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  • #46
    Originally posted by dragonlord View Post
    :d

    "your ass... Your face... Where's the difference"
    roflmao!

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    • #47
      "It's time to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I'm all outta gum!"

      Good god... those memories . This is somehow the kind of fun I'm missing in todays games... just this damn fucking fun a game can give you playing it... not like this shit tossed at us nowadays U_U

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      • #48
        Yup, the fun factor in games seems to be Missing in Action in favour for graphics, physics and sound, but not fun. Well, that Penny Arcade game actually brings lots of it to the table, but certainly more games better start to get back the fun factor again.

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        • #49
          Svartalf, you sound so like the comments from Nintendo before they launched the first console in years to make a profit on the hardware...

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
            One of the key take away items here would be:



            (The following is representative of MY views and does not reflect any entities' views such as LGP (for which I have a tag on my name here in this forum)...)

            Rage will happen for us, but only on their time- and WE, the people out there using Linux, have only ourselves to blame.

            Why do I say this?

            Each time you lot goes and bitches about the "age" of a given game or compares the price of the Windows version versus the Linux one and bitches about that you do yourselves and everyone else a serious disservice. We're being watched. And this is the results of some of that sort of thing.

            Spare all of us the "more money" line, folks- it's not valid, really. Do you think iD cares about a piddling 1000-2000 users' worth of money? In their minds, that's about all they think they can sell based off of what people can publicly see and the past performances we've given them in this area (Q3:A only sold 200 copies for the official Linux version because of the kinds of thinking I've seen espoused in these forums...)- which makes it not worth their while. The main reason he's been doing Linux titles is that it made sense to make the stuff cross platform and we were an underserved market. Unfortunately for us, we also seem to be an arrogant and ungrateful one as well, presuming that we're entitled to stuff.

            You're NOT their customer. At best, you're a user of their software if you're using one of their official or unofficial platforms they've chosen to target.

            Their customer is the publisher.

            The publisher's customer is the retailer.

            When you buy from a retailer, they don't care about what OS you're running- they're selling you a little box with a bit of paper and a bit of plastic in it, that purportedly does something when it is stuck into a Windows or MacOS based machine or a console.

            So we've got over 30 million users worldwide. Great.

            How many of that are willing to buy games? Hundreds? Thousands?

            If it's not the same scope and scale as the Mac crowd has been (and we're not there, gang, because of that sense of entitlement we all seem to have here...) they're NOT going to be interested, being a seriously underserved community and all. They've got to see a return on things and for most players, they're not seeing anything except a LOSS from making stuff for us.

            What we've shown is that we're not interested in buying games- and in a manner that leads people like iD to not consider us being on the radar and like Epic who's delayed the release now some 10 months if we even SEE the thing in the case of UT3.

            Spare me conspiracy theories of Microsoft. Sure, they might have had SOME hand in Unreal not being in our hands- but it's unlikely all the same.

            We're our own worst enemy, if you honestly want to know the truth. This is the fruits, folks, of the "it's too expensive", or "it's too old", or "that tanked" lines of thought and the resultant actions.

            You run Linux. WHY would you ever want to run a Windows title?
            In the infancy of things right now, WHY would you ever commit an infringement on a given title?

            Because you can? Because you can't be bothered to hold off for a better situation or to get an actual native binary? Because the game's "too cool" and you can't stand not being able to run it?
            Because you don't think the game's worth the price, either because the Windows version is cheaper than the Linux version or "you've already bought it"?

            Each time you use WINE for a contemporary game you vote for Windows, even if we're as large a userbase as we think we are.

            Each time you buy a Windows SKU and "convert" it to Linux when there was an official Linux version, you make a vote for Windows.

            Each time you choose to make an infringement of a current selling Linux title, you're actually HURTING things- yes, I know it's a no-sale, but the problem is when the "no-sales" comprise what would have possibly made for a break-even or a profit sufficient to get the next and cooler title that might have sold, you defeat yourselves. The people doing the infringements seem to think it was worth spreading around- but not worth enough to buy. Each time someone does this, it gives the impression, right or wrong, that we aren't interested in buying games. Moreover, it lends the impression, right or wrong, that we're more interested in infringing upon their rights that paying the money for things...

            Look well at this folks. This is the fruits of all of our labors here.

            Just at the moment we're winning one fight for things, we're losing it for at least the next 3-5 years or more on the gaming front.

            Because of the things I've just said.

            I hope all of the people that are guilty of the aforementioned things are PROUD of themselves. They're succeeding in doing for Microsoft what they couldn't do otherwise- deep sixing gaming on Linux for some time to come.
            I'm usually behind your posts on most issues, but on this one I'm not buying what you're selling. I am a Linux gamer... that does not make me a gamer who likes older crappier games. Occasionally, however, I will buy the older crappier games that do end up getting a Linux port just because I have the hope it will help the situation, but I still reserve the right to bitch about the fact that the latest games do not make it to my chosen OS. I do vote with my wallet as well as choose to acknowledge the problems with the situation.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
              Prey is another one of their titles. It's still selling pretty good actually, and is one of the things that's publicly known- they've done a handful of other projects that their name didn't get put on it because they were the subcontractor on the project.

