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Thread: OpenSUSE 12.3 Being Prepped With Numerous Changes

  1. #11
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    Opensuse 12.2 seemed like too much of a hybrid of old and new systems, such as systemd being introduced but only being used in parallel with the old sysvinit which retained control of many functions of the process. There are other examples of similar 'transitions' with multiple systems governing a single process.

    Opensuse 12.3 will be most greatly appreciated if it completes this transition of these many new technologies leaving a stable and coherent base on which to build.

    Chief amongst this bifurcated and inconsistent systems is package updating, specifically, the fact that suse has two largely separate systems for the process that conflict with each other:

    https://features.opensuse.org/313151

    This needs to be sorted out, leaving one coherent system to govern the package update process!

    When the solution for this problem is being pondered it needs to weigh in the requirments of the new apper/appstream based opensuse app-store that really needs to finally arrive with 12.3:

    https://features.opensuse.org/310778

    Lots of fine work has been done to create the prerequisites of an opensuse app-store, not least of which was changes to packagekit i believe, now is the time to see the fruits of that labour.

    With that said, other updates I like to see from opensuse 12.3 in march are; KDE 4.10, kernel 3.7, further Owncloud integration, and a green opensuse theme.

    Looking forward to it.
    Last edited by Jedibeeftrix; 11-09-2012 at 05:18 AM.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ericg View Post
    openSUSE handles rpm-yum...again?
    No, see http://duncan.mac-vicar.com/2008/05/...-memory-usage/

    Quote Originally Posted by chris2kari View Post
    http://news.opensuse.org/2012/11/08/...ready-for-you/
    The idiots want to abandon Zypper/Yast in favor of the excreble packagekit.
    You clearly don't understand how PackageKit (and zypper) work.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris2kari View Post
    Do a fresh install of OpenSUSE 12.2 & then try to add/remove some software & what do you get? Packagekit has locked it.
    I did this on monday and Packagekit locks the repositories for the time it installs/updates something or searches for updates. If Packagekit doesn't close itself after this, this is obviously a bug and should be reported. But I did not encounter this and could updates/install new software just fine via yast2. How often Packagekit searches for update is configurable and can be disabled -> no locks.

  3. #13
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    Hmm, a Software Center... Well, good luck with that. It would be worthless to me, but new users would definitely appreciate one. (Also, "App Store" is a poor name, as nothing is sold there, and also copyright.)

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris2kari View Post
    Packagekit is rubbish.
    It has Gnome disease - ie everything is COMPLETELY hidden from the end user & it is full of bugs.
    Do a fresh install of OpenSUSE 12.2 & then try to add/remove some software & what do you get? Packagekit has locked it..
    Actually things like these aren't usually PackageKitís fault. The biggest problem is the PackageKit-Zypper adapter. Itís simply buggy and for some reason wasn't even actively maintained for a bunch of openSUSE releases.
    Good to finally see improvements.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris2kari View Post
    Packagekit is rubbish.
    It has Gnome disease - ie everything is COMPLETELY hidden from the end user & it is full of bugs.
    Do a fresh install of OpenSUSE 12.2 & then try to add/remove some software & what do you get? Packagekit has locked it..
    Look on the bug trackers & mailings lists. The dev's repsonses to complaints about this is "oh we know about that.. it happens for some hours or so.."
    When pressed to fix the problem the response is "no, someone asked us to put that in so we are not taking it out"

    The only way to gain control of your system is to :

    1) open a terminal, kill packagekit,
    2) disable it from restarting,
    3) rebooting then
    4) rooting it out with zypper rm packagekit apper.
    5) Congratulate yourself on making OpenSUSE now usable.
    The only time I have had Packagekit tie up the system is when it checks for updates. After it is done it is out of the way. Feel free to uninstall Apper if it causes problems on your system.

