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  • #91
    Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
    Not exclusively, no.



    Anandtech benches Shogun 2 Total War, the exact game you cite, on a Intel HD 4000, which is a laptop integrated graphics chip, at quite playable rates. And that article is from 2012. 2013/2014 laptop hardware is even better.

    http://www.anandtech.com/show/5771/t...770k-review/12

    No, I'm not implying that these games don't exist.
    I'll quote the article:
    "Turning our settings down to medium, and thereby reverting to DX10 functionality, Ivy Bridge picks up some performance. 26fps still isn't good enough to reach the 30fps mark"
    26 fps at medium quality and 2/3 resolution isn't playable... Yes, one day, an APU will be enough, but the developer of this game most certainly did not target laptops when designing the game.

    Regarding the Mac argument: it's completely irrelevant. Today, most games are not played on PC, consoles or handhelds. They are played on smartphones. The main reason is that there are more smartphones than anything else, people always have them with them, and because most people only do "casual gaming", which have approx zero hardware requirement.
    Does this means that console gaming is/will be irrelevant? No. Because people buy consoles for games that are not available on more limited platforms, and developers sell these games.
    This is the same with PC gaming. As I said before PC gaming does not mean "games that you can play on any platform but you choose to play on your PC". That would be just gaming. Thus, is is not farmville or angry birds or candy crush. That's casual gaming, and it's pretty much irrelevant for PCs: these games are not developed with PCs in mind, and PCs are not bought to play these.
    PC gaming consists consist of the same type of games than consoles (most of them are console ports), and there is no reason that an EA or an ubisoft survey would turn much different from the steam one, ie a majority of desktops. (And it doesn't really matter if most people have notebooks: most people do not play games other than the casual category).

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    • #92
      Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
      This is ridiculous. Apple charges slightly more than the major Windows laptop brands. It fluctuates depending on what configuration you want, but no way can you get a comparable Windows laptop for a third the price of an Apple laptop.
      Not in the Netherlands. http://tweakers.net/pricewatch/33635...enbord%29.html

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      • #93
        Originally posted by erendorn View Post
        As I said before PC gaming does not mean "games that you can play on any platform but you choose to play on your PC". That would be just gaming. Thus, is is not farmville or angry birds or candy crush. That's casual gaming, and it's pretty much irrelevant for PCs: these games are not developed with PCs in mind, and PCs are not bought to play these. PC gaming consists consist of the same type of games than consoles (most of them are console ports)
        You don't personally own the term or set the definition for what "PC gaming" is and is not. Many people consider facebook games and Flash games and web games to fall under "PC gaming" and it is gaming on a PC.

        Didn't you start your post by saying that "PC gaming" shouldn't include multiplatform games, but then say that PC gaming is mostly console ports?

        Originally posted by erendorn View Post
        and there is no reason that an EA or an ubisoft survey would turn much different from the steam one, ie a majority of desktops. (And it doesn't really matter if most people have notebooks: most people do not play games other than the casual category).
        I suspect MMO players often play more on laptops. Most Blizzard players, including Diablo, Starcraft, and Wow, choose laptops.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
          You don't personally own the term or set the definition for what "PC gaming" is and is not. Many people consider facebook games and Flash games and web games to fall under "PC gaming" and it is gaming on a PC.
          By definition, games in your web browser are not PC games, but web browser games. They are not made for the PC architecture, but the web architecture -- which applies to any device that can access a web browser.


          Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
          I suspect MMO players often play more on laptops. Most Blizzard players, including Diablo, Starcraft, and Wow, choose laptops.
          I suspect you don't know anything about 'MMO players' as they are primarily the recipient of desktop gaming. All of the games you listed are played best with a high resolution monitor, a special MMORPG-style mouse, and a keyboard with as many programmable keys as possible, and a fast RJ45 connection to reduce latency as low as possible -- latency means everything in MMOs and FPSs, and is not something you can get from a laptop. Of all the people I've seen that play MMOs, almost none of them have a laptop. Only amateurs use a laptop for PC gaming.
          Last edited by mmstick; 03-10-2014, 12:33 PM.

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          • #95
            Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
            I suspect MMO players often play more on laptops. Most Blizzard players, including Diablo, Starcraft, and Wow, choose laptops.
            And again you suspect something and then in the next sentence present it as a fact without backing it up with any sources. Come back when you actually have something to support your position.

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            • #96
              Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
              You don't personally own the term or set the definition for what "PC gaming" is and is not. Many people consider facebook games and Flash games and web games to fall under "PC gaming" and it is gaming on a PC.
              Please search "PC gaming" on google and tell me what you see. Note that google tries to reflect the views of its users in its results, in other words, what "many people consider".

              Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
              Didn't you start your post by saying that "PC gaming" shouldn't include multiplatform games, but then say that PC gaming is mostly console ports?
              Indeed. Consoles do compete with PC gaming in this area (high requirements, high investment, high quality games), and a move of market shares from PC game sales to console game sales would effectively mean that PC gaming is dying.

              Consoles compete with PC, and Android netbooks compete with PC, but only one of them actually compete with PC gaming.

              Originally posted by DanLamb View Post
              I suspect MMO players often play more on laptops. Most Blizzard players, including Diablo, Starcraft, and Wow, choose laptops.
              Possibly. But there are MMO on steam, so these players participate in the survey. If you have other / more specific data, I'd be interested to see it. But then, Starcraft 2 played like s**t on my laptop when it came out (but an high-end ultrabook should be largely enough today), and wow is a 2004 game, skyrim for example has slightly higher requirements.

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              • #97
                no

                Originally posted by mmstick View Post
                You know a lot of oddballs. Laptop gamers are people who are in a confused state -- they can't decide if they want a laptop or a gaming desktop so they waste an insane amount of money getting a gaming laptop only to use it like a gaming desktop. The best of both worlds is to buy a cheap energy-efficient laptop and then build yourself a gaming desktop -- save a lot of money.
                I only own a laptop currently.. bought it last summer for $830, and I need it for graduate school. However, since I'm a gamer.. I also opted for a dedicated GPU. I have a geforce 740m in here and this morning I stared playing Metro: Last Light at full resolution with all graphics switches at low. It runs great.

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                • #98
                  Originally posted by Plagman View Post
                  We are working on a Pulseaudio feature which will let you passthrough when PA is running and other streams are connected; it will simply mute them for the duration of the passthrough. Expect it in an upcoming SteamOS update.
                  How is the progress on that? I there any piece of software that could be tested on systems different than SteamOS?

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                  • #99
                    http://cgit.collabora.com/git/user/s...77cb3abb36219a

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                    • Originally posted by caligula View Post
                      On top of that game distribution might need a single package manager. While all of them have advantages, the package management isn't a hard task. We could do better and have only one. One that also supports per user app installation so that you don't need to be superuser.
                      Docker will probably solve this (at least partially).

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                      • Thanks a lot! It's working like a charm.

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                        • Originally posted by M@yeulC View Post
                          Docker will probably solve this (at least partially).
                          Yes, let's run one of the most performance and latency dependant family software on a vm

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