quick question
FliPPeh: I'm trying to use openbox to run steam for me
NigeyUK: hmm, thats a pain, you cant disable achievements either.. not even server side i dont think
FliPPeh: How do I pass environment variables?
mastertheknife: WINEDEBUG="fixme-all" steam
FliPPeh: I think I better write a startup script..
mastertheknife: just edit your shortcut
FliPPeh: Yes, but doesn't work in an openbox menu :(
mastertheknife: NigeyUK: But it worked fine for the past week
mastertheknife: i'm not sure what went wrong
mastertheknife: i'll try rebooting
mastertheknife: maybe xorg needs a restart or something
Tuipveus: hi there
mastertheknife: hi there
NigeyUK: hmm weird, maybe it just needs a good bitchslap :D
NigeyUK: hi Tuipveus
mastertheknife: 18:26:10 up 8 days, 16:17, 5 users, load average: 0.42, 0.22, 0.08
Tuipveus: just wanted to notice you that there is "wrong" comment on your site
mastertheknife: reboot cant harm :P
NigeyUK: root@alpha [~]# uptime
NigeyUK: 16:25:08 up 162 days, 18:58, 1 user, load average: 0.06, 0.19, 0.16
Nevtus: you're running as root?
Tuipveus: in the graph units are Seconds so ext4 is actually faster, not slower
NigeyUK: noo, just doing a few admin things on a web server
NigeyUK: gel@nigel-desktop:~$ uptime
NigeyUK: 16:26:16 up 34 min, 3 users, load average: 1.03, 0.98, 0.83
NigeyUK: thats my desktop
Nevtus: my desktop - 16:27:44 up 44 days, 19:49, 3 users, load average: 0.11, 0.04, 0.01
NigeyUK: 44 days :|
NigeyUK: i cant leave mine on overnight like i used to, the cat tries to attack the lights on the case in the dark..lol
Tuipveus: I remember when I had uptime of more than 497 with kernel 2.2 and it wrapped around :(
NigeyUK: the web server im on now has wrapped around
Tuipveus: which kernel version it has?
NigeyUK: Linux alpha.rimacs.co.uk 2.4.21-27.0.2.EL #1 Wed Jan 12 23:46:37 EST 2005 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux
mastertheknife: NigeyUK: oh thats a dedicated box? I thought its just a webserver and all you got was ftp
NigeyUK: nooo, thats got about 100 websites on it .. lol
mastertheknife: Me and a friend used to pay for our own dedicated server in germany
Tuipveus: Rhel must have something "special" because kernel-developer promised for me that it is fixed in 2.4-versions
NigeyUK: a good site by a friend of mine i host www.ch-hangar.com
mastertheknife: we had a 30 player killing floor server on it
NigeyUK: i had loads of dedicated at 1 point
Tuipveus: NigeyUK: are you sure that it wrapped and server didnt boot? :)
s_20: 17:29:25 Irssi uptime: 597d 4h 23m 23s
NigeyUK: i still have 2 physical servers in storage at docklands redbus .. think their dell sc1425's
s_20: and that's just irssi itself ;)
NigeyUK: Tuipveus, positive, that servers not rebooted without my knowledge
mastertheknife: If i had fast internet (few megabits upstream) i wouldnt need to pay for a dedicated server
NigeyUK: irssi is solid as a rock lol
mastertheknife: can just buy my own box, UPS and good to go
s_20: which proves that there are nearly no memleaks in glib (which irssi uses)
NigeyUK: yup master
NigeyUK: dont think glib has ever had a huge memorly leak issue ?
mastertheknife: I mean, for game servers, 99.99% uptime is not that importatn
mastertheknife: 95-99% uptime would be fine
NigeyUK: yeah id even say 90 - 99%
mastertheknife: I actually have a box in the house that runs 247
s_20: NigeyUK: i think it's still very impressive that it didn't leak (in any noticeable way) in 1.5 years
mastertheknife: Its a gentoo box used for CCTV
NigeyUK: s_20, me to m8, cant fault it!
