bluekoala: And just so you know, Phoronix is my main source of valve news
bluekoala: My other source is the guy in the next cubicle at work
Zerb_Riss: lol
Wicked: i think its pretty clear that whatever news about steam on linux was posted was non official and not to reliable
Wicked: its been days with no news updates.
Galaxy|: hardly
Galaxy|: they only took the linux client off the air yesterday morning
Galaxy|: they do 2-3 updates a day for osx and win32
Wicked: but still.
Rednaxela: And that it's 403'ed would suggest it's still getting updates to those inside Valve
Wicked: no one at steam has announced it.
Wicked: and the reports that where posted said they had
Wicked: dont get me wrong...i certainly hope valve is working on a linux port
Galaxy|: ill just have to tear into the binaries and start issuing SOAP requests
Wicked: but...i for one....am not getting my hopes up
Galaxy|: that'll get me their client manifests again
Galaxy|: I didn't want to have to resort to that but oh well
Zerb_Riss: so does anyone know how to get HDMI audio forwarding properly in KDE?
Zerb_Riss: I can't get video sound to go out of the HDMI
Zerb_Riss: nevermind I got it but it's a horrible hack
bluekoala: Rednaxela: It doesn't suggest that; the anticipation and hopes give you the feeling it does
bluekoala: There's really no way to know
bluekoala: Unless you're actually working on it or making the decisions in that regard
Zerb_Riss: Roughly two thirds of all Steam Mac users are running on a laptop.
Zerb_Riss: lol
bluekoala: I wouldn't want a Mac desktop
bluekoala: Are you f'n crazy?
bluekoala: lol
Zerb_Riss: don't most mac laptops have Intel GMA in them?
bluekoala: Probably
bluekoala: You can play in sh*t mode just fine
Zerb_Riss: sounds great for playing games.................
Zerb_Riss: I don't think Intel GMA would even work on Mac
cmdrk: non-pro, pre-unibody mac laptops were all intel GMA
Zerb_Riss: at least for source games
Tazer: I use a macbook late 2008
Tazer: Played fine on Windows 7
Tazer: Up to L4D2
Tazer: The hardware isn't particularly high end but it's not as bad as people make it out to be
Zerb_Riss: define "fine" because 20fps at 640x480 isn't very good for me
Zerb_Riss: I have an intel GMA in my laptop
Zerb_Riss: it is turds
bluekoala: Tazer: Wine doesn't have great Dx9 support as opposed to 8.3
bluekoala: L4D had no DX 8.3 support
Tazer: I could run up to 1200x800 with high settings and everything and I got good enough fps
Zerb_Riss: I tried playing Plants Vs. Zombies through wine on my laptop
Tazer: like high texture shading and stuff
Zerb_Riss: it ran at like 15 fps
Tazer: bluekoala: i specifically said on windows 7, via bootcamp
Zerb_Riss: and PvZ isn't exactly a demanding game :p
Tazer: Wine has never worked very well for me.
Tazer: I DID however get wine working when I first started out(Crossover specifically)
Tazer: and it worked with Team Fortress 2
Tazer: but later when I started dual booting the performance difference was enough to blow me away
DeathCrawler: meh wine
Zerb_Riss: wine is pretty slow
Tazer: ^pretty much my thoughts on wine
Zerb_Riss: it's not much of an alternative to windows
Tazer: It's great in what it does, I guess? But it just doesn't work very well for me
DeathCrawler: Windows sucks... but is the number one.
DeathCrawler: sad... *sign*
Tazer: Even so I'd kill to get Osu! to work on windows right now
Tazer: er, on wine
bluekoala: Wine is like a steam train with tires on the road; it kinda works
Tazer: Now don't be too mean to it :P
Tazer: It's better than nothing, I guess
bluekoala: I use it for plants vs zombies, I love it :P
bluekoala: And diablo2
bluekoala: I think I like Diablo2 better via wine than on windows
Tazer: I'm still trying to get it to work for Osu!
Tazer: It's really tragic too because the only Windows game I really use lately is Osu!, I don't find myself playing L4D2 or TF2 very often even when I was on windows
Tazer: and I have os x for steam
Tazer: so if osu! would only work on linux I could get rid of my useless windows partition
bluekoala: What's osu?
Tazer: Don't suppose you use a DS very often?
bluekoala: No
bluekoala: Is it the first link that google brought me?
Tazer: Right
Tazer: No probably around the fourth
bluekoala: That sounds like singing japanese schoolgirls?
Tazer: It's a music rhmeythm ga
Tazer: music rhythm game*
bluekoala: Oh ya that's the one
Tazer: Yup
bluekoala: lol
Tazer: I know how it looks but that's mostly just the community ;w;
bluekoala: Isn't there a DS emulator out there?
Tazer: Oh
bluekoala: There's a DS emulator in the ubuntu software center
Tazer: Oh dear no, I you've got Osu! Takatae! Ouendan. that's a DS game, yes, but Osu! Is a PC version where you can make your own song maps that's driven by the community
Tazer: I believe you've*
Tazer: http://osu.ppy.sh/
bluekoala: That's exactly where I was
bluekoala: I clicked on the video
Tazer: Oh. Right ;w;
Tazer: Then yeah it's that, but it's not for the DS
bluekoala: I got scared into stopping it
Tazer: The animes get pretty bad, yeah
bluekoala: Can you use custom songs?
Tazer: Every song is a custom song. it's driven entirely by the community
bluekoala: Ok
bluekoala: What platform does it run on?
bluekoala: Windows ok
Tazer: so far? PC. But there's a port for OS X and Linux for Mono planned
bluekoala: I own a pc
bluekoala: And it won't run on it
Tazer: I mean windows, yeah ;w;
bluekoala: Since when is Windows a pc anyway?
bluekoala: kk :P
Tazer: Since it's 2 in the morning and my face is literally a hose
bluekoala: PC in the 80's and 90's was an acronym for : Not Mac
bluekoala: :P
Tazer: :p
Tazer: but ye-oh jesus fuck
Tazer: Mighty Mighty Bosstones beatmap
Tazer: noooooooooo
bluekoala: There's a really cool game on steam right now
bluekoala: It's called "Beat Hazard"
bluekoala: It creates seizures
bluekoala: For the epileptic
Tazer: Awesome
bluekoala: You just pick an MP3 you like
bluekoala: And play it
bluekoala: It's like asteroids
Tazer: I supposedly had epilepsy before
bluekoala: Smoke pot, it gets rid of it for the most part
Tazer: Oh my god
Tazer: I'm looking at it now
Tazer: this is amazing
Tazer: Maybe once I get into college
bluekoala: ...
bluekoala: How old are you?
Tazer: 16
bluekoala: Ok
bluekoala: I am not responsible for what I say online btw
Tazer: Of course
bluekoala: Glad we're clear on that
Tazer: I'd tell you the disclaimer isn't necessary, but it never hurts to be safe I guess
bluekoala: lol ya
Tazer: Back to Beat Hazard, though
Tazer: Is it completely afilliated to Steam or is there a chance of a linux version on the side, do you know? U:
kurros: its on the 360 so i gues
kurros: i think its built in C# and XNA so depending on what features its using could either be a little work or a lot of work to get it running under Mono and Linux/OS X
Tazer: U:
kurros: if it depends on DirectX shortcuts a lot definitely a lot of work. if they planned accordingly and it's somewhat abstracted and support using a library that uses GL easily, a little less work.
kurros: hmm thats poorly worded but you get the idea
kurros: XNA makes some things ridiculously easy
kurros: its a pretty spiffy toolkit
Zerb_Riss: it's nice but it's yet another control measure from microsoft tryign to lock people into their proprietary crap
kurros: ok
The_Muh: hey guys
The_Muh: what do you think about german music?
The_Muh: (and which bands do you know?)
kurros: hmm
Zerb_Riss: the sad thing is that XNA especially is just way easier to use than OpenGL is
kurros: is Apocalyptica german? i think they might be finnish actually
The_Muh: apocalyptica is finnish
Tazer: I think
The_Muh: but afaik they like germany
Tazer: i think it's pretty sad that I just sneezed so hard it hurt my shoulders
The_Muh: Tazer: extrem-sneezing? you read "making money" ?
Tigge: so.. Scorpions is German I guess
Zerb_Riss: Tazer: I HATE when that happens
The_Muh: no1 knows the "good" bands...
Tigge: Kraftwerk also
Tigge: hm..
Tazer: ;w; I know Zerb_Riss
Tazer: stupid
Tazer: allergies
Tazer: whyyy
The_Muh: Unheilig, Oomph! (you know rammstein? they are fans of Oomph!)...
Tigge: Rammstein is famous too yeah
Megagun: Steam works yet? ::P
Tazer: gives up any sense of decency, begins using shirt as napkin
Tazer: eats cocoa pebbles laced with tears
Tazer: oh god my shoulders
The_Muh: Tazer: cut them off
The_Muh: is searching a knife
Tazer: I really am tempted but then how will i play my shiny steam linux games later
Tigge: Fools Garden, Genghis Kahn (but now I'm cheating), heh
Tigge: Oh, we stopped doing the band thing?
The_Muh: Tigge: Fools Garden? whats?
The_Muh: *that
kurros: oh Kraftwerk. and Tokio Hotel
kurros: not that those two are related
kurros: besides being german
Tigge: Fools Garden did Lemon Tree, huuuuge song in Sweden
Tigge: Tokio Hotel is quite famous too yes
The_Muh: tokio hotel sucks
Tigge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-a9mzEeqfk
The_Muh: no1 likes these guys here (except emos)
Tigge: yeah, but those emos are everwhere!
kurros: i like them. though i tend to like a lot of tween music I guess
The_Muh: ah.. lemon tree xD
The_Muh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKhV5OZrcjk
The_Muh: Oomph! <3
Tigge: they where the "sommarplåga" of the year 1996 I think
Tigge: one of these songs just played the whole summer, *everywhere*.
The_Muh: sommarplaga? sounds like "sommer plage" (summer plague)
Tigge: The_Muh: that is exactly what is :)
The_Muh: here we called it "summer hit"
Tigge: ah, but those songs tend to be bad so we usually call them plauge here
The_Muh: lol
The_Muh: funny people =)
Tigge: haha, yeah :)
Tigge: Well, I'm off! bbl
The_Muh: bye bye
Sleepy_Coder: listens to http://re-written.org/music/Blue%20October/Blue%20October-Foiled-05-Hate%20Me.mp3
Sleepy_Coder: <3
Tazer: I feel so out of place in the foreign rock discussion ;w;
Tazer: listens to more mama cass
Sleepy_Coder: <3
Sleepy_Coder: I feel funny ;p A friend had a birthday today and in the car he kissed me :x
Sleepy_Coder: Was listening to ^ song
Tazer: O:
Sleepy_Coder: I was just trying to hug him... but he kissed me :\
Tazer: Do you like him~
Sleepy_Coder: not sure what I'm supposed to do now, but yay blue October :}
Sleepy_Coder: I like him as a friend..
Sleepy_Coder: He's pretty hot too :p Just not attracted in *that* way :3
Tazer: O: Was he drunk
Sleepy_Coder: Good song though :p
Sleepy_Coder: Nope, he was driving XD
Tazer: Then gawd
Sleepy_Coder: Yep :}
Tazer: I guess you'll have to have the friend zone talk ;w;
Sleepy_Coder: Was a good kiss :p
Sleepy_Coder: He tastes like starburst.
Sleepy_Coder: (no joke, I love the cherry starburst)
Galaxy|: http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tech/2010/05/19/dnt.kgo.apple.no.cash.KGO
Tazer: Wait, people can taste like candies?
Galaxy|: ^ that makes me hate apple even more
Tazer: I probably taste like skittles.
Sleepy_Coder: People can taste like many things :p
Tazer: or chocolate.
Tazer: I need to find a cute redhead boy who's sexually confused and tastes like skittles, now
Tazer: my optimal mate has been narrowed down even further ;w;
Sleepy_Coder: He told me to go home and send him a picture of myself :x nekkid and such
Sleepy_Coder: I have awesomely weird friends :D
Tazer: *gasp*
Tazer: oh no!
Tazer: you can't sext him
Tazer: sexting is a sin!
The_Muh: Tazer: oO he tastes like skittles? wtf
Sleepy_Coder: Btw, that was on the news. Apple accepts caxsh now and gave the woman a free iPad
Tazer: He has to taste like skittles
Tazer: He doesn't actually seem to exist. here. yet.
Sleepy_Coder: tastes Tazer's rainbow
Sleepy_Coder: :p
The_Muh: Tazer: dont eat boys =)
Tazer: boys are the best to eat
Tazer: is the most delicious rainbow
Sleepy_Coder: sings the Willy Wonka song
The_Muh: [Subway to Sally - Krähenfraß] ...
The_Muh: (song about 2 crows eating a fallen soldier)
Tazer: I'm pretty fucking sure i'm turning into an x-man
Sleepy_Coder: Spandex included?
Tazer: and my mutant super power is having my nose liquefy
Tazer: grossest super power ever
Sleepy_Coder: not sexy :<
Tazer: Tell me about it ):
Sleepy_Coder: puts a zip-lock bag over Tazer's head
Tazer: drowns
kurros: you know with SteamPlay becoming synonymous with "OS X Version" I wonder how thats going to get handled if there is a Linux client
Sleepy_Coder: runs off to use the services
Tazer: Okay
Tazer: why did an elder god chant show up in the irc?
The_Muh: someone here living in norway?
Sleepy_Coder: NO ONE LIVES IN NORWAY
The_Muh: damn
Sleepy_Coder: norway is a real-life darknet :p
The_Muh: i should go to norway - a country for me alone would be nice =)
Sleepy_Coder: too small, need to keep you at least 10 miles away from any human
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: buy a little island in the middle of one ocean
Sleepy_Coder: which ocean? all the little islands in the atlantic are near florida
The_Muh: hm
The_Muh: or build a sheld on the mount everest
The_Muh: sometimes you got guests but most of the year you are alone
Sleepy_Coder: too warm for my tastes.
The_Muh: southpole?
Sleepy_Coder: bad neighborhood :p
The_Muh: northpole?
The_Muh: south pole == penguins, but no icebears
The_Muh: norht pole == icebears, but no penguins
Sleepy_Coder: oh god I lol'd
Sleepy_Coder: A friend sent me creepy gay pr0n fanfic titled "The Last Boybender"
The_Muh: wtf
Sleepy_Coder: I am going to cry the day the movie comes out
Sleepy_Coder: (Airbender)
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: sry for the question... but: you're female, right?
Sleepy_Coder: is quite male :p
The_Muh: sry
The_Muh: just a guess...
Sleepy_Coder: Weird how you think there are gals on the internet.
The_Muh: hope =)
The_Muh: xD
Sleepy_Coder: In answer to your unasked question, I am bi :p
The_Muh: ah...
Sleepy_Coder: Only ever liked 2 girls and 2 guys though, most people piss me off XD
The_Muh: most people are hearing the wrong music ...
Sleepy_Coder: eh? :p
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: a girl: intelligent, cute, friendly - all you wish. but: she is fan of Tokio Hotel
The_Muh: (for example)
The_Muh: that sucks
Sleepy_Coder: is attracted to impossibly innocent/sweet people :p
Sleepy_Coder: well hrrm, doesn't have to be innocent I guess, but I just couldn't imagine being in a relationship with someone who would argue with you even once
The_Muh: innocent people? afaik they dont exist...
Sleepy_Coder: My standards might be a little high :3
The_Muh: my too... single since 2 years...
Sleepy_Coder: own't
Sleepy_Coder: I mean so sad :(
The_Muh: xD
Sleepy_Coder: :D
The_Muh: i'm a freak... so i dont have any chance to get a girlfriend
Sleepy_Coder: I just... I put up with a lot of yelling people :p can't imagine being close to someone who yells at me, even if the one and only argument gets resolved, i don't want to be in love with someone who chooses to start that sort of... unpleasantness?
The_Muh: programming, linux, pen and paper rpgs, atheist, the music i'm listening...
Sleepy_Coder: I appreciate logical people :p Ones that want the problem fixed without having to guilt others into never doing x or y again. :p I know a lot of people like that. Reasoning is far better than drama-starters, imo.
The_Muh: wow... i understand the half... xD
Sleepy_Coder: Wouldn't it be great if you could be married to someone for over 60 years and have never heard their negative tone of voice, never heard them scream, never seen them glare at you? Would be nice, though it sounds a bit far-fetched... :p
Morten_: a bit?
Morten_: =)
Sleepy_Coder: Just a bit :}
Sleepy_Coder: The 2 girls I liked were impossibly sweet. :3 You could act like a total jackass and they'd just smile :3 One changed, one moved away... sort of sucks :p
Sleepy_Coder: Might only be a temporary thing, but I wouldn't feel bad about waiting half my life to find another girl like that :p
The_Muh: cut off your... and be asexual
Sleepy_Coder: hahaha
The_Muh: so you dont have to wait
giselher: any Steam news?
Sleepy_Coder: Steam rises :p
The_Muh: opened the valve, but the pipe is empty - no steam inside
Sleepy_Coder: Steam powers some locomotives :D
The_Muh: my computer is running with steam-power
giselher: oh, no steam for linux confirmed? XD
Sleepy_Coder: Nope, but Linux for Steam is confirmed :D
The_Muh: steam is just hot air...
The_Muh: xeno is much better
Sleepy_Coder: oh god.
Sleepy_Coder: oh god no.
Sleepy_Coder: wtf wtf wtf.
The_Muh: ?
Sleepy_Coder: I never downloaded Soulja Boy. WHERE IS IT COMING FROM?!
The_Muh: omfg... damn... someone attacks me with toxic gas
Sleepy_Coder: oh good found it.
Sleepy_Coder: closes Chrome
Sleepy_Coder: Too much ghetto.
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFCL_yHmSjk listen to this =)
Sleepy_Coder: Sounds very familiar...
The_Muh: =)
The_Muh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cjoLBz9pHs maybe you like this too
Sleepy_Coder: I love that I know anything I play is more accurately reproduced than what any of the equipment my friends have is capable of :p
Sleepy_Coder: wtf is this rammstein? :\
The_Muh: this is "unheilig"
Sleepy_Coder: feels a sudden urge to dismember things
The_Muh: sometimes hard to hear the difference
The_Muh: (hey, a joke: "this is unholy" xD)
Sleepy_Coder: craziness :p
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: whats about this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmYSQwD9nzI
Sleepy_Coder: is playing (for the first time) Killing Floor :3
Sleepy_Coder: Too much germans!
The_Muh: the name "killing floor" ... when i was 8 or 9 we had a game with this name...
Tigge: The_Muh: Die Toten Hosen is quite famous too
The_Muh: Tigge: and "die ärzte"?
The_Muh: funniest song in the universe is "meine ex(plodierte freundin)" [my ex(plodet girlfriend)]
Tigge: The_Muh: hm, haven't heard them
Tigge: We have some famous bands from my country to I guess
The_Muh: Tigge: where are you from?
Tigge: Sweden
The_Muh: hmm... dunno a band from sweden...
The_Muh: but some finnish bands
Tigge: Ah, they have some nice metal bands
Tigge: a lot of them
The_Muh: i know apocalyptica and HIM
Tigge: ahh.. but for Swedish music.. ABBA is quite famous, right?
The_Muh: oh - and lordi
Tigge: I've seen Apocalyptica live, they are niice :)
The_Muh: abba ... my mum likes abba
The_Muh: (my mum is 50 years old ... )
Kvisle: lordi are finish
Kvisle: oh, ignore
Kvisle: :P
Kvisle: didn't read it all
Tigge: hehe
Tigge: The Sounds, The Hives, Refused, Millencolin, The (International) Noise Conspiracy, Sahara Hotnights, The Hellacopters, Backyard Babies, Broder Daniel, Mando Diao, The Soundtrack of Our Lives, The Ark
The_Muh: about apocalyptica: i only like "plays metallica by four chellos", "cult" and "inquisition symphony"...
Tigge: The_Muh: yeah, I like the early stuff
The_Muh: Inquisition Symphony (the song) is godlike
Tigge: quite amazing what you can do with a Cello
Sleepy_Coder: oh my god.
Sleepy_Coder: 50-person Killing Floor servers.
Sleepy_Coder: mastertheknife: Let me repeat that. 50-PERSON KILLING FLOOR SERVERS.
The_Muh: i read that sometimes the bow breaks when they play the song inquisition symphony
The_Muh: (sry.. bad grammar)
Sleepy_Coder: I heard that god kills a kitten every time you masturbate :p
Tigge: The_Muh: np. Yeah I can imagine
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: so who is this god figure?
Sleepy_Coder: Oprah probably.
Tigge: yeah prblb
Tigge: She basically runs USA at least
The_Muh: awesome song... my mind blows away when i'm listen to it
Sleepy_Coder: http://popup.lala.com/popup/504684655013815018
Sleepy_Coder: Sounds. So good. On my headphones + sound card.
Tigge: omg, horrinle :o
Tigge: *horrible
Sleepy_Coder: I think you're just mad because it's not a very complicated song :p
Tigge: Sounds like they overuse some sort of "voice corrector"
Sleepy_Coder: That's what I originally thought :3
The_Muh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVPpKcmd0fY =)
Sleepy_Coder: http://www.cloogle.net/external/imogen_heap/Imogen%20Heap%20-%20Speak%20For%20Yourself/05%20Hide%20And%20Seek.mp3 I found it again :D
The_Muh: (studio-version is better... )
Sleepy_Coder: It made me cry when I heard it on... that weird movie with Reese Witherspoon where she went into a Coma and reappeared as some sort of astral projection to the guy who bought out her old apartment.
Sleepy_Coder: XD
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: wtf? strange music
Sleepy_Coder: Sounds sort of like a lullaby to me XD
Sleepy_Coder: Man, it is uber-hard to find an 80 Plus Gold rated PSU :(
Sleepy_Coder: For under $100.
Sleepy_Coder: With shipping of course.
The_Muh: my german music is much better
Sleepy_Coder: That I can pay for with Paypal.
Sleepy_Coder: And is not loud. Say under 30dB at full load.
Sleepy_Coder: F this.
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: I've seen that movie
Tigge: http://www.youtube.com/user/kentchannel#p/u/16/vuySB-2IOOY
Tigge: this is good
Sleepy_Coder: I forget what it's called :(
Tigge: quite emo but
The_Muh: ASP <3
Sleepy_Coder: die fgt.
