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Thread: The Developers Behind The Mir Display Server

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by daniels View Post
    Wayland was running on Android last year.
    It's not about running Mir or Wayland on Android, it's running in a chroot, and having the Android drivers work with the linux image embedded into the device.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by e8hffff View Post
    It's not about running Mir or Wayland on Android, it's running in a chroot, and having the Android drivers work with the linux image embedded into the device.
    I'm not sure why you think these are different things.

  3. #13
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    I believe MIR was made for Ubuntu phones using android gfx drivers, and if Canonical also runs MIR on the desktop they gets a unified system for all Ubuntu systems.

    But I do not think they will succeed on the desktop, but it is a big chance/risk they will on phones an tablets.

    But that is only my opinion.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by e8hffff View Post
    It's not about running Mir or Wayland on Android, it's running in a chroot, and having the Android drivers work with the linux image embedded into the device.
    Hellooo? the Wayland on Android demo did exactly that: working with Android drivers.

    "So far this has been just a proof of concept, that Weston can run on Android and proprietary drivers. "

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by XyC0 View Post
    I believe MIR was made for Ubuntu phones using android gfx drivers, and if Canonical also runs MIR on the desktop they gets a unified system for all Ubuntu systems.

    But I do not think they will succeed on the desktop, but it is a big chance/risk they will on phones an tablets.

    But that is only my opinion.
    Canonical could have ruled the desktop if it stuck it out with Wayland. Problem is, they can't come up with any way to make money. Wayland is a side-hobby, a moonlight job for someone like Intel - they make CPUs, and Wayland is like a marketing tool for them, more than anything else. Google makes money off advertising, Android is yet another give away marketing tool for them... What exactly does Canonical do to stay afloat? Support Ubuntu ,"OEM services", and the like - this can hardly pay the bill or make it break even, despite how deep pocketed Mark Shuttleworth is. He could fund it indefinitely with his own money if he has it - this does not make it a successful business.

    It's very difficult to be 1) cool, and 2) make money off Linux - and those who figured out how to do both of these, aren't making money off Linux directly, but use it to advance some other product they're selling.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartinN View Post
    It's very difficult to be 1) cool, and 2) make money off Linux - and those who figured out how to do both of these, aren't making money off Linux directly, but use it to advance some other product they're selling.
    Yeah the Red Hat crowd never made a time on Linux.

    You seem to have no idea how the real world works btw. Intel as a corporation doesn't give a shit about wayland, their marketing department probably doesn't even know it exists. They sell products that require a display server, they hired a guy who writes display servers, it really is that simple.

    The thing is if you are burning money to keep your company a float, burning even more to write software someone else is already writing for you doesn't seem very smart.

    Dave.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by airlied View Post
    Yeah the Red Hat crowd never made a time on Linux.

    You seem to have no idea how the real world works btw. Intel as a corporation doesn't give a shit about wayland, their marketing department probably doesn't even know it exists. They sell products that require a display server, they hired a guy who writes display servers, it really is that simple.

    The thing is if you are burning money to keep your company a float, burning even more to write software someone else is already writing for you doesn't seem very smart.

    Dave.
    I was agreeing with you. At the same time, Canonical is interested in becoming a profitable business so I pointed that out too. Thanks for the insult.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartinN View Post
    I was agreeing with you. At the same time, Canonical is interested in becoming a profitable business so I pointed that out too. Thanks for the insult.
    Its phoronix, free insult with every post.

    The thing is RH do make their money from Linux directly, yes they sell support, but it all comes from the investment the company has made in taking Linux to the point that they could sell support.

    Profit may not be their primary motivator, there's also the possibility that Canonical is interested in being bought out by someone, so trying to create things that are directly valuable to them not as a means to make profit but as a means to convince someone else it would be easier to buy the company than do it themselves.

    1. Create display server, phone, phablet stack, own it all.
    2. ????
    3. <company> buys Canonical, Mark goes back to space.

    To become profitable and self sustaining, they probably need to concentrate on doing one thing and doing it well, instead they same to be trying to make land grabs in as many pies as they can, hoping something sticks. I don't think I've entrusting my long term server support to a company that is trying to be bought out by a phone manufacturer.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by daniels View Post
    Wayland was running on Android last year.
    And that helps us how when it isn't any more? (link)
    Not that that's a good argument in itself, I know.

    OTOH, where is the stable driver ABI for Wayland? If it's the same one as X, how is that stable?
    http://www.google.com/search?q=xorg-video-abi
    And if you think that isn't a problem, that might be a good reason for Canonical to write a new display server in itself.
    Last edited by Ibidem; 03-06-2013 at 09:04 PM.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ibidem View Post
    And that helps us how when it isn't any more? (link)
    Not that that's a good argument in itself, I know.

    OTOH, where is the stable driver ABI for Wayland? If it's the same one as X, how is that stable?
    http://www.google.com/search?q=xorg-video-abi
    And if you think that isn't a problem, that might be a good reason for Canonical to write a new display server in itself.
    There is no ABI for drivers in wayland/mir like drivers in X.org, the fact you think there is shows you don't know anything, and are just commenting from a void.

    The wayland driver model is based around EGL extensions, drivers provide the EGL extensions and they work with wayland. Wayland also uses KMS/GBM for modesetting and buffer management APIs, Mir can use KMS/GBM and haven't revealed their top secret internal alternative (jokes it doesn't exist yet).

    The thing is as modesetting APIs go, KMS is really the only viable current API for multi-output modesetting, if you don't want to use KMS you will have to create a new API + add an abstraction to KMS to supply the new API, then convince nvidia + AMD to implement something below your new abstraction. So why not get NVIDIA + AMD to implement the KMS API and save adding a pointless abstraction? This is the though process behind how wayland went, so far nothing has proven it wrong.

    Dave.

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