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  • #31
    Originally posted by curaga View Post
    Svartalf.. You said every bought Windows copy is a sign for the company to keep on doing Windows titles. Would you accept then downloading the game and complaining to the corp?
    Only if the download was a Linux copy or available FOR it- and the complaints were to fix the problems in it that the Windows one doesn't seem to have.

    Unless it's able to be tied back to being a Linux purchase in some useful manner (like Id, Epic, and S2 have...) you're NOT buying a Linux title- PERIOD. When you buy it (downloading is merely getting what you're paying for...) and it's not a Linux title in some manner, you're sending votes for the OS that it was written and sold for. Complaining doesn't matter one whit unless you're talking half or more of their customer base bitching about it.

    Just want to know your opinion on this. Sorry if it's already written somewhere.
    Heh... No problem. Never hurts to clarify things off and on- it's not like I don't do it often enough of late.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
      Heh... Both of your examples are studios self-publishing. Think about that one for a bit.
      I know that, still they do it right

      Maybe LGP should go from the "porting old games and selling them as new" to the "asking game studios to port there new games" philosophy. At least that's what Transgaming is in charge at the moment.
      Well, one can dream, can't I?

      Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
      Heh... A bit more painful than I'd have expected. Right at that threshold. Most people that'd buy the games we're all talking about (Not Savage2...) actually don't HAVE good bandwidth so they'd be downloading all night, paying per bit for the download, etc. S2's getting away with it because the game appeals to that class of crowd that can justify it or has REAL bandwidth in the first place.
      Again in regard to Savage 2. S2 Games also offers a so called special edition of there game which ships on CD with some extras added.

      LGP should see a download option as an addition to the current system, not as a replacement. A personally also prefer a boxed version, but sometimes a abit cheaper download version will also do it and it's good when one can choose.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by M1AU View Post
        I know that, still they do it right

        Maybe LGP should go from the "porting old games and selling them as new" to the "asking game studios to port there new games" philosophy. At least that's what Transgaming is in charge at the moment.
        Well, one can dream, can't I?
        Everyone's been trying to get into that position for a bit. Closest players in that space would be icculus, TTimo, and recently Runesoft, though they clearly have their own issues as evidenced by Jack Keane (More on the financials side of things than the product side...). In the end, it's pricey for now to be doing that- with the things that've went wrong in the past for the Linux community, we're not in a position to just proposition just anybody and everybody.

        Again in regard to Savage 2. S2 Games also offers a so called special edition of there game which ships on CD with some extras added.
        Interesting tidbit, that. Shame that you'd need a different licensing deal to allow downloads like that- and it's going to be that bit more difficult for reasons I've discussed elsewhere.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
          Interesting tidbit, that. Shame that you'd need a different licensing deal to allow downloads like that- and it's going to be that bit more difficult for reasons I've discussed elsewhere.
          I don't think just answering back will make anything better. If you really want to find out how it turns out, you most likely have to make a test. Maybe it turns out exactly as you said, than you can easily go on with what you already have.

          When you decide that it's not worth a try, I'm fine. I'm just one potential customer and as I really respect your licenses and won't just go on and download any of your work, I'm here to speak about what can be done to improve it.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by M1AU View Post
            I don't think just answering back will make anything better. If you really want to find out how it turns out, you most likely have to make a test. Maybe it turns out exactly as you said, than you can easily go on with what you already have.
            Heh... What part of "different licensing" did you miss?

            Most of these situations, unless you're the rights holder, typically requires a specific licensing deal to do it- and seperate ones for different distribution means.

            Do a box version, that's one licensing deal.
            Do a download, that's another completely different one.

            In both examples you used, the rights holder is the one doing the publishing. LGP is not the rights holder for anything other than a specifically distributed version of a Linux port of a given title.

            When you decide that it's not worth a try, I'm fine. I'm just one potential customer and as I really respect your licenses and won't just go on and download any of your work, I'm here to speak about what can be done to improve it.
            Preaching to the choir here. I'm just a consultant.

            As it stands, if it weren't for what the Pandora project potentially offers, I'd probably slowly part ways with LGP and just handle doing the game porting on the sly completely as a hobby.

            Today's not been a good day for me, I think. I'm getting a bit tired of fielding stuff from people that:

            1) Don't get it.
            2) Don't want to get it.
            3) Think they're entitled to anything they want
            4) Think that mouthing off about it being "bad" will fix it

            Couple that with the DRM decision Michael Simms made today and all the reactions that people came up with, not realizing they were lending credence to the claims he made in the statement, just makes me feel tired beyond words.