Sleepy_Coder: Lua <3
The_Muh: the band, not the language
Sleepy_Coder: Oh goodie.
The_Muh: jacl <3
Sleepy_Coder: :}
Sleepy_Coder: still has to learn Squirrel
The_Muh: do you know jacl?
Tigge: Just Like Heaven?
Sleepy_Coder: That's it!
Sleepy_Coder: Don't know what JACL is though.
The_Muh: just another crappy language
Sleepy_Coder: sounds like an alias for C++
Sleepy_Coder: :p
Sleepy_Coder: hides
The_Muh: still beta
The_Muh: http://github.com/TheMuh/Just-Another-Crappy-Language
Sleepy_Coder: You committed a binary to github? :o
Sleepy_Coder: You wrote it in Visual Basic?
The_Muh: no
The_Muh: freebasic
Sleepy_Coder: ahh
Sleepy_Coder: Well I'm flacid.
The_Muh: a binary? where?
Sleepy_Coder: http://github.com/TheMuh/Just-Another-Crappy-Language/blob/master/jacl-interpreter
Sleepy_Coder: ?
The_Muh: damn oO
Tigge: So this USA thing, what is going on there?
Sleepy_Coder: Crap.
Sleepy_Coder: Where are all the 80 Plus Gold PSUs? :<
Tigge: Why is so many people unhappy about the health reform?
Sleepy_Coder: If I had my way I'd get a fanless PSU :(
Sleepy_Coder: Hard to find fanless PSUs @ >= 650 watts though :(
Sleepy_Coder: Tigge: I like the idea, but I doubt the money will be handled responsibly :(
Sleepy_Coder: Seems like all the countries we look down on have more responsible governments than ours.
The_Muh: updated... binary removed
Sleepy_Coder: We just know how to stick brainless twats in office that talk their way through our savings :(
Sleepy_Coder: But if it works, I'll be happy.
Sleepy_Coder: as long as they don't drastically raise taxes and the money actually goes toward providing health care for _US_ citizens.
The_Muh: no army - more money for the health of people =)
Sleepy_Coder: <3
Sleepy_Coder: I don't hate the army, I just think fighting makes too many martyrs out of people.
The_Muh: war is stupid
The_Muh: do you know the metallica-song "dispossable hero"?
Sleepy_Coder: I mean, just imagine if we never had a War on Terror. :( My dad always hates how liberal I sound, he says that if we had done that we'd be in worse shape now than we were then. HOWEVER, I think it would have made it harder for terrorists to gain support by calling themselves victims.
Sleepy_Coder: If only we had just stuck to protecting what is over here... we could have been the oh so helpless victims :(
Sleepy_Coder: But no, people died and my cousin can't walk anymore, yay freedom.
The_Muh: imo soldiers are stupid like a mile of
Sleepy_Coder: I'm sorry, this is a very heavy discussion i brought on in a channel where it is very off-topic :x *hides*
The_Muh: *like a mile of field road
The_Muh: hmm..
Sleepy_Coder: I hate 80 Plus Bronze PSUs :(
The_Muh: so discuss about the new kernel ...
Sleepy_Coder: They should have only let the Gold ones be the standard. 90% efficiency at full load or nothing!
The_Muh: *lets
asraniel: seems like vp8 is not that good (according to a x264 developer ;)
The_Muh: theora ftw
mikeplus64: ftw ftw
maligor: h.264 is a timebomb
The_Muh: google should buy every fucking media-codec and release it as open source
maligor: vp8 atleast has google interested in keeping it open
Sleepy_Coder: I would so do dirty things for Eric Schmidt if Google did that.
The_Muh: eric schmidt?
Sleepy_Coder: CEO of Google?
The_Muh: ah
The_Muh: the name sounds very german
Sleepy_Coder: Sounds very rich.
Sleepy_Coder: :p
The_Muh: schmidt is in german like smith in USA
The_Muh: *the
Sleepy_Coder: http://www.pacificgeek.com/product.asp?c=216&s=1067&ID=846498&P=F ahh, getting closer :D
The_Muh: what says the w3c about googles plans?
Sleepy_Coder: Personally, I hope JS and Flash die, but Apple and that other company are going about killing it entirely wrong :p
The_Muh: JS ? dont thing so...
Sleepy_Coder: It's just feeding opposition with the "you should be free to use whatever web technology you want" argument :p
The_Muh: but flash don't survive the next years
Sleepy_Coder: JS can die :p
Sleepy_Coder: Client-side scripting is fun, but only for displaying things, and JS isn't as widely supported as HTML or CSS ;p
The_Muh: java can die
Sleepy_Coder: Also a bit taxing on computers with silly GPUs
Sleepy_Coder: integrated or otherwise
Sleepy_Coder: Er... the cheap sort :p
Sleepy_Coder: remembers trying to view the dumb lightbox effects on his little laptop with a Celeron processor and some integrated Intel card :<
The_Muh: btw: my website is 100% valid html 4.01 and CSS - i like to anger IE-users
Sleepy_Coder: haaaaaaaa
Sleepy_Coder: :D
Sleepy_Coder: My website is quickly-thrown together XHTML...some-standard :p
The_Muh: xhtml is evil for IE-users
Sleepy_Coder: I used to know the site that showcased all the inconsistencies with Javascript...
Sleepy_Coder: It was quite appalling..
The_Muh: does exist an official javascript-specification?
Sleepy_Coder: Don't think so..
Sleepy_Coder: let's lookie
The_Muh: same problem like ruby... xD
Sleepy_Coder: ECMAScript :<
The_Muh: btw... i should write a jacl-specification
Sleepy_Coder: "Microsoft Windows allows JavaScript source files on a computer's hard drive to be launched as general-purpose, non-sandboxed programs. This makes JavaScript (like VBScript) a theoretically viable vector for a Trojan horse, although JavaScript Trojan horses are uncommon in practice."
Sleepy_Coder: Oh. goodie.
The_Muh: lol
Sleepy_Coder: is running a grep on some 1GB of IRC logs to look for the damned link to the Javascript creepy showcase site :<
The_Muh: wtf
Sleepy_Coder: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JavaScript#Syntax_and_semantics ugly little language.
The_Muh: valve increased the pyro-flamethrower-damage oO
The_Muh: damn pyro
Sleepy_Coder: Pyros are such an un-elegant class to kill as :(
Sleepy_Coder: I don't see how they can up the damage on that.
Sleepy_Coder: They already overpower most others.
The_Muh: pyro sucks
Sleepy_Coder: I hate spies because you can pretty much backstab from any angle, and pyros for easy kills.
Sleepy_Coder: I mean, it seems like you can backstab someone from any angle T.T I don't lag much so I'm pretty sure :\
Sleepy_Coder: Pyros just run through in suicide-mode and burn everything
Tazer: you can't backstab from any angle
Tazer: what
The_Muh: http://store.steampowered.com/news/3842/
The_Muh: on the bottom
Sleepy_Coder: Tazer: They say you can't, as it should be only the back, but experience says otherwise.
The_Muh: wants the engineer-update
Sleepy_Coder: I've been able to backstab easily if a person turns to the side quick enough, and I've been backstabbed from the front
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: Hm, works for us (about the health stuff, I accidently brbd)
Sleepy_Coder: It's silly. it's either lag compensation, lag in actuality, or it's a very non-accurate backstab.
Sleepy_Coder: And I don't lag much >8|
Sleepy_Coder: rages
Tazer: I mained spy, though. Granted I haven't played the game in a few months, but I pretty much constantly play spy
Tazer: You can backstab from any angle...if it's a failstab, which is the lag fucking up and shit. On the flipside of that, you can stab right at times and have it not register, soo
Tigge: How much tax does one pay in the USA?
Sleepy_Coder: There are a lot of taxes to consider :x
Sleepy_Coder: Don't know the full amount off the top of my head
Sleepy_Coder: A lot of it is based on how much you make and how much you spend
Sleepy_Coder: Sales tax, import tax, income tax, etc...
maligor: probably he means income tax
Sleepy_Coder: Weird how this country was formed because of over-taxation and now it's being over-taxed... (imo)
Sleepy_Coder: pretty sure you get taxed more if you make more, taxed less if you make less, considering I don't work...
Sleepy_Coder: I'm sure most people would be happy to be over-taxed if the money went toward the promised projects T.T
Sleepy_Coder: I think it's more the distrust of the government and it's resources that gets to people, rather than how we're treated financially.
Sleepy_Coder: :\
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: hm, yeah, I meant income tax
Sleepy_Coder: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States#Year_2010_income_brackets_and_tax_rates
Sleepy_Coder: :(
Sleepy_Coder: Feels somehow worse that they can tax you more if you're single.
Sleepy_Coder: That shouldn't have anything to do with anything :<
Tigge: mm
Sleepy_Coder: Obviously if you have a kid you need more money to support your family, but they shouldn't be able to judge you on your income and how much you need of it just because you don't have a mate
Sleepy_Coder: Seems.. don't remember the word :\
Sleepy_Coder: Judging at face-value?
Tigge: yeah, it's the same here
Tigge: you can live together, but if you are not married you don't get the tax bonuses
Tigge: same with rules about inheriting, child care, etc
Sleepy_Coder: Heh, you get a tax break if you're the head of the household.
Sleepy_Coder: What crap.
Tigge: fun stuff
Tigge: I think in Sweden we have 35% income tax for everyone
Sleepy_Coder: I agree with clear & simple sales tax, income tax is :P
Kvisle: it's 28% in Norway
Tigge: varies depending on where you live but, near 35%
Kvisle: the northern parts of sweden are subsidized, just like the northern parts of norway?
Morten_: its ~45% in denmark!
Morten_: :(
Morten_: or perhaps a little more
Tigge: Kvisle: no, not like that. There are some Robin Hood-tax equalization but, not in that sense
Sleepy_Coder: Seems like the extreme taxes in other countries actually go toward the projects they're supposed to fund, though...
Sleepy_Coder: You hear about how politicians are dipping into Social Security all the time to fund pet projects...
Kvisle: I know we waste alot of money, but I don't think it's easy to avoid it
Sleepy_Coder: I think we could have more responsible politicians, but I'm tired of thinking a new year of elections will change that.
Sleepy_Coder: Going to move as soon as I can to somewhere nicer :p See if the grass is greener on the other side.
Tigge: 55% income tax for $50000 and up in Sweden.. apparently
Tigge: I don't earn that much though :)
Sleepy_Coder: So far, things are livable in the US, even with the misappropriation of so much funding from over-taxation. I could live here, but I'd rather live somehwere else where the taxes are even higher, as long as the government were upfront about where the money is going.
Tazer: http://krautchan.net/int/thread-732398.html is it--is it bad that I can see myself doing this guy while he keeps the face on the whole time
Tigge: Yeah, so Sweden is nice like that, No fees for going to school, only $15 for a doctors vist, whatever it is, etc
Sleepy_Coder: I wouldn't mind 55% income tax if things were still livable. If I knew where the money were going, if I still made enough to live comfortably, it wouldn't matter to me.
Sleepy_Coder: In the US it seems like taxes are always being raised, debts are never being cleared, and the things politicians are elected for... never get fixed.
Sleepy_Coder: I have a problem with the system defeating itself.
Tigge: Mmm
skyhirider: same think here in Slovakia mate, its a global issue a presume
Tigge: someone did investigate promises made during elections in Sweden
Tigge: apparently 90-95% of the promises where fullfilled
Sleepy_Coder: http://krautchan.net/files/1274219739001.jpg I lol'd
skyhirider: it's good to be Swedish then, to bad I'm not Swedish :D
Tigge: :)
Tigge: Well, not everything is good
Sleepy_Coder: Sweden doesn't respect copyrights and patents, correct?
Sleepy_Coder: <3
The_Muh: swedish pirates =)
Sleepy_Coder: loves the information being free philosophy :p
Sleepy_Coder: i'd rather have an internet that included pedophiles than try to police it :p
skyhirider: well, depends from what angle you look at it, heard a great deal about Texas patent trolls
The_Muh: sry... not pirates - wikings
Tigge: Well, we do repect copyright and patents
riisen: i dont
Sleepy_Coder: I don't :p
Tazer: i should move to sweden..
skyhirider: copyright and patents are fine as long as they are not abused
Tigge: However just linking to copyrighted information is not punishable by law
Sleepy_Coder: Not like I go around creating derived works from clearly proprietary software and distributing them for free or making money from said works, but I think licensing of intellectual property is silly.
Sleepy_Coder: I like sharing ideas and I think it's an affront to ...humanity to try to control who learns about an idea :\
riisen: wohoo Tigge is a svenne ;D
skyhirider: something like apple is doing suing htc
skyhirider: there is a nice new article on ars that talks about false claims of copyright on youtube that companies/people do to censore the web too
Sleepy_Coder: Wouldn't the world be a better place if there were no secrets? :p
Tigge: riisen: hah, yes
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: perhaps yes
skyhirider: I'd say thats a naive look, there have to be secrets, but it should be balanced :P
The_Muh: hard to make software without hurt any patents
Tazer: Why do there have to be secrets? :O
skyhirider: making sw is a patent minefield, that's why I never want to be a programmer :D
The_Muh: for example: progressbar and doubleclick are patented
Sleepy_Coder: I'm a programmer for fun :p
Tazer: Damn you people, going to sleep at five in the morning and you have to make the conversation interesting all of a sudden
Tigge: yeah, so in Sweden and in the EU, in theory at least, there should not be any patents on software, algorithms, etc
Sleepy_Coder: haha
Tazer: I want to learn programming ;w;
Sleepy_Coder: Programming is not fun :(
The_Muh: Tazer: read "a byte of python"
Tigge: it is
Tazer: It seems useful and fun to me
The_Muh: Sleepy_Coder: it is!
Sleepy_Coder: I don't think programming is as fun as it sounds like it was in the 1960s or 1970s :(
Tigge: I do it at work and at home
skyhirider: you cannot say who you are watching for example, if you are investigating a crime
Sleepy_Coder: Everybody uses a crappier language now.
Tazer: A byte of python?
Sleepy_Coder: huggles C and ASM <3
The_Muh: Tazer: a python tutorial
Sleepy_Coder: Though i don't really know much assembler :p
Sleepy_Coder: x86 assembler is fun though <3
Tazer: Yes, but is it a book or some online thing?
The_Muh: Tazer: online
skyhirider: wish there was one highly optimized language, but that is a mad dream too :P
The_Muh: just google it
riisen: Tigge, w00t.. no patent on software... what have i missed o.O
Sleepy_Coder: I technically learned Perl, PHP, and Java when I first got into programming ;x Kind of all at the same time.
The_Muh: microsoft have a patent for a modular kernel xD
Tigge: riisen: yepp
Sleepy_Coder: Java is a horrible language that is lovely for portability but makes learning C or C++ extremely hard.
skyhirider: yeah, thats kinda like patent for hot water
The_Muh: but i thing there are pretty much prior art
Sleepy_Coder: A lot of patents for things that seem very widely adopted are not really enforceable though...
riisen: Tigge, gief source :>
Tigge: so, prior art is a USA thing too, nothing like that in the EU i think
The_Muh: Tazer: if you want to learn programming: never use "goto" - never!
Sleepy_Coder: If they were to go after everyone who created a modular kernel they could expect the same retention from patents they might infringe on :>
The_Muh: its hard to forget the command "goto"...
Sleepy_Coder: That is, if a judge didn't see the patent to be unlawful in the first place T.T
Sleepy_Coder: :o
skyhirider: well there is a nice rule on copyright at least, if the copyrighted brand becomes a well know name, werb lets say they it looses copyright
Sleepy_Coder: goto is lovely :<
Tazer: goto?
Tigge: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patents_under_the_EPC
Tazer: I'm going to guess that's some obscure language I've never heard of
Sleepy_Coder: skyhirider: orly
The_Muh: Tazer: goto makes the source unreadable
Tigge: Not always :)
The_Muh: goto is a command in many languages
skyhirider: Sleepy_Coder: at least in Czech republic, there was an issue with an old printer/copy mashine company, their name effectively became the synonym for copying
Sleepy_Coder: goto is excellent for things like error handling or a non-recursive function that finds the sum of a fibonacci sequence down from whichever integer :x
skyhirider: Sleepy_Coder: but that was a long time ago
riisen: Tigge, grymt ;D
Tigge: riisen: :) However, in practice, there are some.. but yeah.. Read the source :P
Tigge: So did anyone try the Opera labs release?
skyhirider: not sure how it applies worldwide thou, as we all do googling of our own not :D
Sleepy_Coder: goto is claimed by many to lead to spaghetti code :< because of how easy it is to abuse...
Sleepy_Coder: skyhirider: Xerox?
Tazer: Okay um
Tazer: i'll
Tazer: i'll just figure that out
Tazer: i guess
Sleepy_Coder: remembers when Xeroxing something was used like a verb...
skyhirider: Sleepy_Coder: yeah, thats the brand
Sleepy_Coder: :D
Tazer: goto is gibberish to me from the moment Sleepy described it, I understand nothing
Sleepy_Coder: not very common anymore :(
skyhirider: Sleepy_Coder: true, but it used to be, people were basically saying they will xerox this and xerox that :P
Sleepy_Coder: Tazer: http://www.cprogramming.com/tutorial/goto.html :}
Tazer: ;w; None of that means anything to me, Sleepy
Tazer: I don't know what exception handling iss
The_Muh: i dont know which language i should learn
Sleepy_Coder: goto is great for subdividing blocks of code and being able to skip ahead to the portion with the label you've given it. It removes the overhead of calling a function to do the same job
Sleepy_Coder: it's especially great for when you usually have a recursive function, as this function *could* be called *MANY* times and the function call itself is slowing the program down :>
The_Muh: erlang and ruby are looking nice..
Sleepy_Coder: But like all cool things, it can be abused very easily :p
Sleepy_Coder: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duff's_device This is a fun use of goto :p
Sleepy_Coder: er... ther eis no goto.
Sleepy_Coder: Wtf was I thinking of :\
Tazer: So
Tazer: How long do you guys think it should take me to learn Python
Sleepy_Coder: A day if you're lucky.
Tazer: I've got pretty much nothing but slight command line experience in Ubuntu
Sleepy_Coder: Will take you a lifetime forget :(
mikeplus64: 5 units of choice.
Sleepy_Coder: tries adding an alias
Tazer: A day? O-o
Sleepy_Coder: █▄▄ ███ █▄▄ ▀▄█▄▀ █▄█ ▀█▀
Sleepy_Coder: oh yay it works.
Tazer: nice
Sleepy_Coder: is good at picking up languages and hating them quickly :p
Tazer: But it's possible to pick up a language knowing nothing and learn it all in a day?
Sleepy_Coder: Hmm, when you learn one you sort of learn them all :>
Tazer: Yeah, which is why I ask you
Sleepy_Coder: You pick up language-agnostic concepts that help you pick up new ones easily :>
Tazer: Did you already know programming before picking up Python or was it your first, is what I mean
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: there is a couple of exception here
Sleepy_Coder: PHP, Perl, and Java were my first :> There was no *one* first as I was playing with a Perl IRC bot at the time, writing PHP scripts for a webserver (trying to anyway), and Java was in a class in highschool
Tigge: Logic programming and functional programming is quite different
Tazer: Fair enough U:
Tazer: Ah well
Tazer: I'll finish the book by saturday.
Tazer: G'night, guys
Tigge: night
Sleepy_Coder: Hmm functional programming.
Sleepy_Coder: This I do with Lua.
Sleepy_Coder: You can do functional programming in C you know :p
Sleepy_Coder: I think a lot of the problems people have with trying to entertain concepts from other languages in the one of their choice stems from the syntax or how they visualize program flow. :\ Functional programming is possible in C, classing is possible in C, even polymorphism is possible in C, it's just not very easy to do or fun. :>
Sleepy_Coder: And so the journey to search for the ultimate programming language continues :p
Sleepy_Coder:
Sleepy_Coder: Well classing is easy in C.
Sleepy_Coder: Maybe a bad example.
Tigge: oh, functional programming is not possible in C
Tigge: nono
Tigge: in a very very limited way, yes
Tigge: but.. no :P
Sleepy_Coder: has a PDF somewhere on the subject :p
Tigge: ooh
Sleepy_Coder: "YOU ARE WRONG, I HAZ A PDF!"
Sleepy_Coder: XD
Sleepy_Coder: You mean functional programming in terms of lazy evalation and statelessnessness?
Sleepy_Coder: was thinking of it in terms of passing around a lot of function pointers XD
Sleepy_Coder: Partially-applied functions would be... seemingly impossible though :p
Tigge: Sleepy_Coder: yeah, and that is the biggest thing!
Sleepy_Coder: nou!
Tigge: lazy evaluation should be doable I guess. Hopefully its already optimized in c compilers too
Tigge: typ classes
Tigge: *type
Tigge: all good stuff
Tigge: I prefer haskell
Sleepy_Coder: http://www.osl.iu.edu/publications/prints/2001/jarvi:01:mpool.pdf
Sleepy_Coder: :x
Sleepy_Coder: prefers Lua, but only because it seems to be clearer to understand than Haskell's syntax :3
Sleepy_Coder: I do love that Haskell can be interpreted :p
Sleepy_Coder: I just love Lua for interpreted work and C for compiled :3
cmdrk: wow. the ASUS 1201T looks like a great netbook. I want one :(
Sleepy_Coder: And updating Lua is so much less of a pain than GHC >.<
cmdrk: comes without Windows, too!
Sleepy_Coder: is so close to switching to Linux again :}
Sleepy_Coder: Well, correcting my broken Linux install :(
cmdrk: what's wrong with it?
Sleepy_Coder: Only a week from being able to pour hours of boredom into it
Sleepy_Coder: seems to be missing SATA support
cmdrk: ahhh
Sleepy_Coder: Though I was using the same kernel before my motherboard/ram/cpu upgrade, so I don't know what happened.
Sleepy_Coder: I mean I was using SATA on the old motherboard :>
cmdrk: different SATA chipset?
Sleepy_Coder: Weirdness :p
Sleepy_Coder: Possible, that would suck balls...
cmdrk: shouldn't be too hard to add it into the kernel config
mikeplus64: Sleepy_Coder: I recommend Arch Linux if you're looking for a decent distro.