NigeyUK: aha! cctv via capture card ?
mastertheknife: runs ZoneMinder and has a 8 port BNC capture card
mastertheknife: (8 bt878 chips)
NigeyUK: awsome :D
NigeyUK: bt878 .. that philips chips ?
Tuipveus: anyway, either that comment or units are wrong on your website
mastertheknife: bought few 520tvl bullet-shape cameras for like $80/each and they work well
Tuipveus: please fix it
NigeyUK: i have a Ir cctv cam i use for astronomy
mastertheknife: no its something else but the bttv driver is used for it, which is very stable driver
mastertheknife: this makes me wonder
Tuipveus: I have 4 or 5 bt878
NigeyUK: Tuipveus, good point, about the graph
mastertheknife: can a 1.4 GHz host a small tf2 server ?
NigeyUK: should do
mastertheknife: of like 4-5 players
NigeyUK: its more about the memory than the proc speed when hosting game servers
mastertheknife: 768 mb ram :S
NigeyUK: 768 for upto 16 man would be fine
mastertheknife: 16 or even 12 would be lovely
mastertheknife: but i dont have that much upload
NigeyUK: it'd definately do 12 nicely
NigeyUK: DOD:S is a bitch though
FliPPeh: DoD:S is okay
NigeyUK: that server seems to need twice as much ram than a tf2 / cs:s
FliPPeh: ... what are we talking about?
mastertheknife: man Killing Floor was way worse
mastertheknife: that game is designed for 6 players
mastertheknife: and we hacked it to make a 30 player server
NigeyUK: lol ouch
mastertheknife: the problem is that the engine can't take advantage of multi core
mastertheknife: it only used 1 core of the Q6600
NigeyUK: ah that sucks!
FliPPeh: Oh yes, about wine multicore...
FliPPeh: Does it work?
mastertheknife: so even 30 player was like 90% utilizing the CPU
mastertheknife: It should work
NigeyUK: FliPPeh, isnt it still experimental?
FliPPeh: No idea :/
NigeyUK: anyone else getting fed up of the football already?
NigeyUK: sodding hate the world cup
FliPPeh: NigeyUK: You're speaking for me.
s_20: i decided i'd keep an open mind about that this time
s_20: going with the flow
FliPPeh: It's f******* annoying
FliPPeh: I want to destroy something - very hard.
NigeyUK: yes! annoys the shit out of me, everyone becomes a footy fan, and talks of nothing else, grrrrrrrrrr
FliPPeh: I hate the Vuvuzelas
s_20: it's also healthier not to get all worked up about it
FliPPeh: My neihboors roar it around...
s_20: it's here to stay for the next 4 weeks, one might as well get used to it
Daekdroom: I don't think I'll watch a single World Cup game..
NigeyUK: rather watch paint dry!
NigeyUK: or in my case, my new lawn..lol
Daekdroom: I rather stay here breaking my system on experimental stuff
NigeyUK: haha or there's that!
NigeyUK: i do have some IR astro images to process too, that takes a while
FullFlannelJacke: Football season hasnt started yet. Starts in Sept.
FliPPeh: Oh meh
FliPPeh: It's gonna be a mess tomorrow
FliPPeh: Germany's first game
FliPPeh: Guess where I am right now
FliPPeh: And guess how MUCH my neighboors like the football?
s_20: i'm amped!
FliPPeh: It's gonna be ugly
NigeyUK: lmao oh dear
NigeyUK: here, chill out and absorb the contents of this image
Daekdroom: I live in Brazil, where people put flags over their cars' hood :(
FliPPeh: Flags? Most cars here have 2 flags
s_20: NigeyUK: why is it that the url redirects to steamonlinux.com?
Daekdroom: and where I get to skip a few classes thank to the games :D
NigeyUK: well im in wales, and i cannot bring myself to support england..
NigeyUK: oh hang on s_20
NigeyUK: forgot about that
Daekdroom: For example, this next friday, I'll have school from 7:30AM to 10:00AM
mastertheknife: school lol
s_20: NigeyUK: that might be a weird question, but does wales actually have its own team or is it one team for the whole of the uk?
