Systemd Continues Getting Bigger, Almost At 550k Lines Of Code

[xeekei]

I do not wish to run it. Do you have a problem with that? Are you telling me that I am being stupid and wrongthinking because I don't wish to run systemd? I'm not even getting into technical issues, let's ignore that for the moment.

My problem is that it is getting to be rather difficult to not use it. Fortunately I'm running Gentoo on my systems, and the biggest problem is masking Gnome back to pre-3.8 while I figure out how to replace all of the pieces. Are you telling me I should not have the freedom to not use systemd?

You have the freedom to use whatever you want, just like the Gnome devs have the freedom to develop their DE however they want.

[quikee]

You mean the freetype library it uses to render subtitles? Or its functions for demuxing, decoding audio/video streams like... libav?

So what! systemd also uses freetype and libav!

[psychoticmeow]

I do not wish to run it. Do you have a problem with that? Are you telling me that I am being stupid and wrongthinking because I don't wish to run systemd? I'm not even getting into technical issues, let's ignore that for the moment.

You might be unreasonable, irrational or completely fair and reasonable depending on the strength of your argument for not wanting to run it. I'm going to assume the former because that's how these discussions usually end.

[inhuman4]

I do not wish to run it. Do you have a problem with that? Are you telling me that I am being stupid and wrongthinking because I don't wish to run systemd? I'm not even getting into technical issues, let's ignore that for the moment.

My problem is that it is getting to be rather difficult to not use it. Fortunately I'm running Gentoo on my systems, and the biggest problem is masking Gnome back to pre-3.8 while I figure out how to replace all of the pieces. Are you telling me I should not have the freedom to not use systemd?

There is nothing wrong with not wanted to use systemd, I'm sure there are lots of people who feel the same. The problem is the idea that somewhere out there, someone is responsible for making it easy for you to use your prefered init system.

If people who hate systemd so much want to write their own code to keep using init system XYZ, please go ahead. I'm sure that debian, arch, etc. would be happy to accept your patches.

[phred14]

If people who hate systemd so much want to write their own code to keep using init system XYZ, please go ahead. I'm sure that debian, arch, etc. would be happy to accept your patches.

I never introduced the word hate - you did. I've been running OpenRC and SysV init all of this time, and am happy to continue to do so.

[phred14]

You might be unreasonable, irrational or completely fair and reasonable depending on the strength of your argument for not wanting to run it. I'm going to assume the former because that's how these discussions usually end.

It hasn't been worth technical arguments in any of these forums. So I didn't even bother with it. Any technical arguments quickly devolve into calling me an idiot, hater, or something else such.

[movieman]

If people who hate systemd so much want to write their own code to keep using init system XYZ, please go ahead. I'm sure that debian, arch, etc. would be happy to accept your patches.

And this kind of attitude is precisely the reason so many people are p-ed off with systemd.

[DanL]

My problem is that it is getting to be rather difficult to not use it. Fortunately I'm running Gentoo on my systems, and the biggest problem is masking Gnome back to pre-3.8 while I figure out how to replace all of the pieces. Are you telling me I should not have the freedom to not use systemd?

If it's anything like pulseaudio in gnome, you will probably be able to do without systemd, but you will lose some features as they become dependent upon (or assume the presence of) systemd.

So, you're free not to use it, but gnome is probably not the best desktop choice if you don't want to run it...

[Chousuke]

Everyone is completely free not to use systemd. The rest of the community is also free not to care about those people.

Fact is, the people doing all this low-level core development stuff tend to be the people developing systemd. It's beiing "forced down" everyone's throats because next to no-one who actually

1) has the expertise and
2) Considers it worth the effort to compete with systemd

is doing any work. Want a better alternative to systemd? Write the code or pay someone to write it, and then show that the result is so much better that everyone should use it. There is no other option at this point. The systemd guys did it.

Sure, there are projects that present themselves as an alternative to systemd but they tend to lack the ambition and are not demonstrably superior to systemd in the first place. Or they're simply too late to the game to be relevant.

[strcat]

There is nothing wrong with not wanted to use systemd, I'm sure there are lots of people who feel the same. The problem is the idea that somewhere out there, someone is responsible for making it easy for you to use your prefered init system.

If people who hate systemd so much want to write their own code to keep using init system XYZ, please go ahead. I'm sure that debian, arch, etc. would be happy to accept your patches.

Arch isn't going to take on more maintenance burden and packaging complexity to support other init systems. It doesn't really matter if someone does all the initial work since the developers still have to maintain it. There's no shortage of distributions providing other init systems, and everyone is free to use one of those instead.