Sleepy_Coder: Didn't think you could lose Linux compatibility with a SATA controller :p
Sleepy_Coder: I already use Arch ;p
mikeplus64: lol
cmdrk: well I'm saying maybe your kernel doesn't have the SATA controller driver enabled
Sleepy_Coder: :}
mikeplus64: Well I still recommend it. ;)
Sleepy_Coder: The only sad part about going to Linux is not being able to use the EAX extensions or Crystalizer in my sound card :(
cmdrk: does Arch have a convenient PXE booting tarball like Debian does?
Sleepy_Coder: going to Linux exclusively (if Steam gets released soon)
cmdrk: I'm PXE booting Debian Lenny for this Ceph cluster i'm setting up, and it's a pain migrating from kernel 2.6.26 to 2.6.34 :(
Sleepy_Coder: I don't mean to be rude, cutting you off, but I'm itching to play some TF2 prophunt :}
Sleepy_Coder: oic, not me-related :p
The_Muh: dd should have a progress-bar -.-
cmdrk: yes it should
cmdrk: you could pipe it through pv maybe?
mikeplus64: Hehe... A less Linux versed friend of mine decided to ^C out of dd once. Not such a good idea afterall.
cmdrk: The_Muh: if you know the size of what you're dd'ing, you can use pv to display a nice progress bar with something like 'dd if=/dev/foo | pv --whateveroptions | dd of=/dev/bar"
Wipster: morning
mikeplus64: Night.
kurros: evening
Wipster: all kinds of timezone today
Megagun: afternoon
Wipster: is anyone in yesterday..... or possibly tomorrow?
SimmyD: i am nearly up to the 21st
SimmyD: in 3 hours
The_Muh: 13:37 soon
mikeplus64: 21:19:21 where I am.
riisen: god why cant valve announce steam for linux soon >.<
DonScott: they like to tease
riisen: yea :<
riisen: lol is it only for me the css file not load on http://store.steampowered.com/news/
jumbers: CSS file not loading, Steam for Linux CONFIRMED
riisen: wohooo \o/
DonScott: lol why did dusty_fox get banned from the steam forums ?
DonScott: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1173683&page=61
Azalyn: 61 pages!?
Azalyn: damnit
Azalyn: how am i supposed to read all of that :(
giselher: DonScott: the mods are crazy
Azalyn: there isn't even a "show all posts on one page" option
DonScott: no no no it's on the last page about half way dowhn
DonScott: down*
Azalyn: i know where the ban is...
Azalyn: but i'm interested in what has been discussed on the thread anyways.
Azalyn: as for why he got banned.. it may not have been for something in this thread
Azalyn: could have been for something in another thread.
meGenius: damn Dronebl, they have banned me for two days
meGenius: or more :D
Ivanovic: uhm, what happened to the mesa git tree?
Ivanovic: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/log/
meGenius: who cares :P
rsk: what do you mean
meGenius: mesa is getting worse
Ivanovic: look at the dates column
Ivanovic: there was no merge indicated
Ivanovic: so either something strange happened or someone had an *ancient* commit still lying in his local git tree
meGenius: nowadays, mesa driver doesn't help a lot
meGenius: will brb,,
Ivanovic: meGenius: uhm, you know, the open source driver does work nicely for me
Ivanovic: yeah, that is mesa
Ivanovic: and it does have some reasonable opengl with my rv670 based card, too
Ivanovic: so no, mesa is not getting worse at all
Azalyn: mesa is obsolete.
Azalyn: everyone is focusing on gallium3d now.
Ivanovic: replaced by?
Ivanovic: DOH!
Ivanovic: gallium is using mesa!
Ivanovic: that is: all the gallium stuff is part of the mesa tree
Ivanovic: and yeah, for opengl there is the mesa state tracker
Azalyn: but that isn't the code you're talking about, is it?
Ivanovic: the repository is all the mesa stuff
Ivanovic: gallium and *whatever*
Ivanovic: including progs like glxgears
Ivanovic: yeah, they are all in that single repo
Azalyn: go ask "Jakob Bornecrantz" about it.
Azalyn: maybe the dev team has invented a time machine.
skyhirider: anyone know some nice tweaks that make tf2 playable through wine with more than 20 fps?
Azalyn: -dxlevel 81
Azalyn: in the steam launch options for the game
Azalyn: launch the game with that one time, and then remove it afterwards. (the option remains set after the first time you launch with it)
skyhirider: thx, but was hoping to run it in dx9, but il try it and see what happens
skyhirider: ahh, still unplayable
Azalyn: what hardware do you have?
Azalyn: i never had problems on my machine with a geforce 7900GS
Azalyn: and dualcore 2.5GHz athlon.
skyhirider: 8800 gts
skyhirider: i have something set up that is wrong in wine
Azalyn: there must be a bottleneck somewhere in your system.
skyhirider: remeber having terrible fps on starcraft till i did something in wine regedit
Azalyn: starcraft is completely different. it's a 2D game. which is exactly why it's slow.
Azalyn: directdraw stuff is slow in wine, so are DIBs. and starcraft i believe uses both of those.
Azalyn: directdraw in wine however can be done through opengl, which speeds things up. that might be the registry entry you changed.
Azalyn: what version of wine are you using?
Azalyn: wine --version
DonScott: is 1.1.44 the latest verion of wine ?
skyhirider: 1.1.42
DonScott: update it
skyhirider: hmm, it seems when i change gfx settings it wont save them
skyhirider: odd
skyhirider: got another odd bug, the whole steam gui is rendered 6x6 times in a box instead of just once
DonScott: yeah I'm only getting 15-20fps too
DonScott: in Tf2
Azalyn: heh
Azalyn: i haven't seen any of the steam bugs.
DonScott: now i can't get back into the game after I alt-tabbed
DonScott: booo
DonScott: brb
skyhirider: id say the more than one steam window bug is a gnomeshell bug but the others, oh well
Azalyn: gnome shell sucks anyways.
Azalyn: all these 'reinventing the desktop' concepts are total fail that never work right.
DonScott: had to reboot to kill TF2
DonScott: sooooo wine kills about 100fps on my 8800gt
DonScott: for tf2
DonScott: and
DonScott: won't alt-tab correctly
DonScott: however....
DonScott: it does run
somename: Is Arch Linux Really Faster Than Ubuntu? yes, it is
Billthe4th: not according to the benchmarks...
NigeyUK: my ubuntu system is faster becausei have my pc powered by a hamster !
DonScott: it might be faster if nothing is installed
DonScott: lol
GNU\colossus: phoronix benchmarks with all the deviation within an expectable error margin are so utterly useless
GNU\colossus: yeah, another worthless read.
NigeyUK: nigel@nigel-desktop:~$ w
NigeyUK: 15:44:34 up 5 min, 2 users, load average: 0.63, 0.63, 0.30
NigeyUK: thats 1 downside to ubuntu
GNU\colossus: though it's more a "look at graphs" than an actual "read" for me.
NigeyUK: load average is always pretty high
GNU\colossus: 16:45:07 up 1 day, 22:30, 3 users, load average: 0.18, 0.26, 0.19
NigeyUK: :o
GNU\colossus: I couldn't care less on a non-mobile machine though
Azalyn: ubuntu has too much bloat.
NigeyUK: true
DonScott: yeah
GNU\colossus: ubuntu has a desktop experience that actually deserves to be called as such
NigeyUK: 175 tasks, 2 running 173 sleeping .. ffs
GNU\colossus: (I'm not using it, however)
DonScott: yeah mines like that too
DonScott: lol
GNU\colossus: so what? Linux' process model is designed to be A-OK with numbers that low
NigeyUK: but on the flipside, memory usage is surprisingly low
DonScott: I was looking at Arch earlier this morning.
somename: arch is the best choice for desktop users IMHO
GNU\colossus: my box (a desktop) has 240+ processes running all the time. I'm perfectly fine with that.
Azalyn: honestly, these days a lot of the things that provide usability in linux are more low-level. like for example, when talking about hotplug/plugnplay and so on... that is udev's job now.
Azalyn: and no matter what distro you use you pretty much have that.
GNU\colossus: at the end of the day, I want my machine to get work done for me.
GNU\colossus: somename: I LOL'd.
somename: o rly?
Azalyn: changing resolutions? that's xrandr and the randr extension in the x server.
GNU\colossus: yeah, and upstream's job is awesome indeed.
DonScott: meh....Arch looks good but you kinda need to already know what you're doing to install it and get all the features you want.
DonScott: The good news is that they have good manuals
Azalyn: in the future when xinput2 goes mainstream, and other stuff will show up. honestly there's going to be less and less of a difference as time goes on.
GNU\colossus: the average user doesn't take a look at a manual, ever.
Azalyn: i stick to gentoo. since i like the control.
GNU\colossus: Azalyn: I think Ubuntu et al. have noticed that, and they try to mitigate that "problem" by offering services like Ubuntu One
GNU\colossus: I'm using Gentoo on my desktop, too. that's because I like tinkering.
Azalyn: i have considered arch though. since i get tired of the compiling.
GNU\colossus: I'm very happy that something like Ubuntu exists though, as it's perfect for my mom and gradpa.
Azalyn: i suppose.
DonScott: yeah...I still like ubuntu ...hell it's the reason I even tried linux and then switched completely over to it.
Azalyn: but mom and grandpa don't need frameworks like mono or whatever.
Azalyn: they'd be fine with a linux distro that has a usability level of win95 or something.
GNU\colossus: depends on if the apps they use need them or not
GNU\colossus: and I'm not a friend of Mono, believe me. I'd be happy if it was thron away asap.
NigeyUK: is it that bad?
GNU\colossus: the Mono and .Net runtime you mean?
NigeyUK: yeah, ive not tinkered with it yet
GNU\colossus: it's absolutely unneeded and uncalled or. we already have Java for its intended purpose, and Mono is technically inferior to it.
GNU\colossus: uncalled for*
NigeyUK: good point, why reinvent the wheel
GNU\colossus: of course, hardly anyone uses Java for desktop apps
GNU\colossus: Mono/.Net is used for desktop apps on windows because it sucks less than its most-perceived alterantives
NigeyUK: javas kinda having a tough time atm, especially javafx.. that was such a let down
GNU\colossus: browser plugins hopefully won't matter much in the not-too-distant-future
NigeyUK: fingers crossed
Azalyn: both mono and java are fairly useless on the desktop. the intended purpose of those 'frameworks' is to make development cheaper for corporations. that is more useful for internal applications. it's just another form of rapid application development. while still giving you the power of more low level languages, but not their performance.
GNU\colossus: java's performance is very fine, esp. for applications running long-term. it's class library is also very, very complete.
GNU\colossus: of course, programming in Java still sucks.
asraniel: i think it's quite ok
GNU\colossus: compare it to Python
jumbers: Java is fine
Azalyn: the 'theory' is that if all the applications in your system used the same framework (java or mono), then you wouldn't be wasting memory or disk space, and maybe you'd even *save* some, because there would supposedly be less redundancy.
GNU\colossus: coding the latter arguably is more fun
Azalyn: but the 'reality' is that every desktop OS is already based on native code.
Azalyn: and therefore, there always *will* be redundancy.
Azalyn: and you're always going to be loading an entire framework of junk in memory just to run a stupid note-taking application. (tomboy notes)
GNU\colossus: doesn't matter much in terms of resource consumption nowadays, though
GNU\colossus: it will always matter in terms of software vulnerability though
d2kx: 30mins to go
Azalyn: i think it does matter. why shouldn't we use our cpu resources efficiently?
Azalyn: it doesn't matter if my cpu is powerful enough to run mono, the question is why should i have to use that much power just to run what basically amounts to "notepad on crack" ?
Azalyn: when i could be using that to do other tasks.
GNU\colossus: fact is, you aren't
DonScott: throw the link up d2kx
GNU\colossus: I mean, I think it's nice to have a system with a small footprint
GNU\colossus: but in the end, it's functionality that matters
GNU\colossus: that's how the average joe sees it, and I do understand them
Azalyn: DonScott: http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers
d2kx: DonScott http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers 26mins to go
DonScott: thanks
GNU\colossus: what are you waiting for there?
Azalyn: google's 2nd keynote.
Azalyn: yesterday was the first one, where they announced vp8 being opened.
d2kx: possibly android 2.2, google tv, chrome os, google tablet, they also talked about "more than one surprise coming tomorrow", what we will actually see i dont know but theres some big stuff coming
Azalyn: did you guys read the post by the x264 developer? he analyzed vp8. he says that it's not as good as h264's better profiles.
Azalyn: the spec is apparently a mess.
Azalyn: but that it may be capable of beating vc-1 or h264 'baseline profile'
d2kx: baseline profile is what matters for the web
d2kx: also x264 is not used by industry but less efficient h264 encoders
d2kx: also h264 is optimized to death and vp8 optimization is only beginning
d2kx: also cpu usage is lower with vp8, tried it myself
d2kx: also with everyone dumping flash now lots of win
d2kx: he is frustrated that his hard work on x264 is not going to matter anymore in the future, understandable, but its a good thing
d2kx: youtube 360p vp8 looks and performans amazing, try it. chromium-trunk has best implementation so far. 720p still takes much less cpu power than flash/h264 before and looks great
Azalyn: d2kx: it's easy to be dismissive, but if you actually read the article, you'd see that isn't the case.
Azalyn: before the spec was out, he was optimistic about vp8, and was hoping it would be done too.
Nevtus: I wish Mozilla had Linux 64-bit versions of the WebM branch of Firefox...
Azalyn: also, vp8 is apparently very similar to h264 in many respects.
Azalyn: a lot of it seems copied it seems.
Azalyn: my guess is On2 tried to separate the patented bits from the non-patented bits of h264
Azalyn: they basically tried to find a 'safe' subset of functionality they could copy.
Azalyn: the x264 guy does say that it's definitely a very good upgrade to theora though
Azalyn: also, his analysis took into account future optimizations.
Azalyn: http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=377
Azalyn: all in all though, it seems that vp8 doesn't have any issues that couldn't be addressed given 1-2 months of time to revise the bitstream format a bit. but the problem is google says that they want the bitstream format to be 'final'
Azalyn: so we'll have to see what turns up.
Azalyn: maybe google will change their minds and allow the community to give the bitstream format an upgrade before stabilization.
Azalyn: also, it lacks b-frames or anything like it.
Azalyn: which is apparently the biggest problem more than anything else.
Azalyn: and by the way, x264 is used in *many* places... it's probably the most widespread encoder out there.
Azalyn: especially on the web. pretty much any website that does h264 video uses it.
Nevtus: does it have to be perfect though? For the purposes of web video as long as it is safe from patents (apparently), works with HTML5 and content looks good in it isn't that all we need. For offline viewing other encoders such as x264 can still be used
Midler: Azalyn: about b-frames, i dont know much about video codex and how they work
Midler: but wasnt he complaining about that because of compression size could be better?
Midler: and compression/decompression takes more cpu?
Midler: just a guess from me
Midler: so, a little smaller filezise, some more cpu % taken
Midler: or not
d2kx: 10mins to go#
Azalyn: Midler: something like that.
Azalyn: but i think vp8 needs to match or beat h264 baseline (and vc-1/wmv) for it to be an option.
Azalyn: we'll have to wait and see. like i said, i'm hoping they let the community revise the bitstream.
Azalyn: Nevtus: that argument could have been used for theora as well though... clearly, quality does matter to people to a certain extent.
d2kx: well all i know is i downloaded chromium-trunk today, it worked with youtube on some test videos and performance and quality was excellent even in this early stage
Nevtus: I think it was used with theora, but theora doesn't have google (and youtube) to back it up
Midler: Azalyn: in webmproject homepage
giselher: Midler: lzma is even faster if the compressed file is smaller
Midler: u can push your own code up
Azalyn: i think hoping to beat h264 in *all* profiles would be too much to ask for sure... but we should at least have something decent that can compete with baseline profile.
Azalyn: d2kx: yeah. i know. but the guy says in his article which parts could probably be improved, and which probably cant.
Azalyn: if there's one thing he knows, it's optimization. he must have an idea of which things are optimizeable and which aren't.
Azalyn: i mean there has to be some algorithm out there that predates MPEG. maybe even an algorithm that is *patented* but expired. that we can use to do the same thing that b-frames does.
Azalyn: or whatever.
xorl: It's google, they'll find a way.
xorl: At least it's already better than Theora out of the box.
xorl: and VC-1
Nevtus: it has hardware acceleration support too from the big players too
Nevtus: very nice
xorl: Yeah, right out of the box.
xorl: So in a sense, it's already defeated H264 on most platforms
Nevtus: I don't think theora was ever close to getting hardware support
xorl: as H264 doesn't have hardware accel on a lot of platforms yet
xorl: I may be mistaken on that, but I am pretty positive of that
DonScott: Google is late ......
Nevtus: uh? it doesn't? Unless I'm mistaken H264 support is quite common
Midler: i like how the webm format is based on matroska
DonScott: the devs partied too hard
Nevtus: DonScott: Google wasn't the original search engine either
Midler: woho
Midler: i see something
DonScott: i was talking about the developer conferene
d2kx: its beginning >>> http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers
DonScott: conference
Nevtus: DonScott: oh I see. heh
Azalyn: hasn't begun for me
xorl: Nevtus, yeah, H264 from a quick google search needs to be enabled via "Special" features on most devices
Midler: hope they put their sound up
Midler: was a little bit low yesterday
d2kx: they switched image, should begin any second
xorl: And it appears to be highly dependent on what media player you use
d2kx: yeah Midler
xorl: hah, even the windows hardware acceleration for H264 from google is all stating that powerdvd supports it out of the box?
xorl: Well, good news is the new versions of VLC support GPU hardware acceleration :D (1.1-x)
d2kx: google you're late^^
d2kx: begun but no sound wtf
DonScott: lol NO SOUND
asraniel: lets see my talent at lip reading
xorl: wtfgoogle
d2kx: yesterday low volume now no sound, great improvement
giselher: lmao
xorl: yay audio
Azalyn: oh, there it is
giselher: ya
DonScott: yay SOUND
d2kx: sound
asraniel: "with front facing cameras" hehe
DonScott: 1984
d2kx: nice apple bash
giselher: i beleve in choice :D
giselher: believe*
xorl: I like that slap in the apple face haha
xorl: dissing apple
xorl: and there's a macbook up there haha
xorl: wow
mastertheknife: Valve still sleeping eh
d2kx: mastertheknife shh
d2kx: http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers
mastertheknife: I dont like google much anymore
mastertheknife: they are taking to take over anything they can
mastertheknife: they are trying*
mastertheknife: dusty_fox?
mastertheknife: how did he get banned lol
DonScott: that's what i siad
Midler: is the image laggy for ppl in here?
d2kx: no
d2kx: 480p
Midler: iam also on 480
Midler: had no problem yesterday in 720
Midler: nvm
Midler: saw i got 720
Zerb_Riss: 720 is running fine for me
Zerb_Riss: he's railing on Apple
Zerb_Riss: awesome
d2kx: nice apple bash there again haha
Nevtus: they bash apple then use a macbook...
Zerb_Riss: that is awesome
Zerb_Riss: best feature ever
xorl: oh crap
xorl: "send to phone" is nut
xorl: nuts even
Zerb_Riss: zomg
Zerb_Riss: that is even better o_o
xorl: haha, i can imagine that getting hacked
giselher: wath thetering?
Azalyn: i can already tether and hotspot on my palm pre.
asraniel: giselher: connect your laptop on the internet over your android, like the most phones can do
Zerb_Riss: rofl
Zerb_Riss: ipad
DonScott: lol at iPad
d2kx: HAHAA
Azalyn: giselher: connecting it to you laptop to have cellular internet on your laptop.
Zerb_Riss: hahahaha awesome
asraniel: ah, cool!
asraniel: over wifi??
Zerb_Riss: yeah
Zerb_Riss: portable hotspot
Zerb_Riss: cool i wonder what this means for the battery
Zerb_Riss: LOL
d2kx: lool
Nevtus: hah
giselher: lmao
asraniel: i want froyo on my iphone :)
mastertheknife: that video is boring
mastertheknife: whats so interesting about it?
Zerb_Riss: what video?
d2kx: http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers
mastertheknife: the google developers crap
Zerb_Riss: it's not boring
giselher: wasting time, till valve announce steam
d2kx: it is not boring at all
xorl: hah
mastertheknife: you should read books instead, better way to waste time
mastertheknife: lol
xorl: "We'll show you in the sandbox later"
xorl: mastertheknife, that's what I do.
xorl: programming books put me to sleep, have some weird coding nightmares too
Zerb_Riss: nice
xorl: haha
bluekoala: Books in general put me to sleep
xorl: bluekoala, Why I read them before sleep
bluekoala: I was captivated by a book once when I was a kid
bluekoala: And I spent all night reading it
Azalyn: the translation shit is pretty badass
bluekoala: I fear this could possibly happen again
DonScott: Google is gonna take over the world....
bluekoala: So I stay away
bluekoala: I accept Google as my new overlord.
bluekoala: Google provides.
Zerb_Riss: I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords
giselher: doesn't mean better flash support for linux too?
Azalyn: well, it's all opensource stuff.
Zerb_Riss: since Apple has been raging against Google lately, this is just awesome
xorl: man, they are totally smacking apple in the face
Azalyn: so at least they don't have a monopoly.
bluekoala: Who, apple?
bluekoala: That's just cause they fail
Azalyn: google.
bluekoala: They would love nothing better than no competition
bluekoala: I guess that's dependant on what your definition of monopoly is
bluekoala: They do dominate search
bluekoala: And they do compete on multiple fronts
bluekoala: But google doesn't win by screwing everyone over
bluekoala: They win because they offer a superior product
xorl: yeah
xorl: they learn from the market, use the data, and make something better.
giselher: update all = Suy :)
bluekoala: Whereas MS and Apple are all about lockins
bluekoala: It's ironic that they both started out as the alternative to lockins
Zerb_Riss: wow
giselher: omg
DonScott: dude
DonScott: lol
bluekoala: :O!!!
xorl: holy crap
DonScott: Google pwns
xorl: that makes my life 400 times easier haha
xorl: "It crashed on my phone"
xorl: "well shit."
bluekoala: What are you guys watching?
xorl: google I/O
d2kx: http://www.youtube.com/googledevelopers
asraniel: i really hope that idroid project gets androind working on my 3GS soon :)
mastertheknife: xorl: Programming books are actually the most interesting books imo
Zerb_Riss: holy crap are you serious?
