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Thread: Two Years With Linux BFS, The Brain Fuck Scheduler

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    Kernel 3.0 is unusable for me without BFS. I mean really, a total piece of crap experience. Benchmark THAT.
    Care to explain what's wrong? I know CFS doesn't allow you to use millions Hz as a timer frequency, but some people explained it's a dumb stupid idea. Last time you were bashing KDE just because your home made and messed up by yourself distro had some problems with it - you were using unstable graphic drivers... maybe this time it's the same?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by kraftman View Post
    Care to explain what's wrong? I know CFS doesn't allow you to use millions Hz as a timer frequency, but some people explained it's a dumb stupid idea.
    Why the FUD? BFS recommends 1000Hz, not a million. Please show me where BFS recommends more than that. It's not even freakin' possible to use more than 1000Hz with BFS.

    Ah, you mean the -ck patch, not BFS. You have no clue (again) what BFS is. And even the -ck patch in question even says that more than 1000Hz is only used for some broken software that depend on timer frequency and should not be used without a strong reason because it can break things.

    You're a FUD spreader, kraftman. And the worst part is you know it, but simply don't give a shit.

    Last time you were bashing KDE just because your home made and messed up by yourself distro had some problems with it - you were using unstable graphic drivers... maybe this time it's the same?
    More FUD. Those problems were fixed as soon as the kernel 3.0 BFS came out. It was the CFS scheduler that fucked up the performance of my system. With BFS + 3.0.1, everything is fine again. Oh, and my system is configured perfectly.

    Kraftman: clueless and ignorant as ever. And with proof, as is evident from the above.
    Last edited by RealNC; 08-16-2011 at 07:48 AM.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by curaga View Post
    Well, don't openarena and unigine benches also list the min fps? That should be a good indicator.
    That would almost be good.
    What is needed is a way to print a graph that shows how the framerate is moving per second. Like one of those stock marked price graphs you see in those papers.
    At the same time there should be a way of figuring out when there is a I/O timeout, which is even more essential. That should also be printed into some graph.

    And there should be a second stress test: A simple "the gui lags" test done via a recording camera where you attempt to do something while the linux kernel is compiling in the background with too many threads.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    Why the FUD? BFS recommends 1000Hz, not a million. Please show me where BFS recommends more than that.
    It's not the FUD. Con allowed you to use at least 10kHz which was stupid. I'm not talking about recommendations, but about ability.

    Ah, you mean the -ck patch, not BFS. You have no clue (again) what BFS is. And even the -ck patch in question even says that more than 1000Hz is only used for some broken software that depend on timer frequency and should not be used without a strong reason because it can break things.
    It seems you don't have a clue or your logic fails, because I didn't even mention BFS, but CFS. As far I can see it's you who does FUD here. You didn't even care to explain what's so terribly wrong with CFS in Linux 3.0. You were also FUDing about KDE while the problems you were experiencing were your fault, but let's focus on schedulers.

    You're a FUD spreader, kraftman. And the worst part is you know it, but simply don't give a shit.
    Care to explain? It seems you didn't realize what I'm talking about.

    More FUD. Those problems were fixed as soon as the kernel 3.0 BFS came out. It was the CFS scheduler that fucked up the performance of my system. With BFS + 3.0.1, everything is fine again.
    As far as I remember your problems were related to unstable graphic drivers. How CFS could mess up your performance with KDE? Again, care to explain what was wrong? 3.0.1 and 3.0 is not the same, so maybe it wasn't BFS which fixed your problems, but DRM or something. Your "proof" is no more.

    Kraftman: clueless and ignorant as ever. And with proof, as is evident from the above.
    You're making me laugh. While you didn't even know what I was talking about and you started your biased talk about BFS (which I didn't even mention) it's you who's clueless (as ever).

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    It's not even freakin' possible to use more than 1000Hz with BFS.
    http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=ODAxOQ

    Not true. Con allowed you to use 10KHz patch with BFS.

