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Thread: Arch Linux Moves Forward With Systemd

  1. #11
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    Sigh. What distro is there for the "change for the *worse* is bad" folks?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teho View Post
    It's a problem that existed in udev even before the merge with systemd. Also it's not "they" but rather just Kay (if I'm not mistaken).

    From the mailing list topic you posted:
    You are misinterpreting my concerns. They are not the rants of a luddite but of one seeing history repeating itself.

    Yes useful had regression issue but they have become obtrusivied by the suddenly merger resulting in a blurring as to where (sysd or udev) the fault lies. What if the fix is done in sysd and not in undeveloped (where the problem is) so ppl the actually need sysd just to have a valid undeveloped.
    Also blaming the kernel for their incompetence, breaking umount.? Sashays df alias? It isn't ready yet.

    Pulseaudio was forced out way too soon. Sure now it is ok but then... And that is just audio


    A similar thing is occurring with sysd but more serious, it manages startup and services and are using bullyboy tactics by merging in a critical part of the Linux system to leverage on its momentum


    Point is it ain't ready for such a move. Sure let ppl try it Bit putting all distro in a difficult position is retarded.


    This is sysd in general not specific to arch decision

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by curaga View Post
    Sigh. What distro is there for the "change for the *worse* is bad" folks?
    Mac OS X

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naib View Post
    Point is it ain't ready for such a move.
    I disagree. I haven't experienced any notable problems with it in over 1,5 years of use. Where did you get the idea that udev and systemd was merged to boost systemd's popularity and how exactly is systemd being forced on you? You can't really blame systemd developers for Gnome dropping support for (unmaintained) ConsoleKit in favour of systemd because it's not their call.

  5. #15
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    I was a bit skeptical at first on the whole systemd migration in ArchLinux. but after testing it out and going full native systemd and seen the benefits. I'm not looking back at SysVinit .

    Scary and new at first but i quickly grasped it.

    Some of its features like the journal has proven a time saver for me in debugging missbehaving/configured services.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 89c51 View Post
    Mac OS X
    Eh, all my Mac-using friends think that OS X too has gone for the worse lately, going too walled garden even for their tastes.
    Probably won't be long when you can no longer install software not in the Mac App Store.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by 89c51 View Post
    Mac OS X
    Mac OS X has launchd, which is similar to systemd.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by LightBit View Post
    Mac OS X has launchd, which is similar to systemd.
    systemd is Linux launchd-- elaboration below.


    Ubuntu wanted to use launchd originally but the Apple Open Source License wasn't FOSS friendly enough so they didnt do. A few months later Apple relicensed launchd under the Apache license but by then Upstart had already started to be written and Ubuntu was locked into Not-Invented-Here.

    Lennart has even said he used launchd as inspiration for systemd but he wanted to take advantage of kernel features that are Linux-specific so he couldn't just USE launchd since then they'd add features to launchd that would only be usable under Linux and its doubtful Apple would allow that.

    So either

    1) Apple would have to start pulling ideas into their kernel that were based off of Linux (IP lawyers probably wouldnt like that with the GPL) or
    2) you'd have OS X launchd with some features, and Linux launchd with others, OR
    3) you'd have Lennart forking launchd and bolting the linux features ontop of the existing code.

    Quite frankly of those I think Lennart made the right choice when he chose option 4: write his own, with linux in mind from the beginning using launchd as inspiration of features.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by curaga View Post
    Eh, all my Mac-using friends think that OS X too has gone for the worse lately, going too walled garden even for their tastes.
    Probably won't be long when you can no longer install software not in the Mac App Store.
    It had a trollface smiley next to it but it got lost. Anyway. Win 8 for you then. Or you can try Haiku which is cool.

    Seriously give systemd a try. If you have a spare computer or set it in a VM or whatever. I believe you ll like it. The udev thing will be fixed once they stop the name calling in the LKML.

    Come to the dark side.

  10. #20
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    This will change in the near future, but they're not quite ready to recommend it for all new installs yet.


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