DonScott: Google says Internet is cool. Confirmed !
xorl: that was awesome
bluekoala: :P
xorl: see, they take data study it and give it to the user
xorl: apple refuses to do over the air installation, google just fucked them haha
asraniel: imagine suddenly the google guy says "ah by the way, steam on linux is confirmed!"
Zerb_Riss: zomg
bluekoala: lol
Nevtus: Gabe jumps on a cake on stage "STEAM ON LINUX GUYS!"
Nevtus: err
xorl: "Steam on Android, hah"
Nevtus: *out of a cake
bluekoala: We acquired a company; that makes apple and ms obsolete
Nevtus: I kinda want an Android phone now...
Zerb_Riss: lol
Zerb_Riss: I want a Nexus One so bad
xorl: hahaha
d2kx: nexus one comes out next week here in germany... my first new mobile phone in 5 years
Zerb_Riss: holy crap
Zerb_Riss: live streaming of your home media!
Zerb_Riss: O_O
bluekoala: Hmmm
bluekoala: This is like the zune time -500
bluekoala: Thus making it a positive number
Zerb_Riss: ROFL
Nevtus: is this another go at apple and their iad thing?
Nevtus: iAd"
bluekoala: I have iads
bluekoala: Sounds dirty
Nevtus: http://www.techradar.com/news/computing/apple/is-apple-s-iad-steve-job-s-next-big-thing--679917
Tazer: Am I the only one that feels a little bit like Steve Jobs is just throwing darts at words and sticking an i in front of it and seeing what comes of it?
Megagun: FAIL VOLUME AGAIN
Megagun: So what have they announced now
Zerb_Riss: Tazer: I'm pretty sure he does that
d2kx: Magagun android 2.2 with great new features
Nevtus: he calls it the iDart method
Megagun: That was it? :P
Tazer: Of course
d2kx: still an hour or so to go
Nevtus: meh, ads on a phone
Zerb_Riss: it's at least not very intrusive
Zerb_Riss: unless you want it to be
Megagun: AWESOME ADS
Megagun: woooo
Tazer: I wonder what anyone needs an ipad for
Tazer: besides, you know wasting money
Nevtus: notice that hardly anyone is clapping at this bit
bluekoala: It's an accessory for your starbucks expresso
Zerb_Riss: people need iPads so they can be smug assholes
d2kx: well they need to address business people (so ads) too, of course its not exciting
Megagun: ONE HUNDRED DOLLARS
Zerb_Riss: it will last at least 5 minutes, don't worry
Tazer: Enough
Tazer: no
Tazer: please stop
Tazer: i dont want the same over priced thing over and over, apple, stop releasing three thousand models of one thing every week
Megagun: they want free stuff!
Azalyn: those bastards
Nevtus: aww
Azalyn: you'd BETTER BE SORRY
Zerb_Riss: nevermind the fact that the cost of that phone pretty much covers their entire conference cost
Tazer: my words fell on deaf ears as the giant threw more dazzling, horrifying boxes of beautiful black and silver plating at me
Billthe4th: sons of bitches, didnt they get G1s last week?
Billthe4th: *last year
Megagun: yep
Zerb_Riss: g1s?
Zerb_Riss: didn't they get Nexus Ones or something/
Tazer: every device was hypnotic, calling me like a siren's song to my doom
Megagun: So what is the epic new feature?
Tazer: I wept and wept as my hands threw more and more money from my pockets as the demonic overlord of my heart laughed above me
Megagun: GOOGLE TV
mastertheknife: Go west.. you'll do just fine.. Go west.. when the skys all blue.. Go west... thats what we're gonna do
xorl: sweet
Megagun: well that was unexpected
d2kx: google tv
xorl: this guy looks like he can't speak english w/out an accent haha
xorl: but it's better english than my boss rofl
Zerb_Riss: xorl you racial profiler
Megagun: 0 hours here, EAT THAT
xorl: Zerb_Riss, haha, it's a joke :P
bluekoala: 5m ours per day
Zerb_Riss: ;)
xorl: Zerb_Riss, I worked at qualcomm for like 2 years :P I didn't get much of the opposite.
Megagun: Why doesn't Google ramp up the volum e:|
Zerb_Riss: lol
Tazer: then, as I tinkered with the tiny, beautiful, latest device from Apple, I thought "Maybe I can be happy here. Maybe I can just keep this shiny thing and stay with it. Maybe I can..maybe I can commit"
Tazer: And then Apple snickered and took a breath
Nevtus: pff, tv sucks
Tazer: ~the end~
bluekoala: I'm also a racial profiler, see: Most indians are from india
Zerb_Riss: you are a horrible person!
Zerb_Riss: :p
Nevtus: I don't mind some shows, but I don't watch them on a tv
Megagun: Tazer: *clap clap*
d2kx: i also dont watch tv lets wait what theyve got though
Tazer: c:
Nevtus: plug the computer into the tv?
Megagun: get a HTPC
Nevtus: yup
bluekoala: TV tuner cards announced!
Nevtus: OMG!!
xorl: I have a WDTV Live for that purpose :\
Megagun: Steam on TV CONFIRMED!
Zerb_Riss: probably wirelessly controlling your TV from your PC
bluekoala: This guy has it right
Nevtus: uhh, android on a tv?
bluekoala: Web 2.0 is bs
Megagun: It's probably a HTPC
bluekoala: People want the internet
bluekoala: Because it's the internet
Nevtus: what? who would choose tv?
Megagun: grrr this volume is annoying
Megagun: people around me are talking and I can't hear shit
bluekoala: Ditto
bluekoala: I got headphones on
bluekoala: And my roomate is raging at wow
bluekoala: Because he sucks at video games
Megagun: interactive porn!
Zerb_Riss: get to the demo already
Megagun: You got what you want! :P
Zerb_Riss: lol
bluekoala: Make your tv into ambient lighting
Zerb_Riss: OH CRAP A GUY THAT CAN'T WALK
Nevtus: is that a pointer?
bluekoala: I saw it too
bluekoala: I see it
Zerb_Riss: dish network
Nevtus: looks like they want to reinvent XBMC and MythTV
bluekoala: What if there was google search for the guide?
Megagun: Should have been an apple ad ;)
bluekoala: and found stuff
Nevtus: ugh. I wish he'd just get on with it
Zerb_Riss: no kidding
Zerb_Riss: stop wasting our time
Nevtus: doesn't even work
bluekoala: This wheelchair man is just full of surprises
Megagun: They couldn't get their volume working
Zerb_Riss: handicapped people will rule the world!
Megagun: you'd expect that they got the googletv workin? :)
bluekoala: With wireless keyboards
Zerb_Riss: hey look someone taking a picture
Megagun: Someone's getting fired today!
Zerb_Riss: wheelchair man
Nevtus: you'd have though they'd use a wired keyboard for a live conference
DonScott: nah....it's still a prototype
Megagun: They should watch a video of this very conference
asraniel: wow, looks like krunner
bluekoala: Wooooooooooo!!!
Zerb_Riss: krunner woo
asraniel: that really is like krunner
asraniel: looks and works like krunner
Zerb_Riss: yeah it's pretty similar
Megagun: Let's hope it's faster than krunner
Nevtus: this is terrible
bluekoala: lol
Megagun: krunner tends to sometimes freeze on me :(
Zerb_Riss: it's probably the ChromeOS runner
Zerb_Riss: but it works a lot like Krunner
bluekoala: Wheelchair man does not approve of this box
Megagun: HE REALLY WANTS THE OTHER BOX
Megagun: my god
Megagun: :P
Zerb_Riss: lol
Nevtus: haha
Zerb_Riss: CONTROL?
Zerb_Riss: CONTROL?
bluekoala: tp
bluekoala: for my bunghole
Zerb_Riss: haha
Zerb_Riss: bear butts
Megagun: hahaha
d2kx: nicolas cage animal sex diet WTF TV FAIL
d2kx: thats why youtube > tv
Zerb_Riss: OCTOMOMS BABY WARNING
Azalyn: he said "shit" !
Zerb_Riss: SPAY YOUR PETS
bluekoala: I heardhim say shit
Nevtus: maybe the OTHER BOX would work better?
bluekoala: Your phones are not compatible with our TV
Megagun: "Switch off your phones or you won't get the new phone from us! HAHAHAHA!"
DonScott: lol
bluekoala: Troubleshooting is part of the fun
Nevtus: whoa, this is horrible. They are dying out there
Megagun: I feel sorry for wheelchair man
Zerb_Riss: why on't they have a separate wifi network for themselves/
Megagun: he's the only dude that knows that the other box works
Megagun: but no-one is listening
Zerb_Riss: rofl
Megagun: Zerb_Riss: bluetooth, not wifi. :)
DonScott: Google TV ...not good for develeoper conferences
Nevtus: Google TV.. not compatible with phones
bluekoala: lol
Megagun: Google TV... Back to wired remotes!
bluekoala: I wonder what knight fail is
Megagun: http://www.tvhistory.tv/1950_Zenith_Wired_Remote.JPG :)
bluekoala: That's a genius idea!
bluekoala: Follow the wire to find your remote
Megagun: Never lose a remote again with Google TV!
bluekoala: Never requires batteries!
DonScott: lol
Nevtus: this is very unimpressive
bluekoala: This show kicks ass
Nevtus: haha
d2kx: tv fails badly
bluekoala: I like House :/
Nevtus: this just proves tv is awful
Megagun: xbmc
Zerb_Riss: this is decent
Zerb_Riss: but I'm more interested in... how do I put this on my TV?
Zerb_Riss: I'm not going to hack the Dish HD DVR
Megagun: It has to be cheap
Megagun: They should sell it at a loss
Nevtus: they've not said. I'd think it'd be integrated into new tvs
bluekoala: Hah
Zerb_Riss: he said earlier it could work on your current TV
Midler: mothers day milf
Midler: LOL
bluekoala: The hardest working person in america would NOT be on youtube
DonScott: username say britteny botnet
Nevtus: they should have picked that video
bluekoala: and would NOT win 100 000$
DeathCrawler: see ya!
bluekoala: See ya
jumbers: I'm composing the Super Mario Bros. theme for beep
Megagun: .... heh
Zerb_Riss: I like just having access to web content
bluekoala: I want google TV now
bluekoala: I wonder if it's compatible with microsoft IPTV?
Azalyn: i doubt it
Zerb_Riss: okay that is cool
Azalyn: this is more like mythtv with a bunch of usability features and online browsing stuff.
bluekoala: pip while browsing
jumbers: I've already composed the Star Wars theme, the Imperial March, Ode to Joy
bluekoala: Cool
Nevtus: dvb tuners have enabled people to do this for years
bluekoala: I haven't experimented with it yet
Megagun: Interesting how they haven't done the social thing befo--oh
Megagun: I wonder if they're doing the "invite friend to watch this show too!" thing
bluekoala: That would be facebook TV
bluekoala: And you'd get a banner of your friends' farmville achievements
Megagun: Yeah, but that's some nice thing
bluekoala: In the middle of the screen
Megagun: TV + webcam + microphone + synchronise
Azalyn: so basically it's a PC connected to your TV, which creates an overlay over the tv feed
Nevtus: yup
Azalyn: okay.. now *that* is badass.
Megagun: Aww, no awkward voice detection
d2kx: android as remote is cool
Azalyn: apple is going to get their ass handed to them
Zerb_Riss: this is the cool part
Zerb_Riss: wirelessly controlling your TV from different devices
Zerb_Riss: "This is a funny youtube video" *click* *on TV*
d2kx: yeah thats cool
Tazer: Question, how many of you use RSS feeders?
Zerb_Riss: I use Google Reader
Azalyn: there are some security concerns of course.
Azalyn: i wonder how they've addressed that.
Megagun: Keyboard was a Logitech
Megagun: :)
Zerb_Riss: why? you have to pair your device
Tazer: Google Reader? O:
Zerb_Riss: yes
Tazer: Interesting, I'll check that out for chromium in a bit
Tazer: but basically, I wanted to ask how exactly i know it's working
Tazer: I'm entirely new to it soo
Megagun: shellontv
bluekoala: We all are
bluekoala: GoogleTV got announced just the other day
bluekoala: So, GoogleTV ususe Android, correct?
Megagun: yes
bluekoala: Awesome
Zerb_Riss: wait
bluekoala: iPhone OS is now obsolete
Zerb_Riss: Google TV is running Android?
Nevtus: yes
DonScott: yeah
Zerb_Riss: cool
bluekoala: Android + Chrome + Flash
bluekoala: Forgot password?
Zerb_Riss: awesome
Megagun: Ah, so they *were* on the other box. :P
Megagun: Take that, wheelchair main
Megagun: *man
Azalyn: maybe he meant the OTHER other box.
Nevtus: logical naming there
bluekoala: Of course he meant the other box
bluekoala: He's been saying that all day
bluekoala: Wheelchair man knows best
bluekoala: WHEELCHAIR MAN CONFIRMED!
Megagun: accent man!
giselher: lol
Azalyn: lolz
Azalyn: THANK YOU COME AGAIN.
bluekoala: Todey!
bluekoala: Comurrity
Megagun: greeeet
DonScott: lol i want a slushy now
Zerb_Riss: this is great but how to I test this stuff?
Megagun: Why is everyone inviting everyone else
Azalyn: yewtewb
bluekoala: My loonie bun is fine Benny Lava!
Megagun: autoporn
bluekoala: Potato canons are awesome
Megagun: the bluetooths. turn them off
bluekoala: toshoyo toshoyo toshoyo
Zerb_Riss: hahaha
Megagun: Here's blyan!
Zerb_Riss: he sounds like a congressman
Azalyn: lol @ the suit
Azalyn: fuckin' suits.
bluekoala: He bores me this suit
bluekoala: Next he's gonna talk about six sigma
bluekoala: So I wrote the scores in a spreadsheet
bluekoala: Who's britty?
Azalyn: she looked at her wrist but has no watch..
DonScott: britteny is hawt.
bluekoala: She's cute
bluekoala: Gianna Michaels is hot
Megagun: Wait I went to the toilet and now there's this girl
Megagun: where did she arrive from
Zerb_Riss: horndog internet nerds
bluekoala: I would be on of those I suppose
Zerb_Riss: lol
Megagun: Does she even know what a binary is
giselher: lol
Zerb_Riss: no
eNTi: hi... maybe someone is able to help me. i just bought a gts250. it's connected to my hpw2207h monitor via dvi->hdmi cable. when i play a game, the internal speaker of my monitor intereprets part of the picture signal as sound which is a very ugly noise coming from my montior internal speakers. i've managed to tune down the sound by lowering the volume to 1. lowering it to 0 make the internal speakers create a static noise of their own somehow. any ideas?
Megagun: Android is java, right? :P
Nevtus: how do you know she doesn't?
Megagun: She's a girl, Nevtus.. :)
Zerb_Riss: Android is, sadly, JAva
d2kx: the lead kernel team developer for ubuntu 10.10 is a hot asian woman, some do actually know their stuff ^^
Nevtus: you are surprised that females work in computing?
DonScott: pictures or it's not true d2kx
d2kx: Nevtus not me, but it seems other people here are
giselher: lol DonScoott
Azalyn: sexist.
Daekdroom: I don't like those cliches
d2kx: DonScott http://youtube.com/ubuntudevelopers theres an interview with her
Daekdroom: Why do women working in computing have to be either hot or ugly?
Nevtus: d2kx: geek sexism is just sad
bluekoala: Engineer chicks are generally really cute
bluekoala: Or really not
Nevtus: d2kx: and I wasn't talking about you
Daekdroom: They're never average.
Megagun: Just joking around :P
bluekoala: There's 10 types of people in the world
bluekoala: People who understand binary, and people who don't
Nevtus: old joke is old
Zerb_Riss: thank you for that t-shirt tagline
bluekoala: (Ripped from bash.org)
Azalyn: sexist jokes are also old.
Azalyn: and yet everyone seems to think they're still funny.
giselher: Wii
Megagun: and those that understand grey notation
Megagun: *gray
Azalyn: despite how dated they are.
bluekoala: Azalyn: That's probably because they are
mastertheknife: bluekoala: I actually heard a different version
bluekoala: Shoot
mastertheknife: believes there are two people, those who backup, and those who never had an hard drive fail
Azalyn: only to a simpleton.
mastertheknife: two types of people*
giselher: never had an hard drive fail
Daekdroom: never had an hard driver fail, yet
Nevtus: nice, open source google tv
bluekoala: Azalyn: I do like things simple
bluekoala: I've had hard drives fail a lot
bluekoala: The first one was a seagate 40mbs
bluekoala: But that was entirely my bad
bluekoala: HDD's don't like being hot swapped if they're not made for it
Daekdroom: Lawl
bluekoala: Damn quite PSU's
bluekoala: *quiet
Daekdroom: So you didn't know it was on? o.o
bluekoala: *realize
bluekoala: It's ok
Daekdroom: Well, that makes it sound even more stupid.
bluekoala: Arguably
bluekoala: It was a test pc
bluekoala: So it's all good
bluekoala: I never messed up a production PC
bluekoala: Liar
bluekoala: Not full
bluekoala: ooooooOOOOOOOOooooooo
bluekoala: Impordant people
bluekoala: lol
Megagun: Steve Jobs, Apple
Megagun: oh wait
bluekoala: Facepalm @ bluetooth keyboard
Megagun: Where's Gabe? >:(
Azalyn: if we could set off a bomb and get rid of those CEO's, we could save the world.
bluekoala: Nah
d2kx: intel atom sucks
bluekoala: World bankers
Daekdroom: Azalyn, we couldn't
Daekdroom: There would always be another bastard to replace them
Nevtus: oh great, a scripted Q&A session. Exciting
d2kx: yeah
Azalyn: no. we'd have OPEN SOURCE world leadership
bluekoala: You can't ask too much of CEO's
d2kx: high performance computing... wait, werent they just talking about intel atom platform?
Nevtus: yup, to power a tv...
Daekdroom: Isn't that overkill?
bluekoala: "Why are you here?"
Azalyn: this guy is from adobe?
d2kx: yes
bluekoala: Yes
Nevtus: CEO apparently
d2kx: to any device... yeah because flash performans so great on non windows platforms
bluekoala: d2kx: Seems like they've made big progress in the last year
Nevtus: this guy is like a historian
bluekoala: pip pip shera
bluekoala: Who's CEO is this again?
d2kx: oh boy CEO's speaking crap they carefully prepared... can it get more boring
Megagun: Sony I think
bluekoala: I don't like Sony
Nevtus: scripted joke. awesome
Megagun: CEO butt-licking
Azalyn: zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
bluekoala: Sony = innovation?
bluekoala: That's coming from Google?
Megagun: bluekoala: UMDs. :)
bluekoala: lol
SageX: I heard that linux has a "squeaky" valve (client)
Azalyn: i don't think it's scripted. CEO's don't need to script their bullshit, it comes naturally. :)
bluekoala: Hahaha
bluekoala: Harmony huh?
Azalyn: which ceo is this now?
bluekoala: That's a sexy remote
Megagun: Logitech
bluekoala: Logitech
Megagun: The guys that made the keyboard
Megagun: :)
Nevtus: the keyboard that failed
bluekoala: RF interference
bluekoala: Wireless fails
bluekoala: Keyboard itself is fine
bluekoala: I think Erci Smidt is a close of Steve Jobbs
bluekoala: *Eric Schmidt
bluekoala: *Clone
bluekoala: Is this guy dish network?
DonScott: yeah
bluekoala: Live now! Eric Schmidt performing fallcio!
bluekoala: Damn I can't spell today
bluekoala: Best buy CEO performs Fellacio on himself
Azalyn: it's 'fellatio'
Nevtus: isn't this all a bit much for a tv with a web browser?
bluekoala: Thank hugh
Azalyn: this part of the conference is so boring....
Azalyn: seriously
Azalyn: BORING.
bluekoala: Not as boring as the NBA suit
d2kx: Nevtus: i agree... but TV seems to be a bigger deal in america than anywhere else
bluekoala: I'm enjoying this guy
bluekoala: I wish he had puppets attached to his hands
Ivanovic: has a tv card in his computer
Ivanovic: ain't this the better way?
Ivanovic: ^^
Nevtus: I have a usb tv thing. works fine
bluekoala: It is if you can get it to work right
bluekoala: But Morons love their TV's
d2kx: watching blu-rays or something with family and friends on a TV = great. actual tv programme though? = crap
bluekoala: So we have to desguise a computer as a TV
Nevtus: have they said anything about recording shows or even playing your own content on this?
bluekoala: I think so
d2kx: Nevtus yes recording is posisble
bluekoala: Wasn't the NBA suit saying someething about recording?
Megagun: Recording shows, yes. Own content, no (except for photos)
Ivanovic: my tv is mainly an additional computer display
Ivanovic: lovely for watching stuff recorded via the tv card on my pc
Azalyn: oh, this onstar android thing is pretty cool
Azalyn: you can unlock your car
Azalyn: lulz
Nevtus: looks exploitable
bluekoala: wtf
SageX: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/industry-leaders-announce-open-platform-to-bring-web-to-tv-2010-05-20?reflink=MW_news_stmp
bluekoala: Get a tomtom
Nevtus: so is that it?
bluekoala: Now with Dath Vader voice
SageX: probably
d2kx: VP8 > Android 2.2 > Google TV
Azalyn: now we continue to wait for valve to talk about the linux client.
Azalyn: *sigh*
bluekoala: GoogleTV = Android
Azalyn: yeah, google tv isn't very impressive.
bluekoala: It's alright
RambJoe: htc desire better have 2.2 by the time i get it
Azalyn: i haven't watched tv since like, last year or something
Ivanovic: googletv = android on x86!
Ivanovic: (IIRC so far android was arm only)
bluekoala: I got android live running on x86
SageX: Azalyn> now we continue to wait....(sage... is that today?
Azalyn: i'm pretty sure that android would be portable to any arch.. heh
Azalyn: SageX: eh? i don't know.
Azalyn: i'm saying wait in general.
SageX: oh
Azalyn: not specifically today.
SageX: ok
Azalyn: there is seagate's presentation though...