  6. #16

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    Here is my take - purely subjective, a meta-comment if you will. I am a bit strange as I use Scientifc Linux as my desktop. And guess what, with its plain recompiled 2.6.32 kernel I have had no thrashing or lockup or mouse - jitters that always seem to follow me when I try Ubuntu. What do I run? A chess client, mplayer2, firefox with many tabs , a torrent application and maybe rhythmbox.

    I have alwasy thought that half the problem of jittery systems is simply too many unneeded background services running.
    Maybe a properly tuned system is all most people need.
    I have no opinion about how good BFS is itself as I don't use it.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by kraftman View Post
    It's not the FUD. Con allowed you to use at least 10kHz which was stupid. I'm not talking about recommendations, but about ability.
    No, BFS does not allow that. Show me where it does that. All I can find is a specific patch in the -ck patchset (which BFS is part of, not vice versa). BFS does not alter the HZ choices in any way.

    It seems you don't have a clue or your logic fails, because I didn't even mention BFS, but CFS.
    Who are you trying to BS, kraftman? Here's what you said:

    "I know CFS doesn't allow you to use millions Hz as a timer frequency, but some people explained it's a dumb stupid idea."

    suggesting that BFS does allow you to use 1000000Hz. If you lack the ability to communicate properly, maybe you should refrain from trying.

    As far I can see it's you who does FUD here. You didn't even care to explain what's so terribly wrong with CFS in Linux 3.0.
    I'll tell you what's wrong with it; the whole GUI starts lagging and frame skipping when CPU load approaches the 90-100 range and Jack is dropping samples (resulting in weird noises) every 5 seconds. That's what's wrong with it.

    You were also FUDing about KDE while the problems you were experiencing were your fault, but let's focus on schedulers.
    Sure, go grave digging about other issues in a vain attempt to direct attention away from your current FUD spreading.

    Care to explain? It seems you didn't realize what I'm talking about.
    That's the problem. You don't care to explain what you're talking about, even though you know you're being ambiguous. You didn't mean to suggest that BFS uses 1 million HZ values? Then why the hell did you make it look like that's what you meant?

    As far as I remember your problems were related to unstable graphic drivers.
    Both stable and unstable.


    How CFS could mess up your performance with KDE?
    That's easy. Kwin animation produce CPU load. When that happens, KDE craps out, because CFS in 3.0(.1) does that for any kind of CPU load, not just the one coming from Kwin itself.

    Again, care to explain what was wrong? 3.0.1 and 3.0 is not the same, so maybe it wasn't BFS which fixed your problems, but DRM or something. Your "proof" is no more.
    No. I was using 3.0.1 before I applied the BFS patch to it. And I can back it up, because of the first comment on this blog post.

    You're making me laugh. While you didn't even know what I was talking about and you started your biased talk about BFS (which I didn't even mention) it's you who's clueless (as ever).
    Sure, you start commenting how it's broken on a thread that's about BFS. Next time someone starts a thread about Indian food, I'll go and state how much I hate it and how bad it is for your health, and when someone asks why, I'll claim that I meant junk-fast-food restaurants in India and not Indian food per se.

    Grow up.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    No, BFS does not allow that. Show me where it does that. All I can find is a specific patch in the -ck patchset (which BFS is part of, not vice versa). BFS does not alter the HZ choices in any way.
    Again no clue. Where did I say same BFS does allow you to do THAT?

    Who are you trying to BS, kraftman? Here's what you said:

    "I know CFS doesn't allow you to use millions Hz as a timer frequency, but some people explained it's a dumb stupid idea."

    suggesting that BFS does allow you to use 1000000Hz. If you lack the ability to communicate properly, maybe you should refrain from trying.
    I suggested Con allows you to use some big stupid frequency which is dumb. I could recommend you the same, but when comes to thinking and I also recommend you to stop putting some words in my mouth.

