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Thread: linux, the very weak system for gaming

  1. #21
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    I can't say that linux is weak for gaming
    i haven't used dualboot for few years and i still have played a lot of games
    native and with wine.

    there are many games that work out of the box via wine.
    ofc there are plenty that doesnt or need some dirty hacks.
    still there's a lot of games to play. u dont even have the time to play them all.

    https://www.youtube.com/user/Xpander666


    and now with the steam coming and lots of kickstarter games getting native ports. things will go even better.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by nej_simon View Post
    Unfortunately third party development for Linux is difficult due to a lack of stable API's. There are often incompatibilities between different Linux distributions, and between different versions of the same distribution - even if they are released just a few months apart. There is also a lack of a standardized way of distributing software that works across different Linux distributions. If there isn't a package for your specific distribution you'll usually end up with a .tar.gz and a howto. That's why you often need to use various hacks and tricks to get third party software working. Hopefully the situation will improve since both Ubuntu and Gnome is aiming for API stability now.
    As far as I am concerned that's a myth. Every single one of the humble indie bundle games does it.

    There was a new post in the shiva3d engine / tech demo thread so I downloaded it: http://www.stonetrip.com/download/Te...t-v1.5.tar.bz2

    The "Howto" you mention would be:
    Step 1: Extract the archive
    Step 2: Doubleclick on "TheHunt".
    It just runs on my very recent 64 bit archlinux.

    As a developer you only need to make a list of the libraries you use and tell people what versions you used. Or better, package them and do LD_LIBRARY_PATH in your start script.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by nej_simon View Post
    The default desktop environment on Ubuntu (Unity) has a problem that causes the framerate to drop in games (bug #988079). You might want to try starting "Ubuntu Classic (No effects)" or Unity 2D instead for gaming.

    Unfortunately third party development for Linux is difficult due to a lack of stable API's. There are often incompatibilities between different Linux distributions, and between different versions of the same distribution - even if they are released just a few months apart. There is also a lack of a standardized way of distributing software that works across different Linux distributions. If there isn't a package for your specific distribution you'll usually end up with a .tar.gz and a howto. That's why you often need to use various hacks and tricks to get third party software working. Hopefully the situation will improve since both Ubuntu and Gnome is aiming for API stability now.
    1: Why the heck does the choice in desktop environments affect FPS one way or the other? Overhead should be close to non-existent.
    2: Yes, stable API's would help a TON.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by nej_simon View Post
    Unfortunately third party development for Linux is difficult due to a lack of stable API's. There are often incompatibilities between different Linux distributions, and between different versions of the same distribution - even if they are released just a few months apart. There is also a lack of a standardized way of distributing software that works across different Linux distributions. If there isn't a package for your specific distribution you'll usually end up with a .tar.gz and a howto. That's why you often need to use various hacks and tricks to get third party software working. Hopefully the situation will improve since both Ubuntu and Gnome is aiming for API stability now.
    i run slackware current and xonotic never failed on me(althou it has sometimes problems starting do to pthreads, but i think its cuz i have only 1cpu/thread) neither did warcraft 3 tft nor dota2

    bugs are filed to open source programs every day, and sometimes solving one bug causes another to appear that has been there all along, just hasn't been triggered

    (not to brag) iv been learning asm as a hobby the last month or so
    little program im doing does some opengl 3D(very basic and amateurish sofar) on a 64bit linux, avoiding stdlibs and such
    from what i learned(as there is almost nothing about 64bit linux asm on the net) is that C and other higher level languages abstract everything(asm does nothing of the sort, but its possible to make almost cross platform 32bit opengl program(syscalls woud need to be changed and idk)) to a degree that if you write your code in opengl, glut, sdl and such, it woudnt be much of a problem to port it as most of the code is de facto platform independet(game logic, phisics, math, even 3D with opengl)

    so... boycot directX so that it woud be cheaper to port things, thus making it sometimes even worth the effort for companies(companies need to make money to survive and bring you games)

    too summarise a bit: no sane gamer woud switch, not even for valves 10fps. Simply cuz they dont know how to set up all that stuff you need to get that 10fps. Even worse that most games run far better in their native environment that the "gamers" are used too and know.