Azalyn: it's rumored they're going to show off a hybrid drive
Azalyn: that is 20% faster than a 10k rpm drive.
bluekoala: Interesting
bluekoala: For what?
RambJoe: boots within 6 seconds of an ssd
Azalyn: would have like 4GB flash memory.
RambJoe: dunno if they mean faster or slower
Azalyn: bluekoala: for a pc.
RambJoe: http://www.overclock.net/hardware-news/735701-seagate-hybrid-drive.html
bluekoala: Right, but faster how?
bluekoala: Data throughput?
bluekoala: I/O?
bluekoala: Seek time?
Azalyn: they just say "20% faster"
bluekoala: All?
bluekoala: Than what?
bluekoala: lol
Azalyn: than a 10k rpm drive... i just said.
RambJoe: http://www.overclock.net/attachments/hardware-news/155977d1274232086-seagate-hybrid-drive-seagate.png
bluekoala: I can walk 800% faster (than wheelchair man)
bluekoala: But that doesn't really mean anything
bluekoala: kk
Azalyn: maybe you don't know how to read. :|
Azalyn: i said it twice now.
bluekoala: I know
bluekoala: But the follow up question is:
bluekoala: Which 10k rpm drive? :P
Azalyn: your mother's.
bluekoala: Right
bluekoala: So it's not that fast then
RambJoe: wait this is getting acouned in 6 days
bluekoala: Let's see what WD comes up with
Daekdroom: That sounds reasonably fast for just another 4GB of flash memory.
Azalyn: at the rumored prices, i won't be buying them anytime soon.
Daekdroom: I would love to read an article on how it works :P
DonScott: bleh.....no need for a hybrid drive....they'll be phased out quick when SSD storage increases and a price drops.
Daekdroom: DonScott, yeah, and while we wait for that..
DonScott: don't be hating.....i'm just saying unnecessary upgrade
bluekoala: SSD's are getting cheap quickly though
Daekdroom: I'm not hating.
Azalyn: i don't like the write cycle problem on ssd's.
Daekdroom: Well.. Where I live I can buy 1.5TB HD OR 32GB SSD..
Daekdroom: That sounds distant enough for me.
Azalyn: although i'm interested in these 'nanodot' storage technologies.
Azalyn: http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2010/05/04/scientists-create-nanodot-ssds/1
bluekoala: I would put my OS on a 32GB SSD and put my data storage on 1.5TB
bluekoala: But right now I got 2x 1.5TB in Raid0
Daekdroom: What I mean is that it's an outrage both cost the same.
Zerb_Riss: is it over?
Zerb_Riss: did anything happen in the last half hour?
Nevtus: nope
bluekoala: Daekdroom: It give you a choice between performance and capacity
Daekdroom: bluekoala, yeah, but it's not like I can do anything with 32GB
bluekoala: Daekdroom: How big is your OS?
Daekdroom: My current PC is currently barely holding 300GB, and I believe I would use much more if I had a larger HD.
bluekoala: Right, how much of it is MP3's and movies?
Daekdroom: Most of it.
Daekdroom: xD
bluekoala: There ya go
bluekoala: You don't need ultra fast HDDs for that
Daekdroom: Probably why it looks like SSD's extra speed is useless
RambJoe: should i format my 1.5tb drive as ntfs or ext4 :P
bluekoala: I would recommend ext4 over ntfs
bluekoala: Unless you have windows clients
RambJoe: yeah i do, but how much better is ext4 than ntfs
RambJoe: i don't trust ntfs now as i lost all my data :P
Kvisle: what OS are gonna mount the drive?
bluekoala: RambJoe: Did you try to get it back with testdive?
rsk: on a scale (_)_)===D <- NTFS (_)_)=============================================================D -< EXT4
RambJoe: um
RambJoe: well thats what broke it to start with lol
RambJoe: wait foes quick format only delete the table?
Daekdroom: quick format does still erase all your data, as far as I know.
RambJoe: oh
bluekoala: RambJoe: Yes
Daekdroom: It just doesn't delete the 0s and 1s. The data is still there, but there are no file/directory list to be read.
bluekoala: With Test drive you can recreate your partitions
RambJoe: so i could do that, then analyze with test disk
bluekoala: And your tables
RambJoe: :)
bluekoala: test disk right
bluekoala: Yes
RambJoe: so i should quick format as ntfs if i used that last time?
bluekoala: It happenned to me during a windows install
bluekoala: You should go in test disk and analyze
bluekoala: Find your partitions and re-write them
bluekoala: You should be able to get most of your data back
bluekoala: if not all
RambJoe: :P
bluekoala: Unless you overwrote
RambJoe: so format first?
bluekoala: No
Daekdroom: No >.>
bluekoala: If your HDD unformatted?
bluekoala: Inyhoo, I gotta shower and head to work
bluekoala: Good luck with that
RambJoe: ok thanks
RambJoe: analyze > quick search
Midler: when will next showcasst be up?
Midler: on io?
RambJoe: why are ssds so expensive
maligor: wasn't the day 2 keynote already?
Zerb_Riss: maligor: yes
Zerb_Riss: http://googleblog.blogspot.com/
maligor: it just had google tv?
Zerb_Riss: and Android Froyo
RambJoe: wow the app store is like a package manager now :)
maligor: did they mention any developer stuff on google tv?
maligor: like say... where to download the platform? :P
rsk: what plattform?
maligor: obviously it has to run software
rsk: wat
maligor: or is it just a server side api for searching?
maligor: "Google TV is a new experience for television that combines the TV that you already know with the freedom and power of the Internet. With Google Chrome built in, you can access all of your favorite websites and easily move between television and the web."
maligor: obviously that implies that it's a platform of some sort
maligor: aka.. os
RambJoe: This way, just because Google rolls out an awesome new browser doesn't mean you need to wait for HTC, Samsung, or whomever made your phone to roll it into a firmware update, and for your carrier to approve it -- almost all of the juicy user-facing stuff will happen through the Market.
RambJoe: OMFG
maligor: system updates through market?
RambJoe: um no what it means is
RambJoe: like HTC sense UI through the market place
RambJoe: instead of having to wait months for HTC to release 2.2
mastertheknife: so many google fanboys
giselher: yay google
DonScott: yeah but you gotta admit Google is awesome
giselher: btw; mastertheknife: some news on steam?
mastertheknife: Google is not awesome
mastertheknife: its nice, but let it take over the internet
mastertheknife: but dont let*
mastertheknife: giselher: no..
DonScott: Google is the internet
DonScott: lol
mastertheknife: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?p=15043316&posted=1#post15043316
mastertheknife: mac fags.. lol
giselher: lol
giselher: mastertheknife: should we start a flameware?
mastertheknife: heh we'll get banned..
giselher: lol
giselher: while I build heimdal for the hurd, I do have some free time :)
mastertheknife: i dont understand what is the thing he drew
giselher: a door
The_Muh: mac is more stable? nothing is more stable than debian
mastertheknife: a door?
mastertheknife: how rude
mastertheknife: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1275342&page=3
mastertheknife: thats better
mastertheknife: lol
Ivanovic: The_Muh: so far the comparision regarding stable is win32 version of steam(games) vs osx version of steam(games)
Ivanovic: The_Muh: and in the win32 version the crashy wine edition is included
The_Muh: oh.. only read the topic
Nevtus: ahh, that thread is tempting me to post in it
mastertheknife: Nevtus: Score :)
maligor: tempting to do some more ascii art in the thread
DonScott: man.....i want to play TF2....with higher than 20fps on my 8800gt in linux soooooo bad.
mastertheknife: DonScott: me too.. TF2 can look really nice
DonScott: it does
DonScott: i would also like to be able to Alt-tab the game
clueless247: DonScott: there is the xorg.conf trick "Section "ServerFlags"
clueless247: Option "Xinerama" "off"
clueless247: Option "AIGLX" "1"
clueless247: Option "AllowDeactivateGrabs" "1"
clueless247: EndSection"
clueless247: where you just press Alt+Enter to unmaximize a program
clueless247: but yeah, normal alt tab would be good
DonScott: yeah
DonScott: see
DonScott: the sad part is that coming from windows...i KNOW the game gets more fps....but wine has to translate Dx9 ....making it a LOT slower...
DonScott: and i dont like it
DonScott: but
DonScott: at least I can look at it
mastertheknife: DonScott: -dxlevel 81 should be much faster without much quality difference
mastertheknife: DonScott: I wish L4D wasn't locked to DirectX 9, i have to play it at 1024x768 all lowest windowed with my 8800gt
wewantsteam: hm i just installed portal with wine - now portal crashes everytime i press a key (except for the mouse) :(
mastertheknife: wewantsteam: what wine version?
wewantsteam: mastertheknife: the newest, 1.1.44
mastertheknife: Oh, works fine here, strange
DonScott: I have a dream that one day you can make any game be run NATIVELY on any OS ......honestly no ones thought of this yet ?
mastertheknife: have you tried running Portal on winXP mode
mastertheknife: DonScott: Yeah ,that would be great
mastertheknife: DonScott: but microsoft needs to stop pushing their DirectX junk
wewantsteam: mastertheknife: yes - i also tried any other windows version - i disabled fullscreen, compiz, steam community and set dxmode to 80 - nothing helped
DonScott: couldn't you just make something that takes DirectX code and translate it to OpenGl though ? Then compile the game to the Native OS ?
DonScott: that's what I'm talking about
s_20: DonScott: you're not a programmer, are you? ;)
DonScott: that easy to tell i'm not is it ?
DonScott: lol
Wicked: mastertheknife, anything new developing with hacking away at the steam linux client? last i saw you guys almost got fonts rendering?
Tazer: I'm pretty sure Source itself is already ported to OpenGL
Tazer: the reason the other source games are taking so long would probably be because of any windows dependencies they rely on
Tazer: I figure Portal would have the least of these being the smallest game and not being web related O:
s_20: DonScott: to closest you get to this utopic technique is using java/.net
Ivanovic: Tazer: the latest version of the source engine does offer opengl
Ivanovic: Tazer: one product using the final version of it being rather well tested is portal
Tazer: Exactly
Ivanovic: currently cs:s is in beta with this version of the engine
Ivanovic: IIRC that is the same regarding TF2
Ivanovic: at the moment the versions of those games with the "new" engine are not final yet and thus not available on mac
Tazer: The reason I mentioned it is because of DonScott's idea to port the games and stuff
RambJoe: if it wasn't for xbox valve could just ditch directx on all platforms
Ivanovic: and yes, a huge potion of porting to different platforms is testing if it really does work
Ivanovic: RambJoe: yes
RambJoe: i hate microsoft :'(
Tazer: Xbox get out
RambJoe: what are valve's sales even like on it
RambJoe: i'm guessing L4D is the only decent selling game
DonScott: not too good if they're porting lol
Ivanovic: Tazer: honestly the xbox is, from a gamers perspective, quite okay
Tazer: i know ;w;
Tazer: I own one
Ivanovic: though personally i don't like shooter on consoles
Tazer: All I've played on mine though, is Bayonetta
Ivanovic: in those i prefer having a mouse
Ivanovic: Tazer: try some of the jrpgs, there are really good ones for the xbox
Ivanovic: eg lost odyssey
Tazer: but the reason for that is mostly that I can't buy M rated games without swindling my grandparents into thinking it involves naked chicks or something
Tazer: I tried lost odyssey! It bored me.
Tazer: I liked Eternal Sonata until the PS3 port fucked me over
Tazer: Ditto Tales of Vesperia
Tazer: I'm fairly sure I've played some other things on the 360 but I have just about the worst memory ever so
maligor: don't have a card to order online? ;P
Tazer: I do if I ask my grandparents for one :Smith:
Tazer: I wonder if I could still get them to let me buy M+ games after I come out to grandpa :U But it doesn't really matter
Tazer: ~three more months~
Tazer: I should stop babbling. Have this instead:
maligor: how old are you?-)
Tazer: http://www.theonion.com/articles/new-social-networking-site-changing-the-way-oh-chr,17465/
Tazer: 16
maligor: can't get a visa electron?
maligor: ofcourse I totally don't want to help people bypass age restructions, they're there for good reason, heh
maligor: especially since they didn't exist when I was younger :P
Tazer: I can try but if it can buy stuff online it'd probably need a parents permission
maligor: 'it'?
Tazer: The Visa Electron :U
maligor: oh, yes, I only use my electron
Tazer: Oh
Tazer: Right, it would be 'I need a parents permission', wouldn't it?
maligor: my bank required me to enable it for internet purchases however
maligor: dunno.. why would it?
maligor: it does direct billing
Tazer: because everything more or less seems to. Still, I'll check this out, thanks :O
Tazer: Being able to buy stuff online easily is always a plus
mastertheknife: Wicked: Not me, it was espes. I don't think i can pour more time into the client
mastertheknife: RambJoe: Yeah, if it wasn't for xbox
Wicked: mastertheknife, ah ok. :)
mastertheknife: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1275130
mastertheknife: mac users ungrateful again, lol.
DonScott: ahhhh mac invents the new iHate
DonScott: lol
mastertheknife: wewantsteam: I really have no idea, but can you upload your xorg.conf, maybe something input related is messed up
Tazer: fff
Tazer: ~Phoronix, I'm curious, are there any efforts being made to port OS X software to Linux, like Wine?
mastertheknife: Why port OS X crap into Linux, lol
mastertheknife: and it can't happen Tazer
mastertheknife: Apple will freak out
Tazer: Steam nuff siad
Tazer: said*
mastertheknife: You know how strict is Apple's DRM
Tazer: True
alexandernst: linux steam client is returning 403. Is there any fix?
mastertheknife: Steam will come natively, i hope
Tazer: So do I
mastertheknife: alexandernst: No not really, Valve changed the permissions on the file
Tazer: I'm pretty optimistic about it
mastertheknife: alexandernst: They are either nuking the client, or working on it without wanting us to see :)
Tazer: But the rough release time was around the end of summer, right?
mastertheknife: I think the latter.
alexandernst: mastertheknife: damn :( It was nice to see how they update things every 2 or 3 days.
Tazer: If they were nuking it, it would be removed
mastertheknife: Tazer: I think anywhere from 2-5 months until release
alexandernst: mastertheknife: According to Valve-time ?
alexandernst: or Earth-time
Tazer: That sounds about right to me---Earth time
mastertheknife: Ah i didn't take Valve time into account :P
Tazer: No valve time allowed here
Tazer: no
Tazer: nooo
alexandernst: lol
Tazer: ;o;
mastertheknife: haha
Tazer: But yeah
Tazer: I wanted to get Steam working again but I really don't like using it with wine
Tazer: everything lags and stuff
alexandernst: let's hope that linux version wont do such things
alexandernst: btw, do you know what graphical libs are they using?
giselher: libx11, libgl
alexandernst: giselher: Nice, no qt4-gtk-efl-something_else war :)
giselher: but their own vgui, which also looks different
RambJoe: red dead redemption isn't on pc is it
giselher: no
giselher: I want my libsteam.so, because i want my own steam app in wxWidgets
alexandernst: giselher: :o
alexandernst: giselher: I really doupt that you'll be able to rewrite the ui part
giselher: :D
alexandernst: giselher: somebody here wrote some little fixes in order to load the ui
alexandernst: but rewriting the entire ui is really different
giselher: well, I write my own UI
alexandernst: ok, ok :) Just don't forget to share it :p
mastertheknife: The steam UI is very modular and an advanced
mastertheknife: and its actually rendered as OpenGL
mastertheknife: and advanced*
alexandernst: mastertheknife: Do you know if there is some reason that they are not just using some graphic libs?
mastertheknife: they are using OpenGL for everything
mastertheknife: even the fonts
alexandernst: yeah, sure. But why rediscover the wheel?
giselher: alexandernst: because they already have vgui
mastertheknife: alexandernst: Yeah, because you can't really make the client look the same as Windows and Mac in QT\GTK
mastertheknife: well you can
mastertheknife: but i guess they think X11 is better
alexandernst: is qt4 coder
giselher: the also use vgui ingame, doesn't they?
giselher: wxPython coder
mastertheknife: C coder :/
mastertheknife: In windows i made few programs
giselher: mastertheknife: do you know some good C tutorials with motivating examples :)
mastertheknife: and wrote the GUI all with notepad, all in C
mastertheknife: giselher: I'm new to C coding in linux lol
mastertheknife: I mean
mastertheknife: no experience with X11
giselher: I want to learn some C to write some Hurd drivers
giselher: and Hurd servers/translators
mastertheknife: giselher: there are nice tutorials for writing a kernel module\driver actually
mastertheknife: in google
alexandernst: gtg
mastertheknife: http://tldp.org/LDP/lkmpg/2.6/html/x121.html
mastertheknife: see ya alexandernst
alexandernst: if any news about linux steam client, ping me please
alexandernst: mastertheknife: cya :)
RambJoe: omfg i hate htc
RambJoe: apparently populour htc phones MIGHT get Froyo second half of the year
mastertheknife: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1276479
mastertheknife: Interesting. Don't forget us Gabe !
RambJoe: mac is open?
mastertheknife: Yeah whats open about Mac
cmdrk: the box it came in
RambJoe: lol
RambJoe: maybe he meant linux
Modplan: methinks that was taken drastically out of context...
RambJoe: what was the other site with the video
RambJoe: that was uploaded yesterday, i dont like this video, no time tag :P
mastertheknife: Its still buffering here
mastertheknife: i cant open i t
mastertheknife: ill search in youtube
RambJoe: its lik an hour lol
RambJoe: i watched yesterday
RambJoe: gabe uses the word "canonical"
mastertheknife: well its really slow
mastertheknife: will probably take an hour until i can watch it
mastertheknife: heh
mastertheknife: there.. :)
RambJoe: i ahte this shitty flash video player i need to know what time im at on the video
mastertheknife: heh doesnt show yeah
RambJoe: http://5by5.tv/conversation/16
Modplan: why was dusty_fox banned?
mastertheknife: no idea
mastertheknife: "We're betting on the open platforms"
mastertheknife: this is a good sign
Tazer: Yes
Tazer: A very good one
Tazer: I wonder when the official announcement will come
Tazer: I'm betting within this week
RambJoe: or e3
Nevtus: mastertheknife: the plural is a good sign
Tazer: (this week as in until the 27th)
Tazer: Or E3, yes
Nevtus: obviously thinking of more than the current platforms supported
Tazer: I have to say I'm getting impatient :P
Tazer: I'm waiting for Steam until I can delete my windows partition and experiment with a bunch of linux distros wholeheartedly
Nevtus: same, but at least it won't be as buggy as the mac release when it comes
mastertheknife: "So when we look ourselves going forward, we're pretty much betting on the open platforms. the platforms where there are functions in terms of who can sell products, who can develop products, what kind of content can be released on those systems"
Nevtus: not same in the windows thing
Nevtus: I got rid of my windows partitions YEARS ago :)
mastertheknife: Nevtus: Yes, but he also considers the PS3 an open platform
Ivanovic: RambJoe: i recommend downloading the video files and watching them in an external player like eg kaffeine or whatever you normally use
mastertheknife: Nevtus: so how can we know if linux is included
Ivanovic: there is no need to watch it in your browser using the flash video player
Nevtus: oh dear
mastertheknife: I suggest watching the video: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1276479
RambJoe: then i'd need to sniff the packets lol, can't wait till html5 takes over xD
RambJoe: http://5by5.tv/conversation/16 better stream
Ivanovic: RambJoe: try this: wget http://5by5.tv/videos/conversation/2010/conversation-ep16.mp4?1274292438
Ivanovic: no need for any sniffing
RambJoe: "its not like this cannonical version"
RambJoe: ok thanks
Zerb_Riss: lol
Zerb_Riss: I want the PS3 to be open like a MAc
Zerb_Riss: I love that irony
RambJoe: ps3 used to have linux :(
Nevtus: that's just stupid
RambJoe: was he hinting at something with cannonical
Nevtus: RambJoe: I ps3 still has a linux install on it. It's in a box somewhere...
s_20: RambJoe: it never ran natively anyway
RambJoe: oh
Nevtus: yeah you never got access to the GPU
Nevtus: but you could assess the cell processor
RambJoe: :(
Nevtus: some universitys used it for projects
s_20: RambJoe: also, there is not enough ram to use it for anything serious
RambJoe: watch 16:00 on the video
RambJoe: notice him look up top left when he says canonical :P
Zerb_Riss: L for Linux
mastertheknife: Im watching the video trying to find hints for a linux client
Tazer: There are plenty if you don't mind taking a few jumps
Tazer: The references for Openness
RambJoe: mastertheknife: he uses the word canonical at 16:05 or soemething lol
Tazer: O:? he does?
RambJoe: yes
Tazer: Well, that's even better
Tazer: I missed it
RambJoe: "its not like there's this canonical version"
DonScott: it's an interesting word to use but that wasn't the context.
RambJoe: Canonical is an adjective derived from canon. Canon comes from the Greek word kanon, "rule" (perhaps originally from kanna "reed", cognate to cane), and is used in various meanings.
RambJoe: he be given us hints
Tazer: Any of you familiar with iphones/itouches?
Nevtus: okay after watching that canonical bit, I doubt it was a hint to Steam on Linux at all
RambJoe: :(
Nevtus: he was just answering the question
mastertheknife: "We really try to think of the right architectures of going forward, its not where we are today, but where will be in 5 years
Tazer: no we will take everything out of context that we can
Tazer: Stop hurting our hope!
RambJoe: lol
Tazer: booo nevtus boooo!
Nevtus: I want it too, but there is no point seeing hints where there isn't any
Tazer: Yes there is
Tazer: there is plenty of point
Tazer: False hope is still hope if it turns out to be true hope!
Nevtus: False hope is false
Tazer: Not if it's true in the long run
Tazer: My arguements don't need to make sense, you silly thing
DonScott: nah there is a hint in it you guys just aren't hearing it.
RambJoe: valve do shit like this all the time though
Tazer: that too
DonScott: which is odd because it's one of the main reasons everyone gives when they heard about it coming to the mac
Nevtus: I hate the way he keeps called Windows "PC"
Nevtus: *calling
Ivanovic: Nevtus: soon PC will not refer to windows anymore since windows will be forgotten
Ivanovic: (yeah, planning 5 years ahead already)
Ivanovic: ;)
RambJoe: maybe by pc he means linux
RambJoe: lol wut
Tazer: Guys, do Itouches work with Lucid by default?