    I'll tell you what's wrong with it; the whole GUI starts lagging and frame skipping when CPU load approaches the 90-100 range and Jack is dropping samples (resulting in weird noises) every 5 seconds. That's what's wrong with it.
    We've got some progress, but you still have no clue:

    RealNC:

    http://phoronix.com/forums/showthrea...384#post220384

    ES seems to be useless with the open source r600g driver. KWin just crashes immediately.

    And regular OpenGL is slow as molasses :-D Amazing times for Linux desktops, yey! It feels as exciting as it was back 15 years ago. All hail the mighty Linux Desktop that is so much better than Windows 7 and OS X :-)

    Edit:
    Nah, I'm kidding. It just stinks.



    So let's take a look. Kwin crashes, because of...CFS! OpenGL is slow, because of...CFS!

    and you said later:

    More FUD. Those problems were fixed as soon as the kernel 3.0 BFS came out. It was the CFS scheduler that fucked up the performance of my system. With BFS + 3.0.1, everything is fine again. Oh, and my system is configured perfectly.

    Kraftman: clueless and ignorant as ever. And with proof, as is evident from the above.
    So I understand BFS fixed your slow OpenGL and Kwin crashes? Simply brilliant!*

    As for your other KDE and CFS problems it will be good to know what apps are you using for sound, what phonon backend, what kernel config.

    Sure, go grave digging about other issues in a vain attempt to direct attention away from your current FUD spreading.
    You have done this btw - *

    That's the problem. You don't care to explain what you're talking about, even though you know you're being ambiguous. You didn't mean to suggest that BFS uses 1 million HZ values? Then why the hell did you make it look like that's what you meant?
    You didn't care to explain what's wrong with CFS and 3.0, why should I care explaining what I meant?

    Both stable and unstable.
    Great, but it seems those problems weren't related to CFS, but some other problems you said NOW, so I couldn't know about them, could I?

    That's easy. Kwin animation produce CPU load. When that happens, KDE craps out, because CFS in 3.0(.1) does that for any kind of CPU load, not just the one coming from Kwin itself.
    This can be true, but not for crashing Kwin or slow OpenGL...

    No. I was using 3.0.1 before I applied the BFS patch to it. And I can back it up, because of the first comment on this blog post.
    Great, but it's about problems you have mentioned now and I"m not a prophet and I can't scan your brain.

    Sure, you start commenting how it's broken on a thread that's about BFS. Next time someone starts a thread about Indian food, I'll go and state how much I hate it and how bad it is for your health, and when someone asks why, I'll claim that I meant junk-fast-food restaurants in India and not Indian food per se.
    I won't comment how broken BFS is, because I didn't use it for long. I didn't like you were blaming CFS and didn't care to explain what's wrong with it. I was also making fun of some funny ability to use 10kHz timer option.

    Grow up.
    You should rather say: become a prophet or something, because I'm not aware of your problems if you didn't mention them before and those* which you mentioned doesn't seem to be CFS fault...

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kraftman View Post
    Again no clue. Where did I say same BFS does allow you to do THAT?
    Here:

    Me: Kernel 3.0 is unusable for me without BFS. I mean really, a total piece of crap experience. Benchmark THAT.

    You: Care to explain what's wrong? I know CFS doesn't allow you to use millions Hz as a timer frequency [wtf is that? this is suggesting that CFS doesn't and BFS does], but some people explained it's a dumb stupid idea.

    Stop trying to weasel out of it with "but I didn't mean that, it's your fault for thinking that". Be a man. Say "I'm sorry, I miscommunicated it, so here's what I meant."

    So, what is it that you meant? And how does what you meant bear any relevance to this thread (which is about BFS and not some random, highly specialized, special circumstances, HZ altering -ck patch.)

  10. #20
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    Jack isn't any better with BFS, you have to enable threaded interrupts and set irq priorities, THAT will make a BIG difference.
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