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Nexuiz Gets Forked, Turned Into Xonotic

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  • #31
    The mechanism of forking and the GPL ensures tit for tat (you know, the idea behind capitalism). You can fork a project, but any improvements you make can be incorporated in the original code. So you get the benefits of forking (reviving projects), but not the drawbacks (leeching code). By assigning copyright, this mechanism is bypassed, and now they spent tat, but didn't get tit, so to speak. As I said, copyright assignment is something that happens in many many free software projects, and it's not morally intended to bypass the GPL, even though it does provide a loophole.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Joe Sixpack View Post
      Usually that logic would apply, but I guess you overlooked the part of his name that says "Nexuiz Project Manager". I guess hearing things directly from the horses mouth is considered stupid nowadays.
      I stepped down as "Nexuiz Project Manager" perhaps over a year ago. I have no connection whatsoever to console Nexuiz and no official title for GPL Nexuiz/Xonotic.

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      • #33
        Nexuiz has all kinds of content, being graphics, code, music, levels, and much more made by communitiy contributions. I doubt they went and got permission of all of them. I think the software freedom center should know about this:

        http://www.softwarefreedom.org/

        They can't just close all that work and begin charging for it.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by xav1r View Post
          Nexuiz has all kinds of content, being graphics, code, music, levels, and much more made by communitiy contributions. I doubt they went and got permission of all of them. I think the software freedom center should know about this:

          http://www.softwarefreedom.org/
          They are not using any community content and I'm confident no community code without permission will be in the final product.


          Originally posted by xav1r View Post
          They can't just close all that work and begin charging for it.
          They cannot and they will not.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by xav1r View Post
            Nexuiz has all kinds of content, being graphics, code, music, levels, and much more made by communitiy contributions. I doubt they went and got permission of all of them. I think the software freedom center should know about this:
            And I think you guys should, in the name of decency, stop spouting unfounded bullshit everywhere. Here, in the part of the net where people actually have a minimum of reading and comprehension skills, dudes are running out of facepalms.

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            • #36
              contribute SOME?

              couldn't they just contribute whatever changes they make to the engine that don't touch the platform compatible code? I haven't read the SDK agreement on the XBox and ps3 but Nexuiz is portable for a reason. The portability should be a result of good software engineering. If they could contribute anything back, it wouldn't reveal anything about the SDK code right? Its the closed source on the SDK that prevents them from releasing the game under GPL right? But they can still contribute back to the project if they can make it run faster or something else beneficial to the engine itself.

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              • #37
                I think LordHavoc already said that was happening...

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                • #38
                  Ok, so as a summary, let me see if i got everything correct:

                  -They are creating content for this new console game 100% brand new, by themselves. Theyre NOT using any of the content already in Nexuiz.

                  -They are using their own engine, or they bought a license from id for their new engine. This part I dont understand how it's possible, since id does NOT offer commercial licenses from the Quake 1 engine. They would need to use the quake 2 engine and onwards.

                  Is that correct?

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by xav1r View Post
                    Ok, so as a summary, let me see if i got everything correct:

                    -They are creating content for this new console game 100% brand new, by themselves. Theyre NOT using any of the content already in Nexuiz.

                    -They are using their own engine, or they bought a license from id for their new engine. This part I dont understand how it's possible, since id does NOT offer commercial licenses from the Quake 1 engine. They would need to use the quake 2 engine and onwards.
                    From reading the (seemingly) more informed posts here, I think this is slightly incorrect...

                    It looks like what they are doing is:

                    - Creating all new content.

                    - Creating all new "game rules".

                    - Using the Darkplaces engine and contributing back their modifications.

                    - Using the Nexuiz name which they bought from the legal owner.

                    Nothing too horrific there, in my opinion.

                    NOTE: I could have this completely wrong.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by RobbieAB View Post
                      From reading the (seemingly) more informed posts here, I think this is slightly incorrect...

                      It looks like what they are doing is:

                      - Creating all new content.

                      - Creating all new "game rules".

                      - Using the Darkplaces engine and contributing back their modifications.

                      - Using the Nexuiz name which they bought from the legal owner.

                      Nothing too horrific there, in my opinion.

                      NOTE: I could have this completely wrong.
                      It seems like they bought the Darkplaces engine, too, and they must have removed any code for which the copyright wasn't assigned to the founder. And they managed to get a license from Id. Otherwise I don't see how they can put a GPL engine (Darkplaces was released as GPL) derived from another GPL engine (Quake was released as GPL) on a console (which requires modifications to the engine to run, and those modifications can not be released as GPL).

                      The way I see it, if they have done all the things necessary to be able to sell this game at all, then they don't even have to contribute any code back, legally.

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                      • #41
                        SavageX has quite clearly stated that the Cg renderer has been contributed back to the Darkplaces engine, along with the tightened up memory behaviour. Whether you actually need to modify the engine to play nicely with the joypad I don't know. It wouldn't surprise me to discover you can write a wrapper for the Joypad to make it appear as a regular keyboard/mouse combo to the engine though.

                        Overall, I'm not sure what other modifications are actually needed in a properly portable code-base, given a capable compiler. IF you are so sure there is a smoking gun, I would suggest you cite references to support it.

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                        • #42
                          I don't have an explicit reference for it, but I hope we can all agree that the Playstation 3 SDK is not GPL compatible. That means a PS3 game can't be released as GPL, and that means all those legal steps I mentioned in my previous post need to have happened. That means they don't have to give any code back.

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                          • #43
                            GPL compatability only matters if they link to it.

                            So where is the GPL violation if they write a program in the SDK to translate the Joypad input and feed that to the engine as keyboard+mouse input?

                            On the Cg front, clearly it is legal, as otherwise you wouldn't be allowed to use proprietry openGl drivers from GPL applications. I don't see anything that has to actually violate the GPL.

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                            • #44
                              That sounds fishy to me. But let's suppose the new Nexuiz engine really is released as a GPL program on the PS3. That means they will either ship the machine-readable code on the Bluray, or they will give customers a written offer for 3 years to request the code. Let's see if that happens.

                              That would be awesome news by the way.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by mitch074 View Post
                                ...change Phoronix' Nexuiz benchmarks to 'Xonotic', then have all packages at all distributions switch Nexuiz to Xonotic the firt time there is a release.

                                I wonder how long it'll take Debian to kick Nexuiz out when they learn that the name is no longer free to use...
                                Probably not long at all to remove the nexuiz packages and then package the xonotic ones.

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