NigeyUK: yeah we have our own, so does scotland, and northern ireland, wales are just to crap to qualify lol
NigeyUK: try now dude
s_20: NigeyUK: jesus, even north korea somehow got qualified ;)
NigeyUK: prolly threatened to nuke every1 ;)
s_20: then again.. god only knows what those poor sods had to go through to get where they are now
NigeyUK: dread to think, their goverment is all on crack i swear!
mastertheknife: North Korea? :|
mastertheknife: I dont know whats worse, Iran or North Korea
Daekdroom: mastertheknife, China is
Daekdroom: They have slavery!
mastertheknife: Iran is a funny country with their monkey president but North Korea is dead silent about their intentions
s_20: mastertheknife: my educated guess would be iran, they actually ahve the means to do damage
s_20: north korea can't even feed its own people
NigeyUK: cant feed their people, but can afford to build nukes...
s_20: (i wonder how they even support their nuclear programme)
NigeyUK: how fucked up is that
Azerthoth: religion and food, 2 most common causes of aggression in history
NigeyUK: yup, totally agree
Daekdroom: uh, you forgot power, Azerthoth
NigeyUK: dont get me started on religion
s_20: NigeyUK: well those stars are definitely.. shiny
Daekdroom: "How come I don't have the whole Europe? ATTACK THEM!"
NigeyUK: haha not all are stars ;)
Azerthoth: Daekdroom, power is a recent thing
mastertheknife: Iran is now using israel an excuse for their nuclear program, they are saying to the US, how come you aren't saying anything about israel's nuclear program? but israel has nukes since the 60's :S
Daekdroom: Azerthoth, well, indeed..
NigeyUK: that image has about 150 various deep sky objects, quasars, galaxies, supernovae remnants etc etc
s_20: mastertheknife: given its (recent) track record it's kinda hard to defend isreal politically
NigeyUK: religion, and bloodshed, come hand in hand, you cant have 1 without the other, this is the world we live in, it always has been, and always will be :(
s_20: NigeyUK: are you some sort of astronomer or is it more of a hobby?
Daekdroom: NigeyUK, when was that pciture taken?
NigeyUK: hobby, but i am studing astrophysics to
NigeyUK: Daekdroom, that was 14th may, its a series of 6 images combined, each image a 15minute exposure, 5 clear filter images, and 1 infra red image
Daekdroom: NigeyUK, ah, I knew there was something unusual about all that visible stuff :P
NigeyUK: let me show u some interesting objects from that image.. 2 secs
s_20: NigeyUK: finally the day has come when all the studying pays off and you can brag ;)
NigeyUK: haha s_20 not quite there yet, thermodynamics etc still puzzle me
s_20: what semester are you in?
NigeyUK: and just to put that image into context, most of the faint objects are approximately 9 billion light years away, so err, your seeing back in time about 9 billion years in that image
NigeyUK: s_20, 2nd year starts in september
Daekdroom: ooo NGC 4290 is a galaxy
NigeyUK: thats 1 of the closer objects, about 145million light years
NigeyUK: a poor quality colour image of the same galaxy
NigeyUK: the SDSS labels are quasars, their the really really old things
NigeyUK: http://www.nigey.co.uk/images/M94-Processed.jpg .. a nice image of M94 i need to re-process
FullFlannelJacke: astrophysics is fun
NigeyUK: it can be, when you're not getting lost in the math lol
FliPPeh: TF2 bots are stupid :/
FliPPeh: They always lose
mastertheknife: lol why do you play with bots
FliPPeh: mastertheknife: Testing how TF2 runs
FliPPeh: When I disable CPU frequency scaling, it runs pretty nice
FliPPeh: Eee PC 1005PE vs 1015PE...
FliPPeh: If 1015 has Draft-N WiFi, I'm so getting it.