Ivanovic: honestly, the ars technica guy in that interview has no real idea what he is talking about and he is asking the wrong questions
RambJoe: should have asked this:
Nevtus: STEAM ON LINUX, Y/N!
Wowi: Abort
RambJoe: Are you releasing a Linux client and Source games on Linux?
Tazer: The ars technica guy was there to talk about steam on macs
Tazer: couldn't care less about linux
Ivanovic: he eg starts with the right part, being about apple and microsoft wanting to bundle their OS with their sales platform (windows live and itunes)
Ivanovic: but never concludes to platforms where there is no such "uniform store" yet
Nevtus: what about, "Are you going to support more platforms now the the Mac release has been a success after only a week?"
Tazer: That might have worked
Ivanovic: Nevtus: yes, those would be a good question, too
Tazer: THEN AGAIN
Tazer: You don't know if he was given guidelines and limitations like "Don't talk about the linux client or fuck you"
Ivanovic: in general that dude IMO had no real idea what stuff is about...
Nevtus: which is depressing for a tech site
Tazer: But not impossible.
RambJoe: yeah they probably said before the interview not to talk about it :(
Ivanovic: fells like a 6year old was invited into the interview only getting out a "wow, so you are behind games? wow!!!
Nevtus: omg! valve! omg!! GABE!!
Ivanovic: Nevtus: jepp
RambJoe: phoronix should interview gabe
Tazer: maan
Ivanovic: hmm, maybe they should have invited this mac pro with the youtube clip showing how incompetent he is...
Ivanovic: ^^
Tazer: i need a usb mouse
Ivanovic: would at least have been funny...
Nevtus: yessss, they should have played that video and then just said "Discuss"
DonScott: that woulda been funny as hell
Ivanovic: Nevtus: the commented or the original version?
Nevtus: original
Zerb_Riss: http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/MarkDeLoura/20100519/5195/Google_IO_2010__Native_Client_Unity__Chrome_Web_Store.php
Zerb_Riss: interesting
RambJoe: ubuntu billboard
mastertheknife: "It turns out its a good idea to having costumers host game servers, but its also turns out trying to turn customers into experts into your code base is a bad idea"
mastertheknife: lol
mastertheknife: Valve probably told them not to ask linux related questions
RambJoe: aw hell naw
Nevtus: I'm not sure, these guys seem pretty clueless and unlikely to ask a question like that anyway
RambJoe: yeah
RambJoe: mac users
mastertheknife: mac fags
mastertheknife: lol
mastertheknife: One of them doesnt stop talking about steam for mac
RambJoe: i might email gabe
mastertheknife: I wonder if he reads the emails himself
DonScott: e-mail him a penguin like jumbers did.
RambJoe: lol ok
RambJoe: should i ask him what canonical means
jumbers: 1 sec, I'll give you the pastebin link
RambJoe: yeah he said he reads them all
jumbers: http://pb.jnumbers.com/7
RambJoe: but doesn't reply to them all
jumbers: Yes, he does read all of his email
Megagun: wtf interview
mastertheknife: Megagun: 1 hour review
mastertheknife: interview*
Ivanovic: Megagun: wget http://5by5.tv/videos/conversation/2010/conversation-ep16.mp4?1274292438
Megagun: Yeah, I'm grabbing it
Nevtus: spoiler: it's not that interesting
Ivanovic: that interview
Megagun: "What is steam for mac"
Megagun: *HOUR LONG TALK ABOUT GAPHICS*
Megagun: graphics even
Megagun: It's worse than Google's CEO masturbation. :|
RambJoe: wtf was with that google stream earlier all i saw was google people talking to each other sitting in a line lol
Nevtus: this "chatroom" they talk about, there must have been someone in there asking them to ask about Steam on Linux
mastertheknife: I should email Gabe aswell
Nevtus: RambJoe: only one of them was from google, they were all CEOs from other big companies like Sony, Logitech, Best Buy etc
Nevtus: it was mainly about Google TV
RambJoe: ohh
RambJoe: #5by5 freenode
mastertheknife: he didnt feel like answering about the ps3
DonScott: he was cranky about ps3
DonScott: lol
asraniel: where can i find the stream?
Ivanovic: asraniel: which one?
Ivanovic: the google conference live stream?
asraniel: is that still on?
Ivanovic: or the interview with gabe from valve?
asraniel: jeah , that one
Ivanovic: no, the live stream is over
Ivanovic: the interview: wget wget http://5by5.tv/videos/conversation/2010/conversation-ep16.mp4?1274292438
Nevtus: that guy does not give up with the Steam on Mac thing
Ivanovic: -wget
mastertheknife: Nevtus: Yeah.
Nevtus: every damn question is more or less about it
mastertheknife: Nevtus: What a fanboy!
Ivanovic: Nevtus, mastertheknife: url?
Nevtus: what a bad interviewer
Ivanovic: yeah, the interview was really bad
Ivanovic: and like i said, the guest was not really competant on the matter either...
RambJoe: i barely saw that other guest
Ivanovic: anyway, time for my lovely bed...
Ivanovic: n8
mastertheknife: n8 Ivanovic
mastertheknife: hey michaellarabel
mastertheknife: michaellarabel: interesting interview with some hints regarding linux client: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=247526
Megagun: So what are the actual hints in there?
Nevtus: not really
RambJoe: http://5by5.tv/conversation/16 better link, thats the actual origianal source from the interviewer
RambJoe: well hints we hope are hints like using words like "canonical" and talking about openness
Megagun: Saying the world canonical is not a hint
Nevtus: and then saying Mac is what they consider "open"...
asraniel: it is!
Megagun: *word
mastertheknife: there are clear hints
Megagun: But except for 'canonical'? :P
mastertheknife: i just dont know the exact minutes cause im watching from the browser
mastertheknife: it doesnt show time
RambJoe: 16:05
mastertheknife: there is also a one
mastertheknife: around umm..
RambJoe: the 5by5.tv link doe
mastertheknife: minute 40+
mastertheknife: he talked about open platforms
Megagun: He calls it "PC" instead of "Windows"
Megagun: That pretty much tells me that he has no clue whatsoever about non-Windows OSes
asraniel: we are really desperate....
RambJoe: its like at on steam store too :(
Nevtus: hmm, near the end Gabe says he thinks Microsoft should release their source code
RambJoe: like that's going to happen lol
Nevtus: he then talks about closed vs open and the possibility of "other platform decisions"
Megagun: Hm, he does know about P8
Megagun: *VP8
Zerb_Riss: because Apple releases their source code?
Zerb_Riss: wtfh?
Megagun: Maybe he does know something about Linux and such
RambJoe: have they released the sdk for mac yet
Nevtus: is the stuff about Source SDK hinting he thinks they should have open sourced their engine? It seems to come out of nowhere after talking about open systems
RambJoe: someone needs to find linux hints in the source engine :P
Nevtus: the last 10 minutes or so are certainly the most interesting
mastertheknife: Seems he is a fan of Open Source
Nevtus: which is surprising
Nevtus: oh, the SDK thing. I misheard it. He's talking about modding the Steam client
Nevtus: he wants a Steam SDK
Wicked: totally sounds like someone rips a fart in that interview with gabe lol
RambJoe: everyone shuld email gabe about linux
mastertheknife: Gabe seems like someone that believes in potential
RambJoe: oh yeah wtf was he on about at the end
RambJoe: with that itunes bs
mastertheknife: I'm sure he is aware of the Steam on Linux potential, but just waiting a little
Nevtus: RambJoe: what itunes bs?
rsk: how can something about itunes not be bs?
rsk: is my question :p
Nevtus: true, but where was it mentioned in the interview
Daekdroom: I realized iTunes is full of bullshit when Ubuntu's basic iPod touch support outperformed it somehow.
RambJoe: lol
RambJoe: the interviewer was saying apple is trying to be steam with itunes or some shit
Daekdroom: Don't you mean Valve?
Nevtus: I thought he was talking about the app store on iphone/ipod/ipad
RambJoe: yeah
Nevtus: and the possibility it would move to Mac OS
Nevtus: the desktop versioon
RambJoe: yeah that as well
Nevtus: *version
Zerb_Riss: iTune is horrible
Zerb_Riss: iTunes*
burra: seems like they also are thrilled about opengl :)
Daekdroom: wouldn't buy another iPod
Zerb_Riss: if iTunes was trying to be Steam, they would catalgoue your purchase history and let you download anything you bought as many times as you want
Zerb_Riss: but it doesn't do that at all
RambJoe: doesn't it :|
Zerb_Riss: nope
Zerb_Riss: in fact if you go to something you bought, it prompts you to rebuy it
Zerb_Riss: AFTER you tell it you will buy it again, it says "oh, you already bought this recently... would you like to redownload it?"
Azalyn: wait a minute...
Zerb_Riss: and after some amount of time, you can't do that anymore
Azalyn: you can't redownload stuff?
Azalyn: :|
Zerb_Riss: not in iTunes
Azalyn: really?
Zerb_Riss: nope
Azalyn: i thought that was the whole point of itunes
Daekdroom: I never bought a single paid app on app store, so I can't tell o.o
Zerb_Riss: no
Zerb_Riss: iTunes is a distribution platform, not a storage platform
burra: hmm, valve might release their linux distro. Then they could control also what drivers you run :)
Daekdroom: but apparently, upgrades are paid, aren't they?
Zerb_Riss: I've never seen an app that charged for updates
Zerb_Riss: but you can supposedly do that
Azalyn: dude, that is so lame. so if your system gets messed up and you need to format..
Daekdroom: I find it funny because I've seen something like "Download all free upgrades" on both my iPod and iTunes.
Zerb_Riss: yep, it's all gone
Azalyn: you can't redownload your music?
Zerb_Riss: not unless you bought it recently
Azalyn: then what the fuck do they offer that piracy doesnt?
Zerb_Riss: absolutely nothing
Zerb_Riss: unless you like CD liners or something
Azalyn: i thought they at least memorized your purchase 'in the cloud' so you could always get it anywhere. what bullshit.
Zerb_Riss: nope
Zerb_Riss: if you go to a different machine, you have nothing
Azalyn: and this system is what made apple billions? fuck, people are such sheep.
Nevtus: yup
Zerb_Riss: I've never bought anything off of iTunes until I got an iPhone
Nevtus: people love getting ripped off
Zerb_Riss: and, honestly, I have bought two songs off there
Zerb_Riss: neither had DRM so I immediately copied them to fifty different places
Nevtus: buying lossy music is silly
Zerb_Riss: anyway, iTunes is a complete turd compared to Steam
Zerb_Riss: AAC isn't really that lossy
Nevtus: umm, yes it's a lossy format
Daekdroom: There is a lossless version of it.
Nevtus: apple doesn't see music in that format though
Nevtus: *sale
Daekdroom: It's just a way to make us convert our lossless songs..
Nevtus: ALAC it's called. Most people have never heard of it
Nevtus: FLAC is better anyway
Daekdroom: Because it'd be like.. a total hell for them to put up FLAC support...
Zerb_Riss: most people don't want to use lossles codecs becauser the file size is much larger
Nevtus: you're getting less for your money
Nevtus: AND you're not even getting the Steam-like redownloading functionality
Zerb_Riss: the only songs I've ever purchased from iTunes were iTunes exclusives
Zerb_Riss: I would never buy a CD or anything from there
Nevtus: those are evil. songs forever in a small bitrate stuck in an apple lossy format
xorl: buy everyone from amazon myself
xorl: lossy format but drm free
Nevtus: itunes is frm free now apparently
Zerb_Riss: most songs on iTunes don't have DRM anymore
Nevtus: *drm
DeathCrawler: Confirmed Steam is confirmed by valve? :P
Azalyn: i'm sitting in a channel watching these codec wizards talking about vp8. and it's like they're talking swahili.
xorl: Azalyn, where? here?
Azalyn: the guy that wrote the article on the x264 site is there too.
Azalyn: if you whois me, you'll probably figure out which one it is.
Lanz: Hi gues
Lanz: guys*
Lanz: Question
Lanz: Should I build a tower now, or wait til August?
Lanz: My main deciding factors are CPU and video card prices
Rednaxela: hasn't been checking up on things lately, but would probably primarily wonder about DDR3 price when considering when to buy lately
Lanz: I wanna build a fairly midrange tower, with a ton of SATA ports, USB3, and a GTX 480
Lanz: I wanna be on a CPU socket that's gonna last
Lanz: What socket is Intel going to?
Rednaxela: has personally never worried about sockets, because he only upgrades every 3 or 4 years and they always change socket in that time frame
Lanz: I upgrade more frequently than that
Daekdroom: I upgrade every 7 years, apparently.
redeeman: I upgrade when I need faster stuff
Lanz: Also, I'm not necessarily sold on the GTX 480, I just don't know much about ATI on Linux
Lanz: Have they closed the gap?
Daekdroom: The binary blob is much more stable, despite still having poor 2D performance
Lanz: In my 8 years on Debian, I've been on an nVidia streak haha
Lanz: Hm
Daekdroom: and the free drivers are doing fine..
Sleepy_Coder: Last night I bought a 140mm fan which pushes ~85CFM @ 12dB
Sleepy_Coder: I f-cking love Noctua.
Lanz: Well I run KDE 4.4.3, would the binary blob be good enough to accelerate KWin's new effects?
Daekdroom: Definitely yes?
redeeman: rofl
Sleepy_Coder: I also bought some Arctic Silver thermal paste because... well you can never have enough. Great for lubricant too.
redeeman: try resize the menu
Lanz: I remember nVidia used to have issues with KDE 4
Lanz: That's why I asked
redeeman: kickoff or what its called
redeeman: and you'll see it redrawing less than 1fps
Lanz: Also, is the performance good enough for HD video playback, and gaming (Urban Terror)?
Lanz: Redeeman: on current ATI hardware and drivers?
redeeman: yes
redeeman: and nvidia
redeeman: probably worst on nvidia though
Lanz: hm
Sleepy_Coder: used to play Urban Terror with his ATi Radeon 4350 :p Top settings... card didn't even have a fan, just a heatsink <3
Lanz: It's not too bad on my current GTX 260
redeeman: lol lanz
Lanz: Haha okay good stuff Sleepy_Coder
redeeman: try resize the menu big
Sleepy_Coder: Don't need expensive video cards on Linux, unless you're playing that pretty shoddy Nexuiz :
Sleepy_Coder: :(*
redeeman: and somewhat fast
Sleepy_Coder: GTX 260 is lovely, I have one myself :)
Sleepy_Coder: I had the 4350 before this, but then I went through a Windows gaming streak
Lanz: I do play Nexuiz in fact
Sleepy_Coder: Oh, I guess it might be needed if Steam is coming to Linux...
redeeman: a GTX 275 can not nearly come close to resize the menu in proper speed
Lanz: The latest nVidia driver really killed Urban Terror performance actually, lol
Sleepy_Coder: XD
Lanz: On ut4_uptown I get like 35 fps at times
Lanz: It's insanity!
Lanz: It used to run fine on the previous revision
redeeman: so report the bug
Lanz: (I'm using the one that's currently in Debian squeeze)
Sleepy_Coder: I hate it when I turn off antialiasing, anistropic filtering, ambient occlusion, and all those other lovely effects, and I get a slower framerate. Really silly hardware.
Lanz: Yeah...
Sleepy_Coder: (tripple buffering was never enabled, so don't raise that argument) :p
Daekdroom: Lol
Sleepy_Coder: No vertical sync either :p
Lanz: Yeah I never turn those on
Lanz: Hm
Sleepy_Coder: I miss cards that were rawly performant :<
Sleepy_Coder: (so it seems)
Lanz: But how about HD video on an ATI card?
Lanz: Anyone have any luck?
Lanz: I'd likely get the HD5870
Sleepy_Coder: Hmm, I don't have a monitor that is considered HD... 1080 lines vertical?
Sleepy_Coder: I would love to get an HD 5870
Lanz: Can you play back a 1080p mkv file?
Sleepy_Coder: When I was using my 4350 I only had one problem with the ATi driver, I couldn't restart the X server without removing some cache file in /etc/ati/...
Lanz: HD video works great on my GTX 260
Sleepy_Coder: Everything else works just perfectly :>
Lanz: Hm that's annoying
Sleepy_Coder: I actually bought that card to show up my Nvidia-using friend.
Lanz: Lol
Sleepy_Coder: He had been smack-talking about ATi all that month T.T
Sleepy_Coder: I bought the card for only $30 and had a perfect experience (aside from that little restarting X problem) for a full year
Sleepy_Coder: I loved how quiet it was, going to the big noisy GTX 260 was quite a shock, though the extra performance was definitely needed for Windows gaming T.T (and I guess Nexuiz)
Lanz: Yeah
Lanz: Alright
Lanz: So you think I'd lose nothing if I got an HT5870 over a GTX 480?
Sleepy_Coder: Really doesn't make sense why Nexuiz seems to slow down everything... their motion blur effect is retarded, I do like the blur when damaged, if I disable all reflections I get a huge burst in framerate :>
Sleepy_Coder: it's like they did something excessively wasteful with reflections T.T
Lanz: I turned off blur, can't stand it
Lanz: Yeah, probably
Sleepy_Coder: I only blur on damage :3 It reminds me of some forgettable 90s game
Sleepy_Coder: I would probably....
Sleepy_Coder: get the HD 5870, just because I think ATi makes better cards :>
Sleepy_Coder: For much more reasonable prices :> I don't personally think their Linux drivers are crap, but I haven't used them in a month... when I was they worked just fine :>
Sleepy_Coder: Might want to talk to someone about those... :>
Sleepy_Coder: 5870 owner, that is :>
Lanz: 3\
Lanz: nexuiz
Sleepy_Coder: Nvidia's cards are huge, hot, and noisy :( They've always had the better Linux drivers, or so speculation will tell us, but I think ATi is more performant.
Sleepy_Coder: So I'm no expert! :D
Sleepy_Coder: hides
Sleepy_Coder: Isn't the GTX 480 like a foot long? 0.o
Sleepy_Coder: If you're using a micro-ATX case you will have some things to consider...
Sleepy_Coder: So I wonder if Microsoft is planning anything to steal the thunder of Steam on Linux
Sleepy_Coder: Steam on the Mac must have been a blow in itself.
RambJoe: fable III on pc
RambJoe: windows*
Sleepy_Coder: orly
Sleepy_Coder: Well that's a shame.
Sleepy_Coder: Microsoft Game Studios puts out some winners.
Sleepy_Coder: I just wonder what things would be like if the marketing heads were more interested in putting out software for everyone rather than promoting just Windows.
Lanz: Is steam on Linux official?
Lanz: Like, did VALVe announce it?
RambJoe: no
Sleepy_Coder: cannot wait for Amnesia: The Dark Descent later this year :3
Sleepy_Coder: Valve hasn't officially announced it, though there are a few news outlets quoting some unvalidated conversation saying Steam for Lin is official.
Sleepy_Coder: The only thing I really do not like about what was said on the Mac release was the bit about Mac and Windows being open platforms, and them referring to Windows as "PC
Sleepy_Coder: +"
Lanz: Yeah I don't like that either
Lanz: It's from that braindead Mac vs PC ad
Sleepy_Coder: http://media.bestofmicro.com/,E-Y-240298-3.jpg
Sleepy_Coder: I lol'd
Rednaxela: It's not only from that braindead ad Lanz
Rednaxela: though that reinforced it yeah...
Lanz: They really ought to be specific
Lanz: Because Macs are PCs too lol
Rednaxela: Yeah, but it's about using the language that the customers will understand. There's a disturbingly large number of windows users that don't know what windows is
Lanz: I know!
Lanz: It's incredible!
Lanz: I just tell them I know 0 about Windows when they have dumbass problems with MS Word
Lanz: Which is more or less true anymore
Rednaxela: Within the people who would be prone to buy from Steam, probably a somewhat reduced number, but still I'm sure large enough for me to be disturbed
Lanz: Yeah
Lanz: I've been on Debian since woody haha
Lanz: Can't take windows users anymore
Rednaxela: Hah... Woody... that was Debian Unstable when I first tried Linux
Lanz: No, it'd be Debian testing
Lanz: Unstable is always Sid
Rednaxela: Oh yeah, testing
Rednaxela: Sorry, forgot the Debian terminology
Lanz: Haha fair enough
Daekdroom: Will Debian even run out of Toy Story characthers?
Lanz: Haha
Rednaxela: But yeah... Debian really bugged me back in those days, couldn't get myself to use Linux solely at that point. Was first Gentoo that I found sufficiently satisfying to use Linux full time
Lanz: Well not if Toy Story 3 brings new ones!
Lanz: I never liked the idea of compiling everything, that's a looooooot of time wasted imo
Rednaxela: KDE on a 200MHz box? Takes a week ;)
Rednaxela: did that back in those days
Lanz: LMAO!
Lanz: I admire your patience ;)
Rednaxela: Hah
Lanz: I like the stability of Debian though, I've got it on all of my servers
Lanz: When they make a stable release, there's real commitment to the word stable
Sleepy_Coder: huggles his Core i5 750 @ 4 x 4.15Ghz
Lanz: Speaking of i5
Rednaxela: When I first tried Debian, I got really annoyed at the package system really. Was partially annoyed at the hassle of distribution version upgrades. I found the rolling releases and up-to-date packages of Gentoo refreshing
Sleepy_Coder: + 8GB of DDR3 :p
Lanz: What's the difference between i5 and i7?
Sleepy_Coder: The i7's have the AES instructions added to x86
Daekdroom: Intel current branding is a huge mess.
Sleepy_Coder: And Hyperthreading
Lanz: Rednaxela: apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade
Sleepy_Coder: And VT-d for Virtualized Directed I/O
mikeplus64: is jealous of Sleepy_Coder's i5 but is still content with his Phenom(enomenomenomenom) II 965.
Sleepy_Coder: That's about it. I think some of the i7's have a larger L3 cache, too
Lanz: Do they share the same socket?
RambJoe: google-chrome-unstable has an update :P
Rednaxela: Lanz: Yeah, but I'd rather just do updates ASAP instead of in huge batches. When I do them as they come, I know what broke things if they ever break.
RambJoe: webm?
