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Unreal Engine 4 Released, Source Code For $19 + Linux Support

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  • #16
    Originally posted by uid313 View Post
    Good choice of them to make Unreal Engine available on GitHub (albeit private), and to make it this cheap.

    Because Unity have gained a lot of popularity among hobbyists because its cheap and easy to get.

    Perhaps Unigine and CryEngine should follow suit?
    I wonder, does that make UE4 open source? It kind of is, but kind of isn't.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by blackout23 View Post
      I wonder, does that make UE4 open source? It kind of is, but kind of isn't.
      I think in general open source means having the source under an open source license.

      I am wondering anyway who would contribute back, assuming that source is under copyright and eula, so you would be working for Epic for free...

      Still very interesting for indie devs imho.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by log0 View Post
        I am wondering anyway who would contribute back, assuming that source is under copyright and eula, so you would be working for Epic for free...
        For same reason why companies contribute to Linux kernel: because it's expensive to support own branch of engine and it's easier to push some features into mainline so it's Epic will support this code in future.

        Also keep in mind that % of budget spend on programming is pretty small in game development. Most of money going into assets creation so for studious/publishers that's don't have middleware licensing business it's not critical to return some changes to Epic.

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        • #19
          So it was true afterall that this generation was the last game console generation

          Just kidding. But just as Android eventually took over the market from iPhone, SteamOS will eventually also take over the market from consoles.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by blackout23 View Post
            I wonder, does that make UE4 open source? It kind of is, but kind of isn't.
            No it doesn't. Open source requires the source to be publicly available, not just to a select group of people. Also, open source entails the permission for anyone to redistribute a modified version.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by _SXX_ View Post
              For same reason why companies contribute to Linux kernel: because it's expensive to support own branch of engine and it's easier to push some features into mainline so it's Epic will support this code in future.

              Also keep in mind that % of budget spend on programming is pretty small in game development. Most of money going into assets creation so for studious/publishers that's don't have middleware licensing business it's not critical to return some changes to Epic.
              I don't think you can compare it with linux kernel (which has an open source license that encourages contribution). I also would think that games would stick with a certain engine version, due to time and budget constraints, so that possible patch maintenance should be trivial. Some guesswork on my side here of course...

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              • #22
                Originally posted by blackout23 View Post
                I wonder if supporting Mac OS X actually makes sense if you keep in mind that the latest version is being limited to OpenGL 4.1 which is 4 years old.

                Compute Shaders etc. only work with 4.3 and higher as far as I know.
                Furthermore, os x performance sux compared to Linux.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by log0 View Post
                  I also would think that games would stick with a certain engine version, due to time and budget constraints, so that possible patch maintenance should be trivial.
                  Many development studious and publishers use Unreal Engine not for one particular title, but for multiple and in same time they want to use latest version of engine because it's benefit performance that extremely important on consoles.

                  They don't really care about sharing their code because they can't sell it anyway and code don't actually give any advantage to competitors because code it's not that important for games. Game development industry is pretty open related to sharing of knowledge, you can check SIGGRAPH as example.
                  Last edited by _SXX_; 03-19-2014, 07:35 PM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by _SXX_ View Post
                    Many development studious and publishers use Unreal Engine not for one particular title, but for multiple and in same time they want to use latest version of engine because it's benefit performance that extremely important on consoles.

                    They don't really care about sharing their code because they can't sell it anyway and code don't actually give any advantage to competitors because code it's not that important for games. Game development industry is pretty open related to sharing of knowledge, you can check SIGGRAPH as example.
                    Still they don't share the code or collaborate openly. And again, given the low budget for programming and time constraints, why should anyone even care to contribute back to the engine (and then have to pay to be able to ship that code, which even more funny). That is pretty much the only thing I am questioning here, I don't see how this open development is supposed to work.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by log0 View Post
                      Still they don't share the code or collaborate openly.
                      Algorithms is everything while code is useless outside of project. Game development companies have no real interest in open sourcing whole code while some bits of in-home proprietary engines are useless. Before all AAA engines like EU had extremely strict agreement that nothing can be shared and now with Epic initiative it's become basically possible.

                      Originally posted by log0 View Post
                      That is pretty much the only thing I am questioning here, I don't see how this open development is supposed to work.
                      It's not open development at all. It's just ability to push some features or bug fixes into mainline.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by log0 View Post
                        Still they don't share the code or collaborate openly. And again, given the low budget for programming and time constraints, why should anyone even care to contribute back to the engine (and then have to pay to be able to ship that code, which even more funny). That is pretty much the only thing I am questioning here, I don't see how this open development is supposed to work.
                        Yeah, you're missing the point.

                        The point is that major companies can push their changes back upstream, which reduces their work. That way they don't have to port all their patches to each new version that comes out.

                        I don't think anyone is expecting much real development to come out of this, in terms of moving the engine forward. It's just a convenience thing for their customers.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by _SXX_ View Post
                          Also keep in mind that % of budget spend on programming is pretty small in game development.
                          Maybe for some games, like an adventure game using a pre-built engine, but definitely not true for others. In my experience itís more like 30%-50% programmers in the dev team, sometimes more.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
                            Yeah, you're missing the point.

                            The point is that major companies can push their changes back upstream, which reduces their work. That way they don't have to port all their patches to each new version that comes out.

                            I don't think anyone is expecting much real development to come out of this, in terms of moving the engine forward. It's just a convenience thing for their customers.
                            That, plus once changes are accepted into mainstream Epic is pretty much obligated to support those changes, since they have accepted them in first place.

                            It might not be big, but it is a way to offset maintenance const to tech provider.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by log0 View Post
                              I don't think you can compare it with linux kernel (which has an open source license that encourages contribution). I also would think that games would stick with a certain engine version, due to time and budget constraints, so that possible patch maintenance should be trivial. Some guesswork on my side here of course...
                              Compare it to Qt or LLVM then. Or just trying to upstream kernel developments vs keeping downstream patches. In the end, it is what pushes corporations contributions in open source projects: reducing the burden of maintenance. That's what they get out of it, they don't do it "for free".

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                              • #30
                                Question: If one company create a game written in HLSL, there will be enforced by the engine a compatibility layer like GLSL bytecode or source extensions, that will allow the D3D renderer to be seen by an OpenGL driver, or not? There will be dead cases between a D3D renderer and an OpenGL one? It will allow MS friends to play with as adding overhead, or it will stop unnecessary shader compilations and will move Api calls inside shaders to offload Cpu work into the Gpu? Will it be a previous century "MS slave" garbage, or something new? Any game engine that allows for a closed source game to be compiled non JIT (for a specific Cpu architecture) is an "Intel slave" garbage anyway.

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