Daekdroom: Draft-N WiFi?
mastertheknife: Wireless N isnt that big deal as people like to make it
FliPPeh: I have an N-Card
FliPPeh: In my other laptop
mastertheknife: 802.11g is fast enough for most people
FliPPeh: It tops any other WiFi I've ever had
mastertheknife: im trying to fix tf2
mastertheknife: doing system update including wine update and disabling settings that i changed lately in attempt to find out whats messing up tf2
mastertheknife: hopefully its gonna work :P
mastertheknife: what are your favorite maps ?
FliPPeh: dustbowl, badwater, goldrush :)
FliPPeh: badwater most of all
mastertheknife: I havent played badwater and goldrush i think
mastertheknife: but i really like 2fort, eygpt and sawmill
mastertheknife: egypt is one awesome map
mastertheknife: although it seems that inside its actually 3 maps
FliPPeh: Sawmill is fun
FliPPeh: Every few minutes you hear "zzttt" and someone writing "damn blades"
FliPPeh: Mostly me
mastertheknife: ever played egypt ?
mastertheknife: I actually played egypt in 3 different places.. strange
FliPPeh: once or twice
FliPPeh: It's like dustbowl
mastertheknife: it seems that map has multiple maps inside
FliPPeh: Multi part map
mastertheknife: yesterday i played in some map which i dont know its name
mastertheknife: but i started hearing a train alarm
mastertheknife: and the next thing i saw was myself being ran over by a train
FliPPeh: Probably 2fort
FliPPeh: Or some custom version
FliPPeh: There's a fun map called trainwars :)
FliPPeh: The control point is on a moving train that drives in a circle around both team's camps
mastertheknife: thats probably that
mastertheknife: there are actually many train rails in that map
FliPPeh: Nah, only one
mastertheknife: seems like a train hangar
mastertheknife: ah different map then
FliPPeh: Unknown to me :)
mastertheknife: NigeyUK how its going with the pulseaudio removal? does ubuntu even come with alsa
Daekdroom: Of course it comes with Alsa
Daekdroom: Alsa is part of the kernel and used by pulse
mastertheknife: Oh no idea how pulse works
mastertheknife: never had it installed here
Daekdroom: I wish Ubuntu would use OSSv4 =/
mastertheknife: alsa + oss emulations works nicely here
Daekdroom: Too bad Ubuntu doesn't integrate well with anything but pulseaudio
Daekdroom: But PA isn't that evil.. It only has.. very high latency xD
mastertheknife: the only problem i ever had with alsa is the card's order, i have 2 sound cards installed, adding index= to the options in alsa.conf fixed that
djura-san: im off. have a nice chat and veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery hot day :)
s_20: Daekdroom: be careful what you wish for..
Daekdroom: s_20, OSSv4 is much better than ALSA..
s_20: Daekdroom: and how good is its alsa emulation?
Daekdroom: s_20, fully compatible, as far as I know.
Daekdroom: s_20, Alsa API can communicate with OSS back-end
s_20: Daekdroom: well.. it's still idiotic to have yet another sound system just for the sake of per app volume control
mastertheknife: Linux's audio is a complete mess
s_20: mastertheknife: my point exactly
Daekdroom: s_20, OSSv4 is already there..
s_20: Daekdroom: as long as it's not adopted by most major distros it's just making everything worse
mastertheknife: I used to think that ALSA is better and OSS is outdated, and that every new program is being coded for ALSA now, but now with OSSv4, things are becoming very messy
mastertheknife: Per app volume control is not that great
mastertheknife: Who needs so many volume sliders, you got one on your speakers\amp, one in your alsa\sound card mixer, and usually one in the program too
mastertheknife: No wonder we don't steam for linux
mastertheknife: we don't have*
mastertheknife: Valve will have to decide what API they're going to use, alsa, oss or pulseaudio. hopefully they'll use alsa or oss, but not pulseaudio
s_20: mastertheknife: i don't think they'll use any audio server
Daekdroom: Definitely Alsa for now.
