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GNOME Shell 2.29 Brings A Lot Of Improvements

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  • #31
    Originally posted by kraftman View Post
    Plasma is usable and the Gnome shell afaik is not even finished, so I doubt if it's usable right now as plasma is. This magic word "usable, usability" is used where there are no other arguments? I'm sure there are, but if you don't have such arguments "usable" means nothing to me.
    I'm truly fed up to read always the same reactions of Gnome haters/KDE fanboys, each time Gnome related news are posted.
    You really have no other argument that a list of KDE techno when trying to convince people of KDE superiority ?
    The word "plasma" means nothing to me either, as a Gnome user.
    Last time I've tried KDE, I was lost in its cluttered menus trying to configure things as basic as windows behavior...
    So yes, even the unfinished Gnome Shell is already "usable" for me.

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    • #32
      I guess most people who choose to use Gnome use it because fancy desktop effects is in their opinion not worth anything. This crazy hunt for fanciness even effects the applications developed.

      Just look at Amarok. The only thing it does not is PLAY MUSIC! An application should do whats advertised and no more. A music player for example should play music and it should do so with ease. A playlist is the only real feature it really needs, anything and everything else should be hidden by default or selectable as a plug-in.

      If one likes bloated software, why use Linux at all? AH, its about choice. Then keep quiet and let people select their own path and their own preferences. If there's something missing, START DEVELOPING.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by val-gaav View Post
        You are not using Gnome for a long time ? I mean to say that something will be "optional" and that Gnome is about choice is really funny.
        Since Gnome 1.4, but not constantly. I also used KDE 2/3 in between but always came back for different reasons.

        Well, Gnome is quiet plugable as is KDE. Currently you can choose the WM you want, can replace gnome-panel with something different, are not forced to use nautilus for drawing the desktop and if you want to, you can also use KDE's themes on GTK+. Audio output (via pulse or esd) has different backends, printing can occur via cups lpd. But again, this is nothing special.

        As for the applications: I don't use that many gnome apps, but GTK+ ones. Therefore I welcome the recent activity to remove gnome-only libs from gnome to clean up the stack and don't bind those apps too much to gnome. That way you can use any gnome app without additional libraries on e.g. xfce, something I'd like to see for KDE apps, too (in case xfce was Qt based).

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        • #34
          Originally posted by val-gaav View Post
          Actually you are the sole reason why this party even started in the first place. Few of your flame-topics showed others the way to go.
          Hey, you are giving me way too much credit. Uncomfortable as it is for me to admit this, KDE/Gnome cross-flaming had been raging long before I even became a member of phoronix. Check a few older news items, I"m just a drop of water in an endless sea.

          I think around Gnome 3.0 you will end up posting and asking people to stop, but it will to late to stop this insanity by then...
          Nah, the flames are way too much fun for me to do this. Besides, what's the point of attempting to stop a Linux-wide trollfest raging on since '99? Simpler to just sit back and enjoy.

          Anyway it's obvious you want to FUD again... I'm not surprised.
          Actually, I dislike FUD as much as the next person (probably more, but yeah). That should be pretty obvious from my "evil conspiracy" parodies and my posts on Mono.

          My post on (the lack of) Qt integration however is not actually FUD, as pretty much every user of Mac OS X can atest to. A jab yeah, FUD no.

          That's not to say that GTK+ integration is better because, frankly, it's much worse (Qt at least looks semi-ok; GTK looks like shit). After trying for years, I can safely say that all cross-platform toolkits suck as far as integration. The only way to achieve 100% native look & feel is to code a different frontend for each platform - like Opera does now.

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          • #35
            Like GIMP isn't bloated right ? Why does it have so many options while all you want is to draw ? It should have one pen icon and drawing space and that's it... GIMP is not for you then just use Kolour Paint ...

            Amarok is for people that have a need for it. Others like you should use Juk which is just what you want a playlist with search function and few extra tricks like tags. I also don't need/use Amarok functions and Juk is what I use on my KDE desktop.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
              (Qt at least looks semi-ok; GTK looks like shit). After trying for years, I can safely say that all cross-platform toolkits suck as far as integration. The only way to achieve 100% native look & feel is to code a different frontend for each platform - like Opera does now.
              I guess this goes for personal preferences or how much you want ... If Qt4 integration is 90% for you then it seems for me it's 100%. On the other hand gtk+ is really a LOT worse. I even dare to say it doesn't even try to do the job at all .

              As for different frontend for each platform I disagree. Firefox is one example how that doesn't really work. It has quirks and problems on Gnome were just as you say it should have 100% integration. Oh and how long does it take for FF to integrate with new Win7 ?

              Anyway I applaud the Qt4 way as it takes the burden of integration from application developers and does a decent job (I would say it is an almost perfect job, but I did try it only on Win, Xfce, KDE so maybe MacOSX has some problems just as you say).

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              • #37
                Originally posted by spykes View Post
                I'm truly fed up to read always the same reactions of Gnome haters/KDE fanboys, each time Gnome related news are posted.
                You really have no other argument that a list of KDE techno when trying to convince people of KDE superiority ?
                The word "plasma" means nothing to me either, as a Gnome user.
                Last time I've tried KDE, I was lost in its cluttered menus trying to configure things as basic as windows behavior...
                So yes, even the unfinished Gnome Shell is already "usable" for me.
                I expected real differences rather then your personal opinion.

                You really have no other argument that a list of KDE techno when trying to convince people of KDE superiority?
                I consider there's nothing better to convince someone. What is usable for me doesn't mean it will be usable for someone else and thus I think it's better to list some techno things.

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                • #38
                  I'm mostly still stuck on the assertion that KDE doesn't have a predictable release schedule. They've stuck to the same one for a couple years now: feature release twice a year; bugfix monthly. Have we forgotten yet again that KDE 4.x isn't KDE 3.x?

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
                    Actually, I dislike FUD as much as the next person (probably more, but yeah). That should be pretty obvious from my "evil conspiracy" parodies and my posts on Mono.
                    FUD about mono you say:

                    Gnote
                    is installed by default in GNOME for this release replacing Tomboy. Gnote is a port of Tomboy from Mono to C++ and consumes fewer resources.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by kraftman View Post
                      I expected real differences rather then your personal opinion.
                      Then try it and find out by yourself.

                      I consider there's nothing better to convince someone. What is usable for me doesn't mean it will be usable for someone else and thus I think it's better to list some techno things.
                      As long as you don't explain the real purpose of "plasma" and what is it for, it's worth nothing.
                      What does it bring for me as a user that I won't be able to do with Gnome ?

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