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            • #36
              People, please. Before you post your fickle-minded comments and razor sharp remarks, search the forum. These topics have been gone discussed ad nauseum.

              I certainly don't like every thread on Sacred de-evolving to very nasty remarks, but you guys... BAH! Everytime I visit here, my blood boils.

              Search, read the posts and if you have remarks continue THAT thread. I can't be bothered to repeat and repeat what has been said.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
                Heh... What part of "different licensing" did you miss?

                Most of these situations, unless you're the rights holder, typically requires a specific licensing deal to do it- and seperate ones for different distribution means.

                Do a box version, that's one licensing deal.
                Do a download, that's another completely different one.

                In both examples you used, the rights holder is the one doing the publishing. LGP is not the rights holder for anything other than a specifically distributed version of a Linux port of a given title.
                I of course have to say I missed that yes.
                It's than worth to talk with those right holder.

                Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
                Preaching to the choir here. I'm just a consultant.

                As it stands, if it weren't for what the Pandora project potentially offers, I'd probably slowly part ways with LGP and just handle doing the game porting on the sly completely as a hobby.

                Today's not been a good day for me, I think. I'm getting a bit tired of fielding stuff from people that:

                1) Don't get it.
                2) Don't want to get it.
                3) Think they're entitled to anything they want
                4) Think that mouthing off about it being "bad" will fix it

                Couple that with the DRM decision Michael Simms made today and all the reactions that people came up with, not realizing they were lending credence to the claims he made in the statement, just makes me feel tired beyond words.
                I, as a potential customer do get one thing which matters for me the most, it's still a high price for an old game.
                I for some reason do think that you, as a consultant, don't get it or don't want to get it. From where I'm from we have a saying "The customer is always right".
                Also if you cannot stand positive criticism than I'm sorry, but you will probably just fail, at least at customer support.

                Originally posted by niniendowarrior View Post
                People, please. Before you post your fickle-minded comments and razor sharp remarks, search the forum. These topics have been gone discussed ad nauseum.

                I certainly don't like every thread on Sacred de-evolving to very nasty remarks, but you guys... BAH! Everytime I visit here, my blood boils.

                Search, read the posts and if you have remarks continue THAT thread. I can't be bothered to repeat and repeat what has been said.
                Seriously, I'm not going to search for a thread I'm not aware of to necromance it when a new hot topic which just started exists.

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                • #38
                  Fine. Just be informed of what has been said already. Me, I'll just stay away from the forums for a while. These threads are starting to get annoying.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by M1AU View Post
                    I for some reason do think that you, as a consultant, don't get it or don't want to get it. From where I'm from we have a saying "The customer is always right".
                    Uh... The customer is largely right (there are exceptions to "The customer is always right"...if you've never encountered them, you're lucky and blessed beyond words...)- the problem isn't that you're not right, it's that what you're talking about is about three times more difficult than you think. The games industry doesn't work in a common sense type fashion- and you're trying to apply common sense.

                    If I had a say in matters (I don't- I'm not the publisher...) I'd DO what you suggest if the rights holders would let me. I suspect LGP is in the same boat as I would be, though. Keep that in mind...

                    Also if you cannot stand positive criticism than I'm sorry, but you will probably just fail, at least at customer support.
                    It's not that I or LGP can't stand positive criticism- your idea is bang up and what I'd try to do myself. But...the industry does NOT work the way you think it does. It's not as simple as saying, "well, let's just offer it up for download." I've tried to tell you this, and there seems to be some disconnect between what I think I'm telling you and what you appear to be reading. Moreover, if you're remarking on today's stuff- what I'm talking about ISN'T constructive in the slightest. It's more bickering about things- some cases of bickering about things that some people ought to have known better about.
                    Last edited by Svartalf; 06-23-2008, 08:04 PM.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by niniendowarrior View Post
                      Fine. Just be informed of what has been said already. Me, I'll just stay away from the forums for a while. These threads are starting to get annoying.
                      You're telling me...sigh...

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by niniendowarrior View Post
                        Fine. Just be informed of what has been said already. Me, I'll just stay away from the forums for a while. These threads are starting to get annoying.
                        You can't let things like this get on your nerves if it aggravates you it is best to just avoid the thread/posts for better or worse. I do find though that blowing someone head of in ET:QW or Nexuiz helps to reduce the annoyance!