s_20: it makes things more complicated when you want to be as fast as possible
mastertheknife: thats true, and thats also a problem with linux audio
mastertheknife: in windows there is directsound which is low latency
mastertheknife: but in linux.. nothing that i know of
mastertheknife: well i heard of jack
s_20: i'm quite sure they'll settle for alsa
s_20: they *do* have an mp3 licence too iirc, so there's no point in using any 3rd party software for that either
Rednaxela: IMHO the only credible alternative for Valve to use than direct ALSA, would be apis like SDL or OpenAL which are pretty standard and will have whatever backend is needed well into the future
monreal: the pulseaudio api was not made to be used directly by games
Azerthoth: s/directly by games/at all
monreal: well Azerthoth that is obviously not correct
monreal: it was not done to be used by end user apps, directly
Azerthoth: monreal, pulse is too immature to be relied upon in a stable production envrironment
monreal: fwiw it works great here
Azerthoth: 'works for me' is not a valid denial of bugs, it's an excuse to not worry about them
monreal: I had various problems at first as well, I filed bugs, the maintainer was very responsive and helpful and now all my problems are gone
FliPPeh: Just found out that the DVD drive in my Laptop lets me change it's region code up to five (count it, FIVE) times
FliPPeh: And then never again
FliPPeh: That's bullshit
FliPPeh: Should be illegal if you ask me
FliPPeh: They are ASKING me to pirate movies
FliPPeh: No, forcing.
Nevtus: FliPPeh: DVD drives have always done that
Daekdroom: That limit shouldn't be too hard to bypass..
Daekdroom: or is it?
monreal: Daekdroom: easiest way to bypass is not to set a region and fake it using software
monreal: if you actually set the region and reach the limit, that's it
Daekdroom: monreal, so that region limit is actually done fully on hardware? Amazing
Azalyn: FliPPeh: lolz, welcome to 1998, man.
Nevtus: yup, amazing people out there still don't already know about this
Azalyn: you can flash the drive with rpc1 firmware which will remove that.
Azalyn: or just use libdvdcss on linux, which will usually always be able to hack around the region coding protection.
Azalyn: i imagine the same hacks work in windows with media player classic and other free players.
FliPPeh: Yea, I'll set it to "Free" and never use any non-faking players again
FliPPeh: I always knew about the region code thing
FliPPeh: But not about the limit and hardware saving
Azalyn: with rpc1, the firmware never even checked the region, they just relied on software dvd players to block the content in certain regions. they figured that since most software is proprietary, that this would work.
FliPPeh: Sloppy design
Azalyn: but yeah, didn't work that way. so they started using rpc2 firmware, which essentially implements region checking in the drive itself, and the drive can only change regions 5 times.
FliPPeh: Should be illegal
FliPPeh: But hey - let's pirate
Ivanovic: many players can be made region free by using the correct "magic numbers"
FliPPeh: Not that I buy DVDs... my girlfriend did
Azalyn: it is illegal in some places. which is why rpc1 firmwares exist.
Azalyn: in those places, the manufacturer cannot sell the drive if it has rpc2 firmware.
monreal: if they think it helps, let them do it. this is exactly the reason why I don't own any newer video game consoles... I want to be able to play imported games, but they won't let me. so, no deal
Azalyn: so they have to use rpc1. some people will just dump that firmware, and distribute it online, and then you can download it and make your drive rpc1
FliPPeh: Probably gonna do that
FliPPeh: I've never been a fan of DVD as movie and BluRay..
FliPPeh: Just encode everything in OGG Theora
Azalyn: but even rpc2 as implemented in the dvd specifications is vulnerable to a hack that most common players today use, which allows you to view dvd's anyways. so it's a complete non-issue... unless you're using something like powerdvd which is a proprietary dvd player app, and therefore "respects" the rules.
FliPPeh: Yes, it's powerdvd.
FliPPeh: Like Nero, I hate it
Ivanovic: Azalyn: regarding powerdvd you can just rely on something like anydvd which makes the regio code basically disappear...
Azalyn: some vendors have gone beyond rpc2 though, and have implemented their own firmware which is tougher than rpc2, and not hackable.
Azalyn: Ivanovic: yes, let's buy more software, that's certainly the right solution. :)
Ivanovic: honestly, why use windows for videoplayback at all?
