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Thread: PHP As A Next-Generation Programming Language?

  1. #1
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    Default PHP As A Next-Generation Programming Language?

    Phoronix: PHP As A Next-Generation Programming Language?

    Frank Karlitschek, the founder of the ownCloud project, is making the case that PHP isn't that bad of a scripting language and should be taken to the next level with its shortcomings addressed so it can regain some of its popularity...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTgwMjY

  2. #2
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    Default Python?

    Michael, I actually always wondered, not why you use a scripting language, but rather why it wasn't Python. The one benefit of PHP, that I see now, is the use of a browser-centric GUI.

  3. #3
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    It's actually kind of a shame that we have to use PHP as frequently as we do.

  4. #4
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    Default Have your cake and eat it too

    The ownCloud founder argues that PHP should be overhauled but should be done carefully to avoid incompatibility issues like with the PERL7/Python3 migration, etc.
    An admirable sentiment.

    Changes he would like to see would be killing the $_GET / $_POST / $_SERVER arrays and be replaced by a proper API for incoming data
    That would break compatibility right there.

  5. #5
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    Default

    If someone speak about the goodies of PHP and he doesn't follow PSR conventions and doesn't use composer dependency management in his own projects... For me, that's nosense.

    Also, please don't mention the black sheep of PHP (Wordpress) in this context... That's insulting.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by mendieta View Post
    Michael, I actually always wondered, not why you use a scripting language, but rather why it wasn't Python. The one benefit of PHP, that I see now, is the use of a browser-centric GUI.
    Yes, for the web-GUI related like tasks, that lots of pts-core also powers OpenBenchmarking.org / Phoromatic that are run as web services so easy to reuse code and such in a straightforward manner (rather than having to write a PHP module for interfacing from C, worrying about other server requirements if going for Python), PHP servers being widely supported, being well experienced in PHP, and other reasons Frank has I largely agree with and have long sided with those views.

  7. #7
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    $_GET / $_POST / $_SERVER
    Whats wrong with these? There's alternative functions to read raw data.

    improvements to database handling
    What improvements? PDO already satisfies 99% of use cases. It's not difficult to build an ORM to suit your needs on top.

    improve 32-bit vs. 64-bit handling
    PHP is simple enough in this regard. Primitive strings are signed int addressable everything else is signed long or double.

    kill ancient concepts
    What concepts? Most ancient concepts have been deprecated.

    remove most of the compile/run-time options
    This is a joke right?

    make optional static typing
    Facebook already has the Hack language.

    always use Unicode strings
    No. Binary strings should stay binary strings. It's up to the intelligence of the programmer to use the appropriate functions.

  8. #8
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    Default

    I don't think Frank Karlitshek has been following the PHP development mailing list, because I think they've covered a lot of this already. But otherwise, he should bring some of this up himself, I'm sure they'd welcome it.

  9. #9
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mendieta View Post
    Michael, I actually always wondered, not why you use a scripting language, but rather why it wasn't Python. The one benefit of PHP, that I see now, is the use of a browser-centric GUI.
    Oh god, no... python has the same pitfalls php has and many more. It's a nice language and has nice feature and data handling, but in my opinion it is completely unsuitable for large cooperative projects due to its characteristics (duck typing, dynamically and strongly typed). Also PHP is born to be used as a template language, python isn't at all.

  10. #10
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    > Changes he would like to see would be killing the $_GET / $_POST / $_SERVER arrays and be replaced by a proper API for incoming data

    Quote Originally Posted by gigaplex View Post
    That would break compatibility right there.
    The problems with $_GET, $_POST, and $_SERVER could be ameliorated by pulling them into the syntax of the language and dealing with them as a special form.

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