Sleepy_Coder: mikeplus64: I would have gotten that one, as it was cheaper, but I wanted QuickPath so I could be sure of bandwidth
Daekdroom: is happy at his Core 2 Duo E4300, but wishes he could have a better GPU
Lanz: I hope webm is in it!!! :D
Rednaxela: (Hence why I'm on another rolling release distro these days: Arch :))
Lanz: I do them as they come, just stay on testing
Sleepy_Coder: Lanz: My i5 uses the LGA1156 socket, I think the i7's use the 1356?
Daekdroom: Some i7s use the 13?? socket
Daekdroom: Some use the 1156
Sleepy_Coder: Maybe it's a dual-use?
Lanz: Hm fair enough
Sleepy_Coder: Like AMD with the AM2+/AM3 CPUs?
Rednaxela: 1366
Daekdroom: Which is why I honestly think that Intel should learn how to brand their CPUs
Sleepy_Coder: sorry typo :S
RambJoe: YES
RambJoe: it has webm
Sleepy_Coder: I got the board and cpu for $200, so I was happy <3
Lanz: Intel really needs to stop jumping sockets
Rednaxela: From what I read on Wikipedia, the only i7s that use 1156, are the 800s
Daekdroom: Like.. Core i7 960 = quadcore, Core i7 980X = hexacore >.>
Lanz: And removing a single pin just to make stuff incompatible
Sleepy_Coder: MSI P55M-GD41 + Core i5 750 @ $200 from Fry's Electronics
Sleepy_Coder: The board doesn't support USB 3.0 or SATA 3.0 though
Sleepy_Coder: I don't care about USB 3.0, but I would have liked SATA 3.0
Sleepy_Coder: I'm not sure it's needed even though I have an SSD
Rednaxela: $200 Mobo? I'd never dare pay even close to that without it supporting the very latest and greatest =\
Lanz: I care about USB 3.0, got 7 hard drives and a toaster lol
Sleepy_Coder: Pfft :p
Sleepy_Coder: I'll probably upgrade again next year, the price for this upgrade was a little high but I'm happy :)
Sleepy_Coder: I hadn't upgraded in 3 years before that.
Lanz: Fair enough
Rednaxela: prefers the sub-$150 mobos personally :)
Lanz: I upgrade yearly
Rednaxela: is a scrooge like that
Sleepy_Coder: Waiting for Intel's Light Peak, they speculate it might overtake USB 3.0 next year.
Lanz: I alternate, desktop/laptop, every yeaar
RambJoe: oh shit webm is nice on chrome
Lanz: I'm on an ASUS G71 laptop right now haha
Azalyn: i'm not sure if this was said in the ati/nvidia discussion before. but ati has pretty much left nvidia in the dust in terms of performance and efficiency with their latest cards.
RambJoe: the volume bar is animated like it is in flash
Lanz: Azalyn: even on Linux? How about HD video playback?
Sleepy_Coder: Intel also said they won't support USB 3.0 in their chipsets this year. Bunch of people saying it's because they want to roll out LightPeak.
Azalyn: not sure about linux specific issues. but they are supposed to be using the same 3D stack now on both windows and linux.
Azalyn: codesharing between the two platforms
RambJoe: whats that fdisk command again where you say the starting cylinder and the end
Sleepy_Coder: I doubt HD video is impossible on Linux with ATi. I could swear I played HD video when I was using my Radeon card a year ago.
Lanz: This is a Linux channel haha, we care about the Linux issues :P
Azalyn: that's only for 3D though. the 2D is still platform specific. which i suppose may explain why the opensource 2D drivers totally smoke the proprietary 2D driver functionality.
Lanz: Good stufff Sleepy_Coder
Rednaxela: Heh, webm.... I saw some technical analysis of the video codec, and it sounds like it's basically h264 with a few key features downgrades with the occasional feature upgraded
RambJoe: hd works for me
Nevtus: Lanz: I was typing the same comment. It matters if we can't taken advantage of the hardware
Azalyn: HD works with the proprietary drivers, on VA-API as i understand..
Lanz: Yeah WebM is inferior to H.264, but it's not patent encumbered
Lanz: And it owns theora
Daekdroom: Are they compatible?
Sleepy_Coder: SATA 2.0 is 3Gb/s == 375MB/s, so I should be good anyway. SSD reads at 270MB/s, writes at 80MB/s, barely caps it
Azalyn: but VA-API i don't think is merged into the mainline of most players
Sleepy_Coder: Assuming reads and writes are done simultaneously :p
Azalyn: with mplayer they seem to have a separate repository
Rednaxela: I'm not so sure Lanz. Google says it's not patent encumbered, but by how similar to h264 it sounded, it seemed likely that some h264 patents have got to apply too...
Azalyn: http://www.mplayerhq.hu/design7/news.html
Azalyn: look at the news post at the top
Azalyn: seems like they have a separate branch for va-api.. so you'd have to compile manually, or wait for it to merge. or whatever
Azalyn: i have 'heard' that on the proprietary side, the ati drivers are still not as good as the nvidia ones though.
mjr: Rednaxela, "sounds like" isn't a very good measure here, though I'm far from being in the know either way myself
Azalyn: but i haven't had the chance to try myself.
JEEB: lol, yet another mplayer version :3
JEEB: I wonder if uau will at some point put the vaapi patches into his head
Rednaxela: mjr: Indeed not a good measure. Just saying I'm not convinced of the claim that it's patent free
mjr: Rednaxela, see http://xiphmont.livejournal.com/50239.html?thread=135231#t135231 and http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=377#comment-4189 for some points
MPX: Azalyn, they still havent fixed a bug where if you minimize a window, it will use 500 ms or a second after you click it, for it to pop up again (lag)
MPX: and AFAIK, that's a years old bug
Azalyn: MPX: i actually saw that one. an ubuntu system i have has the bug.
MPX: 10.4 Works for me though on 2x 5770's. Previous versions have all crashed X
JEEB: http://repo.or.cz/w/mplayer.git?a=search&h=HEAD&st=commit&s=vaapi <- hey, vaapi's in already
Azalyn: but are you sure that is a problem with all distros though?
MPX: (catalyst 10.4 that is)
Rednaxela: mjr: Ah, interesting points.
Azalyn: or is it just ubuntu
MPX: I'm not sure Azalyn
JEEB: http://repo.or.cz/w/mplayer-build.git <- the repo to easily build uau's mplayer
Rednaxela: Though I'm going to wait some time before I'd start trusting webm or VP8
Sleepy_Coder: michaellarabel: We have non-believers here, please do an ATi HD 5870 vs Nvidia GTX 480 benchmark with the proprietary drivers with the Unigine engine? And Nexuiz? :ppp I could swear ATi was on par with Nvidia...
Azalyn: is uau the mplayer maintainer? heh
Azalyn: the head of the project or something?
JEEB: Azalyn, he IIRC has or still has svn rights
Azalyn: i kind of lost track of the management after arpi or whatever split.
JEEB: Just that the svn developers aren't really friendly to new stuff it seems lately
JEEB: so he basically almost got removed or was removed, and since has been keeping his own branch
JEEB: which updates the main code from time to time (rather often), and had the first working ffmpeg-mt implementation IIRC (as well as several Matroska features etc.)
Azalyn: so va-api is in his branch
Azalyn: but not upstream yet?
JEEB: yeah
JEEB: or well
Lanz: On a totally unrelated note, does anyone know of a good Linux compatible download manager for Chrome, similar to DownloadThemAll?
JEEB: I didn't search the upstream branch
Azalyn: damnit. i run upstream. am i never going to get va-api? :|
Lanz: It's the only thing that keeps me on Firefox
Sleepy_Coder: wget >8D
mjr: Aanyway, I'm sure WebM will be FUDed mercilessly regardless of if there are other major patent holders than Google. But, sleep now.
JEEB: mjr, I like the matroska usage!
JEEB: :V
Lanz: DownloadThemAll seems to make things a lot faster than regular old wget, dunno why
JEEB: Because nowadays I really wouldn't care about the main svn trunk because they're either very slow or hostile towards new stuff
mjr: as I commented in my blog entry, it's okay, especially since they use a limited subset ;P
mjr: could've included some simple subtitles though...
JEEB: That'll be after HTML5 folks finish talking with jfs
JEEB: (aka nielsf)
mikeplus64: Lanz: KGet if you use KDE?
Lanz: Yeah I use KGet with Konqueror
JEEB: But that will happen only after he gets time to finish the AS6 spec
Lanz: No where near as fast
Azalyn: by the way, the comment that mjr linked on the x264 blog, i had that *exact* theory. heh
JEEB: or well, the first version of the spec -- so that it can be commented on etc.
Lanz: It's weird haha, I dunno what it is.. I tried various segmented download configurations with KGet
Azalyn: i mean let's face it, dark shikari is a brilliant programmer, but he's no lawyer.
Lanz: Nevermind, I'll put up with the fox haha
Azalyn: i'm pretty sure google has been investigating these issues.
JEEB: Azalyn, well -- yes, but we won't know before someone goes through some major list of patents
JEEB: Daiz was thinking of doing so for the lulz
mjr: Azalyn, and good for him!
Azalyn: google probably already did that. heh
Azalyn: but what frustrates me though
Azalyn: is couldn't they find some alternative functionality to replace what they removed?
Azalyn: i mean there has to be some expired patent out there
JEEB: It's not easy to find ways I guess... dunno.
Azalyn: i think it's impossible that there is no solution.
Azalyn: shikari says that the omission of b-frames could cost us 20% or more compression efficiency here...
Azalyn: that's significant.
JEEB: Yeah
Azalyn: there should be some alternative for that. they should be able to find something that has expired already.
JEEB: the general idea behind the standard is not bad the spec is bad, but they can fix that the encoder is mediocre
Azalyn: which channel was that from?
JEEB: #x264
Azalyn: ah.
Azalyn: i've been in the vp8 channel.
jumbers: Opera already has a WebM build out, exciting
wait4steam: Hi all. Steam files on server still forbidden?
mjr: fuck B frames and all that jazz, vp8 aims for web video, right now that means being competitive with baseline profile (hello, no b-frames) is _quite_ enough for being, well, competitive
JEEB: mjr, as soon as they get the decoder up to the level :/
JEEB: ffmpeg-devel had some talk about what could be possibly re-used from the x264 code to make the vp8 encoder better, and some people are working on making a better decoder
JEEB: Also, not sure about youtube even nowadays, but I see tons of web video with bframes nowadays -- esp. but not limited to places that let people upload the videos without re-encoding them on server-side
Nevtus: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2010/may/20/apple-steve-jobs-vp8-patent
RambJoe: lol wut
mjr: (I pondered briefly if it was still similar enough to vp3 for the theora ptalarbvorm smear-reduction to be useful, but I presume they've got it if there's anything there)
RambJoe: so now the iphones isn't going to have vp8
RambJoe: aka no html5 video
JEEB: mjr, they need psy-rd and VAQ
JEEB: They need it bad
JEEB: they need psychovisual enhancements as that's what makes video look better, although PSNR will be lower
JEEB: On2 had this almost-magical belief in PSNR
mjr: yeah sure, details schmetails
Milyardo: "omission of b-frames could cost us 20% or more compression efficiency here...", Assuming this is within the context of VP8's inter frame prediction, I've seen that line parroted alot recently, by alot of people with no understanding of how a an implementation of beta frames improve compression effiency, this particularly bugs because in VP-8 implementation, a beta frame would not improve effeciency at all, but only make the implemen
JEEB: wat
JEEB: It's "bi-predicted picture"
JEEB: IIRC
JEEB: s/picture/frame/ where used as b-frame
Milyardo: beta frame is another name for it
mjr: (Also, while I'm bitching here instead of going to sleep, fuck a couple of extra bits for the same quality. Bits are cheap. Only going to get cheaper. A cartel-controlled encumbered format is only going to get more expensive if it first manages to drown out competition by pandering to the hifists who'll only have the very best, no matter what they're gonna get up their arses, and due to network effects, up everyone else's arses too while they're at it)
JEEB: mjr, just mentioning here -- I don't hate the VP8 standard :V
JEEB: I don't like On2, but as far as I can see the spec etc. will be made better from now on
JEEB: that's why they have VP8.X in the container spec defined
tkmorris: #vp8 ?
Azalyn: my concern is not bits
Azalyn: my concern is that theora was dismissed because of it's lower quality and compression... i would hate for the same to happen to vp8
JEEB: Azalyn, this time that shouldn't happen
JEEB: VP3 was lolold
JEEB: when it moved over
Modplan: google is already using VP8/WebM
JEEB: at least VP8 is ~2002-2003 tech
Azalyn: we should at least be *competitive* with baseline profile. at the moment it isn't even certain if vp8 can do that much.
Modplan: you can already watch videos on youtube encoded in WebM
JEEB: the spec is competitive with baseline and just a wee bit more
Azalyn: having some alternative technology that gives us the same benefit as b-frames, but isn't patented, would really help with that goal.
Azalyn: especially seeing as it appears to be the most glaring omission in the spec.
Milyardo: JEEB: not sure how the date from which a technology orginates correlates with its effectiveness
JEEB: And then you can just start implementing good features such as mbtree etc., and AQ etc.
Modplan: http://www.webmproject.org/users/ How to view WebM video on youtube
JEEB: Milyardo, I was just comparing with the 1993'ishness (or earlier'ness) of VP3
Azalyn: and honestly, i don't mind the project being "WebM"
Azalyn: but for goodness sakes please, not the file extension
Rednaxela: Hmm
Azalyn: it's a minor nitpick, but honestly, sometimes people download these to their desktops.
Rednaxela: One *could* make a video format without fixed frame rate using wavelets... and very good inter frame compression without technically doing what B-frames do... maybe...
Rednaxela: ponders
Nevtus: It's interesting that Adobe and Google are now the best of friends
JEEB: The main things that now have to be done are A) there is at least one or more known bugs in the spec, they should be fixed and the spec looked over by a variety of people at least once or so B) Start making the decoder faster C) Start making the encoder better to use psychovisual enhancements and faster
Azalyn: of course. adobe just wants to sell tools.
Azalyn: remember that image formats are technically 'open' for the most part... and yet photoshop has continued to be dominant.
mjr: Adobe's involvement is funky in the way that quite possibly their support of WebM in Flash (which they pledged) will help pave way to make Flash irrelevant
Nevtus: I never said it doesn't make sense
Azalyn: the fact that image formats are open and well documented certainly hasn't helped gimp or even paintshop or others become effective competitors.
mjr: http://blog.gingertech.net/2010/05/20/vp8-adobe-is-the-key-to-open-video/
JEEB: Anyways, this is interesting time IMO
mjr: in the Chinese sense at least
Modplan: the more open codecs/formats, the better at least
JEEB: Yup
mjr: but fuck it, I'm hitting the sack
RambJoe: how do i resize a partition in fdisk again?
Azalyn: so i guess they don't really *care* about flash for vendor lock-in. they figure they already have lock-in because of plugins and what not like photoshop... and just brand recognition.
Azalyn: if they tried to go ahead and fight apple on this one, they'd lose, so instead, they joined up with google and we, the freetards. :)
Azalyn: so now apple is all like D:
Modplan: if you're desingated a freetard do you have to wear a stallman wig as head protection when out in public?
JEEB: We shall see. Anyways, the adoption rate of VP8 is very good atm.
Nevtus: indeed, hardware acceleration planned right on launch from AMD/Nvidia too
JEEB: I'm a encoderfaggot, but I still see the place for VP8 on web video if Google lets the spec be fixed a bit -- and even if not, the open source community should make good use of the spec.
JEEB: Also, I'm seriously typo'ing tonight
JEEB: I've already built the vp8 binary from the git repo, I should check out if it has anything like the crf mode of x264... would make my conquest for "no blur kthx" much easier I'd guess
JEEB: s/conquest/quest/
Azalyn: i guess the anime groups will keep using h264.
JEEB: I will certainly
JEEB: It's the easiest to control to get "visually lossless" results
Azalyn: what about the container choice, the mplayer guys have bitched about how mkv is bloated and such in the past..
JEEB: I've certainly become lazy to start looking for the "good bitrate" and I'm not aiming for any specific small-sized media, so using "one bitrate for all" isn't good either.
Nevtus: that doesn't really have anything to do with web video though. I don't think VP8 is intending to replace all video formats
JEEB: Indeed
JEEB: The subset of Matroska Google now uses is still largely undecided
JEEB: But the current version isn't bad
JEEB: Also, there are PLENTY of splitters for Matroska
Azalyn: Nevtus: yeah, i know. but i figured if it was good that others would use it for other stuff.
JEEB: not to mention the work that uau has done :V
Rednaxela: IMO, the real news will be when either IE dies or IE supports WebM. Hint: I think neither will...
Azalyn: how about .unv for an extension. "universal network video" ;)
JEEB: Rednaxela, IIRC IE9 will support VP8 if the user has the decoder (and splitter?) installed
Azalyn: i got the 'network' idea from "png" (portable network graphics)
JEEB: They haven't said "no u" to it at least :3
Rednaxela: Azalyn, Well, why not PNV then? :)
Azalyn: pnv works too.
JEEB: And Matroska is a great format as there are implementations for subtitles and all kinds of other stuff in the spec already
JEEB: And good tools to multiplex stuff into matroska
Daekdroom: YAUE. Yet another useless extension.
RambJoe: how do i make a partition ntfs in fdisk, i remember it was sometihng then 07
Rednaxela: JEEB, Ahhh, then the real question will be when IE9 is widely adopted, and if WebM codec support can be pushed out as effectively as Flash etc
JEEB: mkvtoolnix just got WebM support into its svn, too
Azalyn: i'm not the only one to point out the crappy extension. i saw others on the webm mailing list this morning, complaining.
Azalyn: heh
Azalyn: i figured i was the only nitpicker around.
Azalyn: i'm glad to find out i'm in good company. :)
JEEB: And as for the subtitles, the HTML5 people see, to have for once at least gone to the good place
JEEB: *seem to
Azalyn: mozilla has this project for universal subtitles right?
JEEB: They made a thread over at the subtitles board of doom9
JEEB: And pretty much took contact with jfs who has been boiling a multipurpose subtitle format for a long time now
JEEB: They made a mailing list, which should be publicized some time after the first draft of AS6 gets ready
JEEB: And then the HTML5 folks and other people shall talk, and I hope they'll come up with something that'll be used in HTML5 as well as in other uses :)
JEEB: Because I know that it'll also bring support for that thing into Aegisub, which is IMHO still the best subtitling app at the moment
jelso: Steam for linux confirmed!
mikeplus64: Again?!
Azalyn: in theory, this isn't necessarily the end. there's more than one image format for the image tag, right? it's natural to think that although vp8 will give us a good solution that we can use here and now.. that we could extend it and create a newer better codec later. and that would become a second option.
JEEB: Yeah
JEEB: And Matroska is a very good selection of a container too, although that might change later on as well
Azalyn: it shall be called... THEOREX.
jelso: oh no... I thought that was just our greeting here
cmdrk: 'steam for linux confirmed' should become a widely used internet meme.
jelso: I hate Google for becoming Adobe's butt-buddy
Azalyn: or we can replace 'steam' for any other popular windows game. would make a great trolling tool.
Azalyn: i think it's adobe that is google's butt-buddy.
jumbers: Can I be your butt-buddy?
jelso: yes, as long as you don't use flash
jumbers: Okay, I'll use Flash also
jelso: you cannot
jumbers: Okay, I'll use Flash
jelso: you can you gnash
jumbers: No thanks, I don't enjoy using buggy crap
Azalyn: adobe needed a good way to fuck apple over.
Azalyn: and this is it.
jelso: lol
jelso: adobe isn't going to fuck over apple
jelso: apple users will buy whatever shinny crap apple sells
jelso: AppleTV!
JEEB: Google put Flash into some of its stuff -- and on the other side Adobe put VP8/OGG and Matroska support into Flash :V I think that's not a bad deal, considering the user base of Flash
JEEB: s/OGG/Vorbis/
Azalyn: i mean fuck them over on the h264 thing.
Azalyn: apple has been pushing h264 hard.
Azalyn: and now it's all about to come CRASHING DOWN
Azalyn: :)
jelso: if google pushes vp8 hard; h.264 will become like QuickTime 9
JEEB: facepalms
Azalyn: h264 will have it's uses...
JEEB: Yeah
Azalyn: just not on the web.
jelso: media environments
JEEB: And it's not without open source decoders/encoders
Azalyn: i mean blu-ray uses it. (vc-1 is also available, but lol @ that shit)
JEEB: unlike whatever proprietary crap there might be
Nevtus: yup, x264/mkv videos are nice but for HTML5 all the patents are just too much
Azalyn: this is off-topic, but what pisses me off, is that my nvidia card in this pc is a 'purevideo' card, but it's the 7xxx series. which vdpau doesn't work on. apparently back then they were using shaders to do decoding, and that is apparently a pain in the ass to do.
Azalyn: le sigh.
Azalyn: so i can't watch accelerated 1080p h264 here
JEEB: Azalyn, yeah -- the version of the VPx chip matters :/
Rednaxela: shudders at vc-1 mention
Azalyn: even though my card is supposed to be able to do it.
JEEB: VP2 and onwards are the "good" / "capable" ones
jelso: if one were to include h.264 in whatever project one may be working one; does one have to pay the license fee to the MPEG-LA?
Azalyn: i'm hoping that gallium3d will be able to solve this.
jelso: I'm not clear on how that works
Azalyn: with the opencl state tracker
Azalyn: someone could write an h264 decoder in opencl. and then it would probably work the same way the original windows driver did it.
JEEB: jelso, depends -- open source software only giving out source wouldn't. That's IIRC how it went. For giving out binaries you might've had to pay depending on your country
JEEB: Or well, your laws.
jelso: i live in the country of retardia (a.k.a. USA)
JEEB: Ok, then at least by laws you would have to.
Azalyn: yeah, the LAME mp3 decoder mentioned that they were allowed to distribute the source.
Azalyn: because the source code sort of counts as a form of "documentation"
Azalyn: but that when you compile it, it's suddenly infringing on patents.
JEEB: IIRC I'm in a country where I can show the middle finger to MPEG-LA even if they'd ask me to pay
Azalyn: kind of weird though, doesn't that mean linux distros could include the source code.. and just prompt the user to compile it? :P
Tazer: Fuck you itouchh
Tazer: Why are you invisiblee
jelso: Azalyn: interesting
JEEB: Also, you could host your project in a country that couldn't care less about software patents -- thus enabling binaries to be provided.