Azalyn: or rather, i should say... not hackable unless you want to grab yourself an assembler and write your own firmware for it. good luck with that.
FliPPeh: Ivanovic: Girlfriend doesn't understand linux.
FliPPeh: So I had to boot windows.
Azalyn: just install xpde
Azalyn: "wow, what did you do to my windows, it's so fast!"
Daekdroom: Or use some of those weird tutos to turn KDE4 into Win7, or GNOME into Vista.
Azalyn: and uh... ogg theora? dude.
Azalyn: at least use vp8.
Azalyn: although i'd wait for vp8 encoders to mature first.
monreal: the vp8 encoder is mature... just slow... slooooooooooooooooow.......
Azalyn: h264 will be 'free as in beer' until like uh, 2012-2013 i think. so you could use that too if it's just for a personal encode.
Daekdroom: What will happen then, Azalyn?
Azalyn: and furthermore, if you are willing to *pirate* media, like you've just said, then why the hell are you worrying about using a patented codec?
Azalyn: if you're not worried about the law, then just go ahead and use the x264 encoder, it is better than anything else out there right now.
Azalyn: Daekdroom: the MPAA breaks into your house, rapes you in the ass, and steals all your stuff. and before they leave, they put your pet dog/cat/whatever in the microwave and laugh at you.
Daekdroom: Ah, no biggie
Azalyn: at least that's what they say in the EULA.
Azalyn: there may be hidden clauses too though.
Daekdroom: I don't recall reading an EULA..
Daekdroom: Well, it may have been prompted to me..
Daekdroom: accepts EULAs without reading them
Azalyn: it's watermarked in all h264 files in a way that makes it impossible to read or even know it's there.
Azalyn: i'm a time traveller from the future, where the digital apocalypse has already occurred, that's how i know about it.
Daekdroom: A Time traveller? Like Doctor Who? :D
Azalyn: sort of, except that i'm doctor wut.
Daekdroom: Do you have a spaceship disguised as a Police Phone Box from the 50s? :D
Azalyn: no, the show is kind of unrealistic in that respect. it looks more like the goa'uld motherships from stargate. only with time travel capabilities.
Daekdroom: Haven't watched Stargate.
Azalyn: another difference is that my travelling companion and i are lesbians.
FliPPeh: ... wait a minute...
Aondo: aah qnet
Aondo: ooops wrong window :P
FliPPeh: qnet is teh sux
RambJoe: wtf when did valve cancel e3
zak1111: they did?
GNU\colossus: do AM3 Athlon CPUs (the AMD Athlon II X2 235e in particular) support ECC DDR3-SDRAM (given the very same board supports ECC-DIMM with phenom CPUs)?
FliPPeh: AM3 = DDR3
FliPPeh: Should be
Daekdroom: Yeah, FliPPeh, but the memory controller is inside the CPU
Daekdroom: It's a matter whether Athlon II X2's controller is the very same as phenom's or not
Daekdroom: I'm looking at AMD's website
Daekdroom: Huh, didn't find it there xD
Daekdroom: Gonna try to dig deeper
GNU\colossus: Daekdroom: the problem with AMD's online presence is that it's utter shite
Daekdroom: Type of Memory Supported
Daekdroom: Support for unregistered DIMMs up to
Daekdroom: PC2-6400 (DDR2-800MHz) -AND- PC3-8500 (DDR3-1066MHz)
GNU\colossus: I couldn't dig deep enough there to find info on what I'm interested in
Daekdroom: Phenom's page doesn't mention ECC either
Daekdroom: Which means the website doesn't actually give info regarding that xD
orm: greetings #phoronix
RambJoe: that shit about e3 being cancled was false btw
RambJoe: valves e3
RambJoe: not e3
orm: thinks valve be trollan
dandel: GNU\colossus, am3 board and cpu is ddr3, but an am3 cpu with am2 board is ddr2.
dandel: also, if your looking for the best bang for the buck, the Athlon II x4 line is the best choice.
dandel: Daekdroom, I think only the Opteron chips support ecc memory.