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Valve's Gabe Newell Really Hates Windows 8

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  • #16
    Originally posted by log0 View Post
    Open platforms are great as long as you don't have to open yours...
    I was think exactly the same.
    OTOH, this is just another example of the myriad ways one can interprete "openess".

    Originally posted by log0 View Post
    I know, I know, I am asking for too much. The fact that there will eventually be access to ~2,500 games on linux is great on its own.
    Again, I have to agree.

    I'm not even sure why I don't have any objections against the Steam environment...
    Over the years I experienced Steam as very consumer friendly platform,
    although it is full of DRM (be it Steam or additional publisher DRM).
    The only real problem I see is: What happens with my purchased games (or better game licenses)
    if Valve/Steam becomes defunct at some point for the one or other reason?
    This question, obviously, has been raised many times.
    So far, I didn't came across an satisfying answer.
    Simply put - no one knows.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by AJSB View Post
      Some years ago (2-3) i showed Linux to some people and even installed it in their PCs (UBUNTU) and they loved it....no virus,
      *If* Linux goes mainstream, there will be viruses. Probably plenty of them.
      Not even considering compromised repositories and the like.
      Thinking of Linux as an inherently secure system is, at least, dangerous.
      It's not.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by entropy View Post
        *If* Linux goes mainstream, there will be viruses. Probably plenty of them.
        Not even considering compromised repositories and the like.
        Thinking of Linux as an inherently secure system is, at least, dangerous.
        It's not.
        I also thought of that ....but still, it's clearly more resilient than the virus-fest called Windows

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        • #19
          Originally posted by boitano View Post
          Steam gives you way more than a store; it's a great service tailored around games, with things like cloud storage for savegames, etc...
          Steam gives you a big community and connects you with your friends, it's somewhat like a LAN party over the Internet (I still prefer a real lan party though).
          A generic app store is nothing like that. No, I don't think Steam and Gabe are obsolete at all.
          Windows appstore gives you way more than a store; it's a great service tailored around games, with things like cloud storage for savegames, etc...
          Windows appstore gives you a big community and connects you with your friends, it's somewhat like a LAN party over the Internet.
          Windows appstore is not a generic app store its a full service this makes sure Steam and Gabe are obsolete on the windows platform.
          Now the obsolete "losers" try to get the old status quo back again by using linux as a substitute.

          Well its nice for Linux but only superficial because the "Openness" and "Freedom" is the complete opposite direction than DRM/Copy-protection in other words bondage and forced.

          Well well the future will tell us how the story ends.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by maldorordiscord View Post
            Its more than simple: The windows app store makes steam obsolete and this makes valve obsolete and this makes gabe obsolete.
            Now Gabe realize that fact that he is obsolete and his company goes bankrupt next year now he try to fix that.
            10 years ago there was no windows app store and gabe and valve don't give a fuck about Linux this means the only fact what force him to love linux is the windows app store.

            Its more than simple he loves Linux now because its the only way out of the Microsoft trap!

            Microsoft burned all thinks they have ever touched!

            Linux distributions have had a software distribution system long before windows 8 was in the making so how would that be relevant in any way. Just sounds like FUD.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by entropy View Post
              *If* Linux goes mainstream, there will be viruses. Probably plenty of them.
              Not even considering compromised repositories and the like.
              Thinking of Linux as an inherently secure system is, at least, dangerous.
              It's not.
              Not a chance to have Windows like viruses. Linux + OS X are quite popular and there are NON Windows like viruses.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by log0 View Post
                Open platforms are great as long as you don't have to open yours...

                I know, I know, I am asking for too much. The fact that there will eventually be access to ~2,500 games on linux is great on its own.
                Valve at least allowed Intel developers to take a look at L4D2 code to optimize their driver.

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                • #23
                  Well you basically know that the Intel OpenGL drivers are the slowest on Linux. Amd only optimizes OpenGL when they are forced - sometimes this takes ages - when you look at Rage. Hopefully they are faster this time. Basically it would not hurt providing OpenGL backends on Win as well like it was possible for the first source engine used by Half-Life. I would like to know why Valve does not just try to use that engine on Linux - maybe combined with a free game to try or so. L4D2 is certainly an interesting title but i am pretty sure much more games could be ported easyly to Linux.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by kraftman View Post
                    Not a chance to have Windows like viruses. Linux + OS X are quite popular and there are NON Windows like viruses.
                    I highly doubt that the popularity of Linux + Mac OS provide a good reason yet to focus on these systems.
                    What are typical Windows-like viruses?