    edit: PS linux is stable in its (most of) POSIX API, and ofc opengl (GLUT is stable too)
    so if you write a POSIX/opengl game that does its own physics, uses GLUT and idk about sound(shud be some stable cross platform thingy for sound, maybe openAL) you'd have almost no problem porting it to anything x86(that can run the opengl version you choose) maybe even ARM(dont care, didnt check);
    but people use shared libs/ other projects as shortcuts(GLUT IS a shortcut to make a window, but its proven stable) that are not stable

    problem with commercial game engines is that they often have middleware, made to be easy to integrate and fast to make good results(read cheap and works)
    Last edited by gens; 08-22-2012 at 02:24 PM.

  5. #25
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    One of the major issues with gaming on linux is that major distributions are often 6 months-1 year behind kernel/mesa git. Users that want the latest and greatest are forced to download and compile the latest git, and suffer the consequences of running pre-release software. Those who do not run git will look at Michaels benchmarks and get Jaded because they cannot achieve the same results with their freshly downloaded Ubuntu 12.04. It's more of a perception issue than an issue with the technology.

    I always thought it would be a neat exercise to release a gentoo-derived distribution to close the gap. It would be bare-bones and feature daily builds of the latest kernel RC, Mesa git, etc. Release it as a raw disk image for USB sticks so that anyone could simply download and run "today's linux", so that they could see what to expect out of the next major Ubuntu/FC/Deb release.

    I have an AMD 5750, an Nvidia 8800GT, and a T400 with an intel GMA4500HD. I could probably bang out a reasonable platform in less than 24h, distribute it through bit torrent, and supply the portage directory as an alternate "source" download to meet my obligations under the GPL (I'd probably want to double check this first).

    F

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamerk2 View Post
    1: Why the heck does the choice in desktop environments affect FPS one way or the other? Overhead should be close to non-existent.
    2: Yes, stable API's would help a TON.
    back in the compiz-fusion days you could shout your mum in your bedroom show off your cube desktop and the wobbly windows then when she's said 'very good dear' and carried on about her business you could switch it off then double click your game icon and frag some more n00bs but now if you're a gnome 3 user you have to log out and switch to gnome-classic which is utterly featureless ( can you even edit a panel now ? ) which begs the question why does one need compositing at all? especially when the likes of openbox have neat little 2d effects... desktop env is a choice

    as for stable API see libSDL post previous

    LUDICROUS KILL!!!

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    Probably due to X11 and the various desktop environments having absolutely no standards regarding games. And zero interest in introducing any. From the perspective of X11 and the DEs, games do not exist. They simply don't care about them.
    In fairness, the modern DEs just don't work at anything at all. It's not just limited to games.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by russofris View Post
    One of the major issues with gaming on linux is that major distributions are often 6 months-1 year behind kernel/mesa git. Users that want the latest and greatest are forced to download and compile the latest git, and suffer the consequences of running pre-release software. Those who do not run git will look at Michaels benchmarks and get Jaded because they cannot achieve the same results with their freshly downloaded Ubuntu 12.04. It's more of a perception issue than an issue with the technology.
    I find amazing that many posters forgot 3D games on Microsoft Windows 7 requires third party drivers i.e AMD Catalyst or Nvidia Forceware. Most comments never actually run stock driver from a bare-bone Microsoft Windows 7, they will face the same problem with majority of distribution using mesa. Some benchmarks don't take account of that crucial factor. Mesa driver is amazing despite its lagging from third-parties drivers.

    I always thought it would be a neat exercise to release a gentoo-derived distribution to close the gap. It would be bare-bones and feature daily builds of the latest kernel RC, Mesa git, etc. Release it as a raw disk image for USB sticks so that anyone could simply download and run "today's linux", so that they could see what to expect out of the next major Ubuntu/FC/Deb release.
    Fedora does run the latest kernel RC from its rawhide development. Stable release does run newer version which allow running newer hardware as well.
    http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Kernel

    Linux system is good for gaming although it does not have commercial version which is up to publishers themselves.

  9. #29
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    Works for me, though I sometimes experience the annoying screen resolution screw up and miss being able to easily minimize a game.

  10. #30
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    same reason some console ports have bad performance on PCs but are fine on consoles.

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