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Svartalf View Post
                          Uh... The customer is largely right (there are exceptions to "The customer is always right"...if you've never encountered them, you're lucky and blessed beyond words...)- the problem isn't that you're not right, it's that what you're talking about is about three times more difficult than you think. The games industry doesn't work in a common sense type fashion- and you're trying to apply common sense.

                          If I had a say in matters (I don't- I'm not the publisher...) I'd DO what you suggest if the rights holders would let me. I suspect LGP is in the same boat as I would be, though. Keep that in mind...


                          It's not that I or LGP can't stand positive criticism- your idea is bang up and what I'd try to do myself. But...the industry does NOT work the way you think it does. It's not as simple as saying, "well, let's just offer it up for download." I've tried to tell you this, and there seems to be some disconnect between what I think I'm telling you and what you appear to be reading. Moreover, if you're remarking on today's stuff- what I'm talking about ISN'T constructive in the slightest. It's more bickering about things- some cases of bickering about things that some people ought to have known better about.
                          Well you're right, I don't have an idea about the game porting industry (how should I?), but I do have an idea about purchasing games, especially linux games, also I do see the other part of the so called industry and that are all those independent game studios and a few bigger one out there. S2 Games, Introversion Software, Hothead, Frictional Games, ID, etc. they all seem to make it right. I purchased games from almost all of em for an appropriate price, so someone like me just have to guess that LGP doesn't make there homework.

                          Now you told me that the whole linux game porting industry is simply fakked up and no one can do anything about it, least of all the customers.
                          Well, I get it, but now that I'm aware of that fakked up porting industry, I'm not sure if I really want to invest my money into a moribund industry.

                          Good luck, though.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by M1AU View Post
                            S2 Games, Introversion Software, Hothead, Frictional Games, ID, etc. they all seem to make it right. I purchased games from almost all of em for an appropriate price, so someone like me just have to guess that LGP doesn't make there homework.
                            Considering that you're naming off direct rights holders- the people who own the rights and self-publish, or have enough pull to do whatever they damn well please outside of the contract for the Windows/MacOS versions, it's a simpler thing to for them "get it right". Moreover, they've chosen to DO it right- they're the EXCEPTIONS to the rule, not the norm.

                            I provide this statement as an insight into things in this space. If all the studios worth messing with would do this on their own, I could provide hired gun services and the situation with LGP would be more like a real publisher- where they're handling the QA, front-line support, etc. for the titles, and not doing the porting stage for themselves. This would end up being the vision you're describing- and it'd be a nirvana to me.

                            Now you told me that the whole linux game porting industry is simply fakked up and no one can do anything about it, least of all the customers.
                            Well, I get it, but now that I'm aware of that fakked up porting industry, I'm not sure if I really want to invest my money into a moribund industry.
                            Actually, the whole fakking game industry's largely fubared if you want the truth of the matter. It's not the porting side that's just fakked up as you put it. Doesn't matter if it's Linux or MacOS on the porting side (but the MacOS community haven't been going on about "Old titles" and whatnot for the longest time...wonder why...)- and the only worthwhile companies producing stuff seem to mostly be the ones on your list...go figure...

                            It's a short term problem, mind, with the problem with the Linux Game Porting space of the whole Game Industry. Each title leads to a slightly better one in most cases- a bigger and better deal as you're "trusted" with a bigger piece. It all breaks down when nobody's interested in the second tier stuff and insist upon AAA and A titles out of the gate for everything (Understandable, really...) and don't get that you have to get the B titles first and show they'll sell before you get the bigger toys.

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                            • #44
                              When am I to expect this on the torrent trackers?

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                              • #45
                                Protection key system test when LinuxGamePublishing is offline.

                                To all those who wanted to know whether the key system for LinuxGamePublishing would still allow game play if the central servers went down, I can give you an answer from the beta testers.

                                Yes - you can continue to play on games using this key system if the central key management server is down. The ISP for LinuxGamePublishing recently jacked their rates by a factor of three, prompting a server move. Joy-of-joys British Telecom has dropped the ball and LGP is currently left with a SITREP cover page only. Which is a perfect opportunity to test the key system without the key manager being around.

                                Cheers,
                                Toby Haynes

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