    If you don't beleive me look at the huge number of threads on the forums, the bug trackers and the mailing lists!
    Ok moderator go stick your head back in the Fedora kool-aide.
    The problem isn't with packagekit, the problem is with Apper. Removing apper cures the issue. You do not have to uninstall Packagekit as there is nothing to call on it if you remove apper. If you have been with openSUSE long enough you should also remember that their various attempts at having a applet check updates and tie up the system extends well back for years and years and well before PackageKit was even implemented and as far back as 9.3 when they were using redcarpet.

  6. #16
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    My computer is triple boot. Windows (for very rare occasions when I need it), then two linux installs (each has boot, root and var partitions).

    Normally I snapshot one linux over the top of the other before I do a system upgrade of one version to the next. Trying to upgrade 12.1 to 12.2 ended up with a broken system, wouldn't boot and start everything up, and dependencies got into such a state I couldn't upgrade or downgrade. So I wiped that attempt clean and installed from scratch.


    At the moment the first linux install is a fresh 12.2, and it tends to crash because of problems with the video driver - not only does it not suspend, it locks up solid. I can't control screen brightness either.

    The second linux install is a mature 12.1+tumbleweed with a self-built optimised kernel, and is rock solid, and suspends and resumes perfectly. I can control screen brightness too. I selectively allow package upgrades as I don't want it to break, I only upgrade non-core stuff!


    12.2 looks nicer, is further through the systemd transition, and has a lot of improvements, but I am disappointed in the suspend/resume problem, especially as 12.1 was problem free practically out of the box.


    This cycle of good release, OK release and poor release seems typical of SuSE - things are just settling down when some sub-system is ripped out and a new one put in which doesn't fully work till the next major release. PulseAudio, I'm remembering you! KDE3.5 to 4, remember that? Plasmoid desktop stuff? This is why I now dual-boot.


    At work the standard is fedora desktops and centos on the servers. I did a simple routine update on fedora and now X11 hangs. Fortunately that machine is dual boot, and the 2nd OS is osuse12.2 which is working OK. My boss probably thinks I am running Fedora with a green theme ;-)

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by speculatrix View Post
    At the moment the first linux install is a fresh 12.2, and it tends to crash because of problems with the video driver - not only does it not suspend, it locks up solid. I can't control screen brightness either.
    Sounds like a problem with the kernel (if using OSS drivers) or the blob (if using closed drivers). Either way it's an upstream issue, not one with openSUSE. And in the first case you can write a bug report (if it wasn't solved already in OBS Kernel:HEAD).

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreatEmerald View Post
    Sounds like a problem with the kernel (if using OSS drivers) or the blob (if using closed drivers). Either way it's an upstream issue, not one with openSUSE. And in the first case you can write a bug report (if it wasn't solved already in OBS Kernel:HEAD).
    I lose the ability to control screen brightness whenever I install the proprietary NVidia drivers. Always had the issue.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanjo View Post
    This was again done to address a few issues. The init system is fine but does carry a lot of legacy payload. With most other distro's switching to Systemd this is actually a good thing as it becomes less distro dependent. ... Plus SystemD does have it's advantages.
    Right. Like I am currently upgrading from Suse 11.4 to 12.2 and now have to deal with systemd. This thing is not even able to correctly automount a nfs-mount out of fstab without cheating it. It tries to mount while the network isn't up and then I end up without the directories. I have to mount manually after logging in.
    I've seen systems presenting a login prompt without a login beeing possible unless you wait for 5 seconds until network authentification was working.
    To me systemd is dead on arrival. A major regression to be removed from the system.
    What's the use of a system that boots within 10 seconds but is only partially functional afterwards?

    Regards,
    Martin

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartysmart34 View Post
    To me systemd is dead on arrival. A major regression to be removed from the system.
    Systemd is fine. You are the regression. Behind every bad craftmanship there is a neckbeard bitching because of "wrong or bad tools". Sorry but systemd is very good, well documentated and well maintained. Your scriptkiddie c/p skillz just didnt cut it. Please fix your shit instead of crapping all over phoronix because you lack talent.

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