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Thread: Improv Open ARM Board Failure Leads To A Ton Of In-Fighting

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by dee. View Post
    How is Ubuntu/Canonical related to this in any way?
    if there is any action from ubuntu or canonical, there is some shitstorm powered by the KDE guys.
    if you think about what seigo told about the ubuntu-edge campaign back then and now see all the history of the Improv and the Vivaldi one might think that he should have focused more on do own things right and not focus on what others might do other ways.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by k1l_ View Post
    if there is any action from ubuntu or canonical, there is some shitstorm powered by the KDE guys.
    Really? So are you saying, Canonical is so lazy and inactive, they only take action about once or twice a year? I haven't seen any KDE powered shitstorm more often than that... so is that what you're trying to say? I don't think Canonical is quite that inactive...

    if you think about what seigo told about the ubuntu-edge campaign back then
    What did he say then? Did he say some things like, that Ubuntu-Edge would fail and wouldn't get the required sum of money to get made?

    and now see all the history of the Improv and the Vivaldi one might think that he should have focused more on do own things right and not focus on what others might do other ways.
    So you're saying, that the failure of both Improv and Vivaldi was directly caused by Aaron Seigo saying things that you disagree with about Canonical's decisions? How does that work? Can you explain it to me like I'm 5 years old? I have a hard time grasping this concept...

  3. #13
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    Cool Lol, I got quoted

    Lol, I got quoted on a news page:

    "As summarized yesterday by a contributor"

  4. #14
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    This is everything open source in a nutshell... The starry eyed idealism on one side, while massively underestimating the amount of work involved, and also underestimating the damage the community does... Then there is the noise making side, which never really adds any value, apart from bloating ones own ego... And now everything has blown up, and everyone is shouting (including me, here, apparently). How often have we seen this already?

    EOMA-68 is a good idea in itself, and it would've really flown if it had been ready to ship a year earlier (and this will always be its problem, in future). But Lkcl bit off way more than he could quickly chew, and it took a lot of work to get everything sorted, probably an order of magnitude more than he originally thought... Then there was the mistake of going with MPL exclusively...

    The MPL side is all about noise, from where i sit. First the spark was loudly announced, with a rebadged device from a GPL breaching chinese manufacturer who stopped throwing this exact version of the hw over the hedge, then there was the vivaldi without anything concrete, then the improv was not even a tablet anymore at a time when proper OSHW development boards with the same specs became available on almost every streetcorner... Then there was the MPL website dying and being reborn with a layout and structure that did not exactly instill a lot of buyer confidence... No wonder that there were only 250 takers on the improv... And in all of this, I still do not understand why some KDE people would want to sell tablets themselves, let alone development boards...

    Luke, you are on your own. If you are going to rescue this hardware you designed, then it's just you. As you too have endured so often, involving others only slows you down further, or will only be damaging. Just don't expect to have any gains from it anymore though, try to save some face still, if it all possible.

    Aaron, it's been 3 times. Stop trying to sell hw yourself, and instead make it easy and desirable for people to install Mer/Plasma on existing hw. Start by stopping to see KDE/Plasma as the center of the universe, and instead help the various SoC communities out there (like linux-sunxi, linux-exynos, linux-rockchip, ...). Not by making noise, but by providing packaging and documentation. We, the SoC communities, do not need more noise, we need actual work.
    Last edited by libv; 05-26-2014 at 04:10 PM.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dee. View Post
    Really? So are you saying, Canonical is so lazy and inactive, they only take action about once or twice a year? I haven't seen any KDE powered shitstorm more often than that... so is that what you're trying to say? I don't think Canonical is quite that inactive...
    so you are not even denying that kde powers shitstorms against canonical. that proves enough...


    What did he say then? Did he say some things like, that Ubuntu-Edge would fail and wouldn't get the required sum of money to get made?
    if he would said that in a civil manner i would not complain about that.


    So you're saying, that the failure of both Improv and Vivaldi was directly caused by Aaron Seigo saying things that you disagree with about Canonical's decisions? How does that work? Can you explain it to me like I'm 5 years old? I have a hard time grasping this concept...
    telling everyone that they have no clue what they are doing (and making a big shitstorm out of that) and on the other hand not beeing able to prove the points yourself while making it the selfappointed "right" way.

    Some people work very hard (you including) to make some open source projects look bad. that is not what i think the interaction in the linux and opensource community should be like.


    Other projects showed that the idea of open hardware is not dead at all, see https://www.crowdsupply.com/kosagi/novena-open-laptop . i just think that people dont trust in projects that are recognized for just shitstorming and talking other projects down.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by k1l_ View Post
    so you are not even denying that kde powers shitstorms against canonical. that proves enough...
    I don't get it. What does it prove? Sorry, I find your thoughts a bit hard to follow. Maybe I'm just stupid or something. Can you explain it again from the beginning?

    if he would said that in a civil manner i would not complain about that.
    What did he say then? Must have been awful for you. Never fun when people are being uncivil to you and using all kinds of insults.

    telling everyone that they have no clue what they are doing (and making a big shitstorm out of that) and on the other hand not beeing able to prove the points yourself while making it the selfappointed "right" way.
    I'm sorry, I'm probably just stupid, but I still don't understand how that leads to the failure of Vivaldi and Improv. Can you retrace the steps for me?

    Some people work very hard (you including) to make some open source projects look bad.
    Me? You mean me personally? Now it sounds like you're accusing me of something. Explain yourself.

  7. #17
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    And today the official MakePlayLive forum seems unreachable (error 502): https://discuss.makeplaylive.com/ ...

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by genx View Post
    And today the official MakePlayLive forum seems unreachable (error 502): https://discuss.makeplaylive.com/ ...
    Downtime: 4 days and counting. It does not seem to be their priority (in case anyone would still believe so).

  9. #19
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    I feel that the problem with projects such as these is they try to do too much at the same time.

    Want an open-source-hardware tablet? Let's work on that.
    Want to get an open-source alternative to Android? Let's work on that.

    But by god it is biting off more than you can chew trying to do it all at once. I know, it's the dream, but for me it's the reason I moved away from KDE: I felt they were loosing their focus on creating an excellent open-source desktop to follow tablet dreams.

    I wish them the best of luck (it's seems they're not having it right now), but please guys, consider focusing on killer software, and let the hardware come more naturally. If instead of thinking of writing free software, RMS just decided to do an open-source printer, the world might just be a very strange place today (or maybe not, and someone else would eventually pick up the torch).

    Open-source software still has a way to go (especially on tablets and phones) before we really need to cross into the open hardware realm.

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