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Valve Software Finds Bugs With Linux Kernel

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ShadowBane View Post
    People don't get all worked up about..... /schedulers/filesystems,
    Lol, do a search on BFS, BTRFS and Rieser on the forums.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by ShadowBane View Post
      People don't get all worked up about Xorg/wayland/systemd/sys v init/upstart/schedulers/filesystems, why should they get worked up about the audio layer? Doesn't make any sense to me.
      Uhh, yes they do.

      There have been tons of flamewars about X/Wayland (no network transparency? X epically sucking?)

      systemd/upstart/etc. - init should be simple, red hat wants systemd to take over everything, ubuntu has NIH syndrome, etc.

      filesystems - ZFS? BTRFS? ReiserFS?

      schedulers - CFS vs BFS?

      It's simply what linux users do - complain on user forums.

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      • #18
        How exactly is this news? When someone reports a bug, we get an article? Seriously.... :-/

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        • #19
          Originally posted by RealNC View Post
          How exactly is this news? When someone reports a bug, we get an article? Seriously.... :-/
          This is a disguised "They're still hiring!" reminder. Everybody who's up to something new discovers bugs in upstream components. Now if the party starts proposing fixes upstream, that deserves some attention.

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          • #20
            Hm... I think in bigger terms, this article is a bit of an overstatement. I'm sure companies find problems in the Linux kernel all of time (just like they do in Mac and Windows!).

            I guess if anything was to be taken away from this, is that we have one that's specifically geared towards gaming that is throwing some weight around in getting fixes done?

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Vadi View Post
              Hm... I think in bigger terms, this article is a bit of an overstatement. I'm sure companies find problems in the Linux kernel all of time (just like they do in Mac and Windows!).

              I guess if anything was to be taken away from this, is that we have one that's specifically geared towards gaming that is throwing some weight around in getting fixes done?
              But its useless because only the nvidia blob gets fixed so only a small fraktion of people have something positiv from it...

              I would like to see a kind of sandbox, so that game blobs are still bad but at least not dangerous anymore... so native linux games without a sandbox are totaly uninteresting for me... at least till 90-99% of them work under linux, because if that would happen I would maybe install a special tainted linux for gaming on my gaming pc... and start that only for gaming, and it would use it like I use windows, as a big rootkit... than I dont have controll at all...

              maybe something like that could be done by a special kind of useraccount that only can call opengl commands and filters anithing else or at least all thats filesystemlike and give the game a fake filesystem where it can install its trojans and stuff... a bit like wine maybe... but then again if we use wine anyway because we dont trust companies which are only interested in making money, then we would not need steam anyway?

              again maybe I can switch my special gaming-only-windows-pc then against a gaming-only-special-linux-pc... I do not see the big advantage here, windows is not so bad that you cant start a game from it... for that its good enough...

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              • #22
                Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                I do not see the big advantage here, windows is not so bad that you cant start a game from it... for that its good enough...
                Windows is bad for alot of reasons, mainly the lack of competition in the marketplace. Alternatives need to get real foothold in the market otherwise stagnation happens. Add to that DRM and other tyrannic business activity that users cannot escape because they don't have any perceptible "choice" - Windows is bad for far more than technical reasons. There are people- extremely passionate and dedicated people out there, committed specifically to making Windows (and moreso- Microsoft) fall from its dominant position. They don't care what it costs them- job opportunities, money, whatever. THOSE kind of people- and there's a decent sized army of them. They're active for very good reasons (horse has been beaten to a bloody pulp)- but it really boils down to independence from Microsoft.

                Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                But its useless because only the nvidia blob gets fixed so only a small fraktion of people have something positiv from it...
                These are kernel fixes. It makes the most sense for Valve to test against NVIDIA in this case, despite being the highest common denominator- The other drivers will all improve as a result, to achieve compatibility with Valve supported titles.

                The NVIDIA blob is the best Linux driver out there- we need the same quality out of all the other drivers.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by kazetsukai View Post
                  The NVIDIA blob is the best Linux driver out there- we need the same quality out of all the other drivers.
                  Thats not true, it is good yes, and its fast... but its not based on linux stuff, its basicly a operation system in a operation system... it replaces basicly the hole xorg-grafics stack... but it would be possible to write a driver with the same speed and like we see from the free drivers more stable driver with using xorg+ mesa and co... even if it would become opensource, it just would not bring much for the other drivers, because its all hardcoded static stuff that is not seperated with hardware-independend parts and hardware-dependendend parts... like gallium as example does it. So yes its maybe the fastest driver and its a bit more stable (maybe?) than the blob from amd... but it lacks some X features and replaces much of Xorg which can cause bugs and even security holes...

                  and I dont know what you mean with quality did you see the source code or some documents that lets you belive that the code quality is better? at least its more unstable than the open drivers so thats a big indicator of quality for me...

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