Azalyn: in canada, patents on mathematics aren't allowed. which pretty much kicks any algorithm and most other software patents out to the curb... but they seem to hack around the limitation by claiming their patent along with a storage medium. making it seem like a more elaborate patent.
jelso: I love Canada, I just wish it wasn't so cold
Azalyn: i don't know if there has ever been a challenge to those patents.. or if people have just backed down out of fear when sued..
Azalyn: or whatever
Azalyn: but in practice, most companies seem to treat the law here as if it were like the USA when patents are concerned, even though the law in written form is clearly different.
Azalyn: my guess is that if anyone were to challenge this in court, those patents would be invalidated.
Azalyn: but who is going to spend the money to push for this in court? heh. most companies will just keep doing settlements.
jelso: in the USA; somebody holds a patent for linked-lists
Azalyn: which i think is criminal. because the law clearly says you can't patent math, and yet they act as if you can, and threaten people. really pisses me off when american bullshit like that finds it's way here up north.
JEEB: With the relatively large adoption of VP8 from the beginning, I'm kind of waiting if someone would come up and sue. Thus, in the best case, enabling to possibly bring down at least part of this patent hell. Or, in the other case, make it sure for people that "evading patents" isn't as easy as they thought :3
Azalyn: worst thing is that if it were challenged in court, we might lose, because they'd pull the "oh it's too late now because too many businesses would crumble if you made such patents illegal" card...
Azalyn: which is just... UGH. i mean that excuse is exactly why we're in this mess. why the usa has fucked up laws. but it's not just them.
Azalyn: in fact, what bankers do today used to be considered illegal. it was called usury.
Azalyn: to make money, from doing nothing but having money.
Azalyn: but after awhile, they realized that it was impossible to make it illegal now, it was too late because the economy now *depended* on it, so they made the practice legal, and regulated it.
Azalyn: so basically, it's ok to break the law, as long as you do it in a way that creates a dependence on your service, so that society becomes your bitch later.
jelso: I struggle everyday to understand the political system in the US that allows Corporatism to flourish so prevalently; it's fasinating
Azalyn: i know i'm preaching to the choir. but yeah, every now and then we need to vent.
Azalyn: heh
Varkk: so basically, it's ok to break the law, as long as you have lots and lots of money <--fixed that for you
Azalyn: there is another scenario, jeeb. they may actually admit defeat. heh
Azalyn: i mean look what happened the last time some company tried to take on the opensource community.
Azalyn: SCO.
Azalyn: i know that was totally different... because their claims were bullshit...
Azalyn: but what is really important about that trial, is how it brought the community together.
Azalyn: and rallied the troops.
JEEB: Yah
JEEB: If we get enough public to pay attention to it
Sleepy_Coder: (02:44:47) < jelso> in the USA; somebody holds a patent for linked-lists <-- This is why hackers will inheret the Earth :p
Sleepy_Coder: hides
Azalyn: this time, the corps are not just attacking linux. they're trying to go after the entire fucking internet. heh
Azalyn: they're going to have to deal with freetards, anonymous, bloggers, and pretty much everyone out there that cares about free exchange of information on the web.
Azalyn: they have no idea who they are messing with. i bet you anything that people online will socially network to find prior art for any patent claim.
JEEB: Anyways, as I said already, the publication of this thing and the rate of adoption is <3 <3 I want to see some fish pick this worm and start a big roll -- however it ends, time shall tell. I'm expecting the worst while hoping for the best.
Rednaxela: Azalyn: The trick is being able to defend such
Azalyn: heh, yeah. it's amazing. it's been one day and the patches are already merging all over the place.
Rednaxela: (i.e. in court)
JEEB: That's why we need adopting companies
JEEB: That have assets
JEEB: see: Google, Adobe f.ex.
jelso: as of yesterday, when a video is uploaded to youtube; is it encoded in h.264 or vp8?
Azalyn: sorenson has already picked it up too
JEEB: jelso, HD ones should be encoded as VP8 too
JEEB: H.264 versions go up too
Azalyn: the guys in the vp8 channel are worried about the audio though. they think google may have screwed up and used ffmpeg's vorbis encoder for the audio.
Azalyn: instead of libvorbis
Azalyn: ffmpeg's vorbis is apparently terribad.
JEEB: It is
jelso: it's pretty clear apple and google are at war: google could fuck apple pretty good if they stop encoding in h.264
JEEB: If not broken
jelso: or would that hurt google's bottom line too much?
JEEB: jelso, and break all current hardware decoding solutions
jelso: heh, I guess it's not so *clear*
JEEB: Of course, they could go blitzkrieg -- but they seem to have chosen not to
Azalyn: hopefully google either didn't do that... maybe it's just the source vids that sucked... if they did do it, i hope they switch to libvorbis.
JEEB: Azalyn, I remember a Google guy on #x264 telling that they actually had at least tested the ffmpeg's encoder -- which is lolbroken
Azalyn: it will undermine our efforts if the best opensource audio codec ends up messing up for everyone just because people are using ffmpeg's implementation.
JEEB: But the way he was speaking kind of implicated that it was in past form
JEEB: Although I've yet to have downloaded a stream to check it out
JEEB: I did play around the Firefox's test build the day before yesterday
JEEB: VP8 was slow and the blurring made gradients and/or grain|noise become banding
Azalyn: i suppose we'll find out.
JEEB: But both of those problems are very much fix'able
RambJoe: you can't full screen html5 yet
RambJoe: well you could before i think when it used x264 :/
Azalyn: i just hope the spec is cleaned up. someone should put it up in wiki form if it hasn't been done already
JEEB: Azalyn, yup
RambJoe: h.264*
JEEB: After they get some psychovisual enhancements in as well, it'll start being <3 <3
RambJoe: chrome doesn't have the copy video link etc
RambJoe: firefox does
JEEB: Because I bet the current code being pretty much what On2 had. And On2 were PSNR-lovers
Azalyn: does the source code look salvageable or does it look like it would be best to write code from scratch?
JEEB: I think I agree with Dark_Shikari on this one without looking at it thoroughly -- some parts could be used as-is, and refactored with time
JEEB: The asm is bad, the C should be bad'ish, but better than VP3's
Azalyn: hehe, i read an article that said vp3 would not even compile with free tools. it was totally dependant on several microsoft visual studio tools and what not..
Azalyn: totally fubar.
Azalyn: given that projects are already merging patches and experimenting, i'd say this release is definitely better.
JEEB: Yah
Azalyn: but if google hasn't been cleaning things up all this time, then i'm left wondering if all this time was just the legal work alone.
Rednaxela: hah.... I google search for PSNR.... and an on2 page is within the top results
JEEB: lol
JEEB: makes very much sense, though
Azalyn: yeah, what exactly is PSNR? is it bad?
rektide: so did i follow right?
rektide: android announced you can push two things to android devices? application installs, and media streams?
JEEB: It's an older mathematical way of "calculating quality"
Rednaxela: It's a quality measure, that doesn't account for psychovisual things
JEEB: Yah
JEEB: And which very much likes blurring
rektide: i need to better understand what media streams mean
JEEB: Now guess why On2's encoders love blurring
JEEB: lol
Azalyn: is this just an encoder thing? we can change that without breaking the bitstream format?
JEEB: Nah
JEEB: this is just a way the encoder is tweaked
JEEB: They just tweaked it to output the best possible PSNR -- no matter if stuff gets blurred etc.
JEEB: And the trolling race has begun... MPEG-LA's Larry Horn is saying that the "market has had expressions of interest to form a patent pool (for VP8)"
Azalyn: http://www.gabbr.com/blogs/2010/5/34476/Google's-Royalty-Free-WebM-Video-May-Not-Be-Royalty-Free-For-Long/
Azalyn: rolls eyes
Azalyn: le sigh.
JEEB: Azalyn, was just posted on #x264 lol
Azalyn: i saw the text in the vp8 channel and googled it.
Azalyn: i actually wasn't paying attention to #x264 so i didn't see it there. :O
Rednaxela: ponders the idea of a wavelet based video format which does a wavelet transform in the time dimension also, unlike dirac
DonScott: so are the vultures already circling vp8 ?
JEEB: Just a slight trollish comment from the CEO of MPEG-LA
JEEB: I'll get interested when real actions are taken
Rednaxela: I will be curious about Google's reaction
Rednaxela: Yeah
jelso: JEEB: +1
jelso: that's business for ya
Azalyn: http://patft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/PTO/search-bool.html&r=13&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=PTXT&s1=nintendo&OS=nintendo&RS=nintendo
Azalyn: sorry i just lol'd at this
Azalyn: "game program and game aparatus"
Azalyn: shame on you, nintendo. shame.
Milyardo: "a boom tiggering act"?
Milyardo: So basicly they're patenting any act triggered by an NPC's response to player input that causes another trigger on a different NPC?
Milyardo: isn't that just recursion?
Azalyn: oh, you decrypted the legalese?
JEEB: Azalyn, lol'd
JEEB: the vorbis version strings in a youtube encode from 29 minutes ago is still "vorbis" kinetik: oh god ffmpeg's vorbis encoder? ffmpeg's vorbis encoder must be the world's greatest troll
JEEB: Google is _still_ using it?! o_O
jelso: steam for linux unconfirmed!
Daemonic: ?
Daemonic: whaa..?
Rednaxela: Just the usual stating the obvious
Zerb_Riss: lol
SageX: don't feed the troll
Azalyn: but he'll starve!
DeathCrawler: meh, w8in for annoucement
xorl: what announcement?
DeathCrawler: steam
xorl: oh, you meant waiting, thought something was today
Modplan: if you still have the linux files it can still connect to update server
DeathCrawler: oO
Modplan: ?
DeathCrawler: i have the linux files... :P
xorl: DeathCrawler: did it still update?
Modplan: ah, thought I'd note that seeing as people seem to act like we won't see/hear anything more when the ones we have can still update
Modplan: xorl: no, not since a day or 2 before the public site went down
xorl: ok, and hasn't yet? figured as much
xorl: they have it locked down to there local subnet I am sure
xorl: when I worked for SOE all updates were locked down to the SOE network
xorl: until pushed live
DeathCrawler: =P
Modplan: here's terminal output if yer interested: [ 0%] Checking for available update...
Modplan: Need new HTTP connection for 63.228.223.104:80
Modplan: Sending request for http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux?date=708006
Modplan: HTTP client connect completed
Modplan: Success! http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux?date=708006
xorl: yeah, it's still forbidden
jelso: I still believe steam on linux is inevitable
xorl: they closed it down probably because the client isn't even remotely ready ;P
jelso: sooner or later
xorl: Didn't want it to reflect negatively
xorl: that or it was a short tease to let us know it was coming
Modplan: xorl, it's further along than you may think. yesterday/day before espes got fonts to nearly work
xorl: Modplan: if we have to hack it, that's not working :P
Modplan: well, they were only bug fixes apparently
Modplan: but yeah, still a fair bit of stuff to go (webkit and displaying games)
xorl: yeah I am sure that is the least of there worries
xorl: afterall they are still busting ass on the mac team
xorl: which is awesome that it's only a 3 man team to make the mac client haha
Rednaxela: ModPlan: Successful? Yet still forbidden? How? Is it user-agent blocking?
Modplan: Rednaxeia: Ah, it reports success, but then a few lines later...
Modplan: Download failed: http error 403
Modplan: [ 0%] Update Complete.
Rednaxela: Ahhh
xorl: ah, so it's still forbidden
Rednaxela: I guess "Success!" means getting any response at all
Modplan: yup, but I'll be checking for updates every 30 seconds because I can't wait, so I'll know if it gets opened up again :p
xorl: that's a great way to test the network haha
Modplan: this was the progress on fonts: http://i.imgur.com/oEi7o.png
Modplan: then later it became: http://i.imgur.com/m6qMm.png
DeathCrawler: lol
DeathCrawler: Sending request for http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux?date=708006
DeathCrawler: HTTP client connect completed
DeathCrawler: Success! http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux?date=708006
DeathCrawler: Removing now closed connection for 63.228.223.104:80
DeathCrawler: Removing in-use connection for 63.228.223.104:80, 0 left open, 0 requests waiting, 0 requests still in-flight
DeathCrawler: Download failed: http error 403
DeathCrawler: +
DeathCrawler: =/
Tazer: Any updates with Linux steam?
Rednaxela: Not since they started 403'ing it. Likely restricted to access from within their network only
Tazer: Is it just me that thinks it might send a bad message to valve that people are trying to hack their shit to learn about it :c
Modplan: quite the opposite
Modplan: and the only hacking being done was to fix bugs in the client, nothing nefarious
Modplan: if I remember rightly mastertheknife sent a fix or 2
Tazer: Oh, I don't doubt the intentions
Tazer: And Valve doesn't seem like the kind of company to get all pissy about this stuff either, so I'm pretty sure it's okay
Modplan: yah, pretty sure they know of this. Even discussion on their own forums (where links to news items about it were posted)
Modplan: yet the public client stayed up
Tazer: Well, that's good
Tazer: http://www.apple.com/pro/tips/copydelete.html
Tazer: Maybe when they announce it they'll open up the code to programmers so they can send in suggestions and stuff
Tazer: Not something they could really do on anything but Linux :O
Tazer: Anyway, click the link
Tazer: you'll laugh. or cry.
Tazer: either or
Modplan: LOOK MAH, I BE PRO WITH MAH COMMARND KEE
Tazer: You realize that describes Cut, right?
Tazer: Apple is marketing Cut as a super secret l33t feature
riisen: hahaha, best pro tips evvah
Modplan: yes, but Apple did it. It's new and original and amazing
Modplan: it's a revolution in computing
Tazer: I wonder what super paste is
Modplan: :o
riisen: :o
Tazer: pffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
Tazer: oh my god
Tazer: That is
Tazer: That is like the most useless thing in ever
Tazer: click the next tip oh my god, it's amazing
Modplan: LOOK MAH, I JUST FINISHED THE FAST CARS PROJECT
Modplan: NOW IM GONNA COPY-DELETE
Tazer: Apple is truly the saddest of things
Tazer: sighs
Tazer: i need an itouch like thing, though
Tazer: How good are the androids as MP3 players?
riisen: wants meego
Modplan: http://www.apple.com/pro/tips/onewayvideochat.html
Modplan: now that's pro
Tazer: Amazing
mikeplus64: Tazer: Get a Cowon J3 or S9.
Tazer: truly a unique feature
Tazer: :O
Tazer: prices?
mikeplus64: I'm not sure but if I recall correctly I bought my 16 GB S9 for ~$240 ( Australian )
Tazer: Is Australia moneis worse or good than US moneis at this point, I can't keep track anymore
mikeplus64: It's 0.8 or something the USD right now.
mikeplus64: But it was worse when I got the S9 I think.
mikeplus64: http://www.anythingbutipod.com/archives/2008/12/cowon-iaudio-s9-review.php might interest you.
Tazer: Hrrmm
Tazer: And this is really a small issue but can you use Cydia and stuff?
Tazer: Like freeware apps, basically, I mean
mikeplus64: The J3 is pretty much an S9 with apparently slightly better hardware ( though I'm not sure on that ) with a MicroSD slot.
plantain: aussie dollar through the floor at the moment
mikeplus64: Not really other than Flash things.
plantain: it'll be back... someday
plantain: maybe after the gov. kills the mining tax
Tazer: Daw
Tazer: That's tragic, I was hoping I could still get OSu
Tazer: Osu*
mikeplus64: The whole interface is done through Flash ( good and bad thing imho ).
Tazer: But oh well, anything but another Iphone in the family---wait is it cheaper than the Iphone?
mikeplus64: I don't know.
mikeplus64: But it's not a phone. :P
mikeplus64: If you're not really looking for sound quality then maybe one of those newer Samsung players ( the successors to the P3? I forget their names lol )
Tazer: should have mentioned the phone part derpderp
mikeplus64: lol
Tazer: I thought I had, I just suck ;w;
Tazer: That's the thing
Tazer: I care about sound quality and don't really know of anything that matches up to the Ipone on those terms
Tazer: the Zune seems to have died as soon as it showed up
mikeplus64: I wouldn't look at iPods/iPhones if you're looking for good sound quality. ;)
mikeplus64: Or phones at all really.
Tazer: The Itouch did good enough for me, so maybe I'm not all that picky after all O-o
mikeplus64: But maybe one of those new Android-running HTC phones?
Tazer: That's mostly what I've been thinking of, but I don't really know anything about Androids ;w;
mikeplus64: Neither do I.
mikeplus64: What about the Nokia n900 or whatever comes after that?
Tazer: 550 dollars
Tazer: Um
Tazer: wow
riisen: well i have heard that n900 has a awsome os (maego) ... but the phone has no battery time..
riisen: maemo*
xorl: maemo is ok
xorl: my boss has it, was playing with it at work a few times, it's *ok*
riisen: well meego seems awsome
DeathCrawler: nah
DeathCrawler: i want netbook ARM A9 tegra based
DeathCrawler: *tegra 2
DeathCrawler: my animes in HD running in VDPAU
DeathCrawler: wonderfull
DeathCrawler: *ful
Rednaxela: HD is a low standard IMO. Monitors in 1995 could do HD
DeathCrawler: 1080p in netbook is unnecessry
riisen: hd monitors is pretty weak yea.. but hd movies is awsome ;D
DeathCrawler: is playing [Lolicons Anonimos] KissXsis 01 [H264][AAC-2CH][4E57DD33].mkv [MPlayer]
SageX: 2560 X 4760
DeathCrawler: wat
SageX: in the future that resolution will be on our cellphones or a similar resolution
DeathCrawler: lol
SageX: lol
DeathCrawler: my monitor is weak
DeathCrawler: :<
SageX: my monitor does 1080
SageX: p
DeathCrawler: my does 1050
SageX: cause I watch movies
DeathCrawler: lol
DeathCrawler: led monitors is awesome
SageX: yes
SageX: refresh rates are :L
SageX: you would think 60hz is good
DeathCrawler: is very overpriced here
DeathCrawler: :<
Rednaxela: LED backlight, or fully OLED display DC? ;)
SageX: but I think you would have a decent refresh rate at 60hz
SageX: needs to be high
SageX: -er
SageX: for widescreens
SageX: if there was a lcd that did a higher resolution and at least a 120hz refresh rate I would
DeathCrawler: Xorg can handle it?
DeathCrawler: :P
SageX: lolz
SageX: hald does it for me
DeathCrawler: :P
DeathCrawler: im w8ing for wayland for fix it
SageX: I love how my 2 subs work perfectly in linux but can't in windows
SageX: 1 sub is a part of my 5.1 sys and the other is a 450 watt sub only for movies
xorl: SageX: I have had that problem for years :/
xorl: I could never adjust my subs in windows either
xorl: I can with alsa though
DeathCrawler: windoze... i dont have in my hd
SageX: alsa is awesome
xorl: strange how that works right?
xorl: even mac os x does it stock :\
SageX: yes
DeathCrawler: OSSv4 vs Alsa >>> who is better?
xorl: that's a toughy
SageX: theres also a significant loss of volume control in windows
xorl: haha yeah
xorl: that and you have to use a special client with the ability to use kernel mode audio to get proper amperage from your sound card :\
SageX: windows is like watered down coke
SageX: linux is coke
DeathCrawler: Windoze uses a driver and mixer of the manufacturer
Rednaxela: They're still bothering to make OSS? Even with how fast people deserted to ALSA in the old days?
SageX: alsa.oss() right guys
Bruners: DeathCrawler: if your stuff works with OSSv4, OSSv4 is the best
DeathCrawler: nah, i use alsa
DeathCrawler: But my stuff works in FreeBSD
DeathCrawler: perfect too
SageX: I used to be the king of freebsd
SageX: then got tired of all the immaturity in the irc channel
Rednaxela: I say anything but Pulseaudio
xorl: ugh
xorl: pulseaudio
DeathCrawler: GhostBSD uses pulse+oss
xorl: an abstraction layer on top of another :(
SageX: earmuffs
DeathCrawler: i think
DeathCrawler: GhostBSD = FreeBSD + GNOME LiveDVD
SageX: lol
SageX: openbsd
SageX: and netbsd
DeathCrawler: openbsd... sucks XD
SageX: lol
Tazer: What is different about BSD and Linux, come to think of it?
Tazer: I have no idea
SageX: lol
DeathCrawler: BSD is BSD and Linux is Linux?
DeathCrawler: XDDD
DeathCrawler: nah
Tazer: yes but like, how are they different ;w;
DeathCrawler: tools are different
DeathCrawler: use BSD and know what is different
DeathCrawler: PC-BSD is good
SageX: *decent
DeathCrawler: haha
DeathCrawler: XD
DeathCrawler: Flash is horrible in BSD
DeathCrawler: urgh
SageX: there has always been a lack of commercial software in the *bsds
DeathCrawler: yes
SageX: what I can't stand
xorl: haha
xorl: lack of software yes, lack of software based on bsd shit? No...
xorl: mac os x? yeah, biggest piece of commercial software based on bsd yet
SageX: nvidia drivers...
xorl: well windows was for a long time
SageX: I know
xorl: SageX: I don't mind em, I think some things should stay closed source, just, should stay closed source with the added exception of specifications for hardware specs
SageX: lol
xorl: like how to interface with the hardware, so open-source companies can easily develop for them :P
SageX: hmm
xorl: w/out having to reverse engineer shit to make it work like the OSS noveu or whatever
DeathCrawler: BSD users are elitist
DeathCrawler: Linux is a shit for they
xorl: DeathCrawler: I've been using it for years, I do find myself an elitest, but I don't care enough anymore to even give a rats ass haha
DeathCrawler: *them
DeathCrawler: lol
SageX: cause they think they run linux ontop of bsd
xorl: People have the power and freedom of choice, they can pick and choose as such, not my place or my right even to voice an opinion on someone elses judgement, unless they murder someone :P
xorl: In that case, they should be drug behind a redkneck(exception) truck by a noose around town
DeathCrawler: FOR ME linux is much better than BSD
SageX: yes
SageX: xorl, murders need to be tar and feathered and tortured in ways that deter murder from ever happening
DeathCrawler: For Windoze users, Linux users are elitist... for Linux users, BSD users are elitist
DeathCrawler: hahaha
DeathCrawler: XD
xorl: SageX: yes, death sentence is an easy way out.
SageX: saudi arabia has like 0 crime