              Couple this with keeping a good control on the good money they got from Terminal Velocity, Duke, and Shadow Warrior, they've been able to keep going all this time. It remains to be seen if DNF is going to be worth the wait we've had- but some people that've seen the current "attempt" at it that may well be on it's way to Gold status have been at least mildly impressed. We'll see- I'm still sitting on the fence on this one. If I can get them to give me the time of day on a discussion of a Linux/MacOS version port and see it for myself, I'll change that position.
              But Prey was made by Human head, not 3DR. The last game they actually developed was Shadow warrior, over a decade ago. Its amazing how they can live (rather lavishly) from dos era yesterhits.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by joshuapurcell View Post
                I'm usually behind your posts on most issues, but on this one I'm not buying what you're selling. I am a Linux gamer... that does not make me a gamer who likes older crappier games. Occasionally, however, I will buy the older crappier games that do end up getting a Linux port just because I have the hope it will help the situation, but I still reserve the right to bitch about the fact that the latest games do not make it to my chosen OS. I do vote with my wallet as well as choose to acknowledge the problems with the situation.
                You're not one of the ones that the rant was directed at.

                You don't think you're entitled to games. You've indicated in the past that you know the mess things are and would like for it to be better, pointing out some of the problems that you see. You're not one of the ones that's making the infringements (at least I hope you're not one of them- copying these titles without paying for them is analogous to what Verizon and Actiontec did to the busybox authors...).

                So, you're not so much part of the problem as an upset and frustrated Linux user- welcome to that club. Honestly, the T-shirt's not worth the membership.

                Me, I'm an upset user AND developer.

                I'm frustrated beyond words at having to pay so damn much to get things to be on our chosen platform.

                I'm frustrated beyond words at the Linux community being ignored when it comes to a lot of commercial software- we've got more users than Mac does right now.

                I'm frustrated beyond words at the people who keep doing the exact things that ensure that they do NOT get the nice new stuff they keep griping about.

                The rant was a bit of venting out that frustration.

                Whether you agree with my remarks or not, the fact of the matter is, a goodly portion of why we have things the way we do right now is due to the very things I ranted about. That's just a fact, unfortunately.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by xav1r View Post
                  But Prey was made by Human head, not 3DR.
                  Can't tell if you were being serious or not, but just for the record, Prey was originally made by 3DRealms. They just eventually handed it off to Human Head to finish it.
                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSFxiuID1TY

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by xav1r View Post
                    But Prey was made by Human head, not 3DR. The last game they actually developed was Shadow warrior, over a decade ago. Its amazing how they can live (rather lavishly) from dos era yesterhits.
                    It's my understanding that 3DR had a helping hand along with being the main publisher for it. Now, that could be wrong, but...

                    Originally posted by wikipedia
                    In 2001, 3D Realms began development on a new version of the title.[7] This time, with the advantage of the necessary portal technology already being a stable and functional component of all modern game engines, 3D Realms was able to license the necessary technology instead of having to develop it. 3D Realms chose the id Tech 4 game engine from id Software, and Rune developer Human Head Studios was commissioned to develop the game using the previous designs as a base.
                    And...

                    Originally posted by wikipedia
                    "New York, NY – April 26, 2005 – 2K Games, a publishing label of Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. (NASDAQ: TTWO), and 3D Realms today announced Prey, a revolutionary first person shooter for PC and a next-generation console system in development at Human Head Studios, under the direct supervision of 3D Realms."[10]
                    Which mostly maps to my understanding of things- Which is Human Head doing a good bit of the work after 3DR started it- with 3DR giving helpful shoves in the right places with the right people at the right times and then publishing the title. Which is much like what you see with Grey Matter or Splash Damage and iD on those titles they did.

                    Now, I could be wrong there, but...

                    Anyhow, even if they didn't do the work, they DID act as the primary publisher of the title and they did a similar thing for Max Payne 1 & 2- which would have netted them enough money to keep forging forward on DNF or some other project.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Malikith View Post
                      Mappers are in abundance though
                      Might want to point such people over here, then: http://edgeofchaos.planetdoom.gamespy.com/

                      A free total conversion mod for Doom 3 set in the Hexen universe, which has gained the full blessing of Raven Software. The mod is scheduled to be released for Linux as well as Windows. They're currently looking for mappers, as the news post implies.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
                        It's my understanding that 3DR had a helping hand along with being the main publisher for it. Now, that could be wrong, but...
                        You just hold on a sec there... I read somewhere that 3DR made it through all these years without an own title because they've been also publishing (or helping publish) other studio's titles, and that also was a way they were able to inject DNF with money. Wouldn't that make them also a publisher, and as such, if approached correctly, one friendly towards Linux? Did I understand you correctly and you actually know someone at 3DR?

                        1 + 1?

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Thetargos View Post
                          You just hold on a sec there... I read somewhere that 3DR made it through all these years without an own title because they've been also publishing (or helping publish) other studio's titles, and that also was a way they were able to inject DNF with money. Wouldn't that make them also a publisher, and as such, if approached correctly, one friendly towards Linux? Did I understand you correctly and you actually know someone at 3DR?

                          1 + 1?
                          No, I don't know someone over there (much to my dismay...)- some of my friends do, though, so at some point in the near future (I've waaaaay too many irons in the fire right at the moment- need to close out Bandits at least...) I'll try to see if I can go talk to a few people over there in Garland and see what comes of it. It's a decent prospect for us- I just didn't list anything they did or are planning to do in any of the lists because it's still a big unknown.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Chris View Post
                            Might want to point such people over here, then: http://edgeofchaos.planetdoom.gamespy.com/

                            A free total conversion mod for Doom 3 set in the Hexen universe, which has gained the full blessing of Raven Software. The mod is scheduled to be released for Linux as well as Windows. They're currently looking for mappers, as the news post implies.
                            yea, but that mod has been in development for years now.

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