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by kraftman View Post
                      Valve at least allowed Intel developers to take a look at L4D2 code to optimize their driver.
                      I don't think it's unusual to let developers of graphics hardware see your code (at least partially)
                      if there are problems on code paths of the engine or to optimize the driver.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by maldorordiscord View Post
                        Well its nice for Linux but only superficial because the "Openness" and "Freedom" is the complete opposite direction than DRM/Copy-protection in other words bondage and forced.
                        I think it's good when games are open but I don't feel it's a necessity. Games are a bit different than productive programs. They are more like movies.
                        I start most programs to do something specific but I start games to be entertained and when I am done being entertained I quit the game and return to my normal programs.
                        What happens if I can't play a game anymore? I am less entertained.
                        What happens if I can't use one of my normal programs anymore? I can do less with my computer.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Yeah, I'm not really convinced games are the main thing which goes against linux adoption. I do believe it's mainly professional programs - Photoshop, Origin, OsiriX, AutoCAD, ChemDRAW, TopSPIN, Aspen and all that jazz which is used by professionals around the world.

                          Now, don't take me wrong. There are alternatives to some (GIMP, QtiPlot, GCU), but people usually don't want to exchange their program of choice for something else... Especially when there are format compatibility issues (which there are in the CAD softwares, or Origin).

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by PeterKraus View Post
                            Yeah, I'm not really convinced games are the main thing which goes against linux adoption. I do believe it's mainly professional programs - Photoshop, Origin, OsiriX, AutoCAD, ChemDRAW, TopSPIN, Aspen and all that jazz which is used by professionals around the world.

                            Now, don't take me wrong. There are alternatives to some (GIMP, QtiPlot, GCU), but people usually don't want to exchange their program of choice for something else... Especially when there are format compatibility issues (which there are in the CAD softwares, or Origin).
                            I don't think that there is something as bad as the situation with CAD software when it comes to linux.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by PeterKraus View Post
                              Yeah, I'm not really convinced games are the main thing which goes against linux adoption. I do believe it's mainly professional programs - Photoshop, Origin, OsiriX, AutoCAD, ChemDRAW, TopSPIN, Aspen and all that jazz which is used by professionals around the world.

                              Now, don't take me wrong. There are alternatives to some (GIMP, QtiPlot, GCU), but people usually don't want to exchange their program of choice for something else... Especially when there are format compatibility issues (which there are in the CAD softwares, or Origin).
                              Of all these i only use GIMP as a replacement for PhotoShop and then rarely....and i don't know of anyone that use them....majority of people with a PC doesn't need that stuff (even for "professionals" (whatever that means) not all need those types of tools and GIMP and LibreOffice , Thunderbird , Firefox and VLC,etc, will cover their needs) ....if majority of PC users don't use that stuff, they can't be the reason for Linux isn't popular.


                              Linux is not popular because majority of distro use a lot of command line and these days, people want a easy way to do things....or not to do them at all but let the OS do them for them by itself.

                              Games OTOH are hurting Linux for sure.

                              How many PC users don't play at least a game ?
                              How many PC users use AutoCAD ?

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                @PeterKraus

                                Thats incorrect. When you look at schools, what apps do they use? Mainly office, internet and some clever ones learn coding. It would not matter if they use Win or Linux for that. At home you find lots of consoles because you dont need to reinstall em all the time to fix a problem (basically this is not always the solution but it happens that many work still that way). Also tablets are used because ppl just want to use and not to think about everything. The Linux market for desktop is just a tiny one, the market for dedicated devices is much bigger. Just a matter of time, you will see... When you look at AAA titles - maybe with the exception of valve games - all run on consoles - so you have to port it to an existing one and pay for licencing or you have to create your own. Guess what valve wants to do? Maybe they will try to get their older games running on arm as well to create a cheaper console. The Linux desktop market is only a testcase not more not less. Also if you want to have competion you need at least 2 players. Nvidia you can forget until you want to use arm (not the worst idea btw). For x86 you have got amd + intel. Both provide cpu+gpu combinations - but at least Intel has lots to do get their drivers ready - i doubt that they will have it ready for haswell. ivy bridge is still too buggy on linux - it is really weird that intel devs do not work more closely with distributions like Debian to fix their stupid stability issues...
                                Last edited by Kano; 07-26-2012, 07:28 AM.

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