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Lennart Poettering Takes To Battling Systemd Myths

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  • #61
    Originally posted by danielbot View Post
    It should not be a goal at all. Having the udev maintainer and systemd maintainer be the same person is a recipe for disaster.
    It is not the goal of the Linux kernel community to abolish Udev. Systemd developers only can make some interesting offers in this regard.
    Untenable situation in my opinion. Obviously, the temptation to leverage udev to accelerate the demise of systemd competitors must be strong, and chances are, irresistable.
    How about then the last turmoil about udev and firmware?

    The result was doing some more directly in the kernel. Thus to minimize the complexity of Udev once more. Shouldn't it be the other way round if they conspire by utilizing Udev to promote Systemd:
    They should instead widen the use of Udev and its complexity just to make us more dependend ...

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    • #62
      Message to all the idiots

      Ok neckbeardos so Lennart busted all your myths. Too bad for you. Now STFU and accept your new master. Systemds adoption has reached critical mass by now and in a short while only a few sys'd refuseniks will remain and die out like the dinosaurs.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by ChrisXY View Post
        He didn't push pulseaudio down everyones throat. Ubuntu decided to be an early adopter and packaged a less than ideal config and so it became the quasi-standard way too early.

        Also, if someone creates multiple projects which end up being picked up for the default configuration of most bigger distributions because it works better than the alternatives chances are, you're not more intelligent than him.
        You've apparently never visited any major distro's bugzilla.....

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        • #64
          Originally posted by funkSTAR View Post
          Systemds adoption has reached critical mass by now
          Any numbers on that? As far as I know, Ubuntu is still by far the most used distro.

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          • #65
            I think one of the sources of discontent with systemd might be this http://www.pappp.net/?p=969

            NOT UNIX way of doing things

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            • #66
              Originally posted by funkSTAR View Post
              Too bad for you. Now STFU and accept your new master.
              This is the new face of Linux development, folks.

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              • #67
                Originally posted by log0 View Post
                I think one of the sources of discontent with systemd might be this http://www.pappp.net/?p=969

                NOT UNIX way of doing things
                im just gonna quote myself from the new systemd thread...

                Originally posted by Ericg View Post
                Here's the problem I have with people saying that. "systemd" isn't just 1 binary. Its about 20. When you say "systemd" now youre actually talking about a collection a binaries, a suite of binaries designed by 1 team with the purpose of providing low-level functionality for a linux-based system. It isn't one giant binary doing 20 things. Its 20 binaries with the expressed and explicit purpose of working together with the other binaries of the suite.

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Ericg View Post
                  im just gonna quote myself from the new systemd thread...
                  and pingufunkybeat brings it to the point:
                  And this wouldn't be a problem if they weren't moving towards ONLY working together with other binaries of the same suite.

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                  • #69
                    Fair enough. Requote:

                    Originally posted by Ericg View Post
                    That varies depending on what you're talking about. Journal and syslog work fine together. Systemd's timejobs and cron work fine together (only two I think of that provide direct competition). inetd was replaced by $service.socket files, which i think is fairly logical since its still process management. loginctl is the official successor to consolekit, so thats their fault for giving up on their project *shrugs* If you can think of more, go ahead and post them, more than happy to go through them all one by one and we can figure out EXACTLY what systemd "works with" vs has a "scorched earth" policy about.

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by log0 View Post
                      I think one of the sources of discontent with systemd might be this http://www.pappp.net/?p=969
                      NOT UNIX way of doing things
                      From your link this list:
                      ---
                      1 Small is beautiful.
                      2 Make each program do one thing well.
                      3 Build a prototype as soon as possible.
                      4 Choose portability over efficiency.
                      5 Store data in flat text files.
                      6 Use software leverage to your advantage.
                      7 Use shell scripts to increase leverage and portability.
                      8 Avoid captive user interfaces.
                      9 Make every program a filter.
                      ---
                      1. systemd < sysv-init,cron,syslog,xinit,dbus
                      2. systemd has a little extra bin for each of above
                      4. portability was an unsolved issue in unix ancient times when every instance of a mainframe computer had its incompatibility in every aspect - unix philosophy was just an unsuccessful attempt of the big players to overcome their own problem. This issue is solved since decades. In times there are billions but not only a handful of computers the efficiency is most important!
                      5. Database theory is prior and more important: store every data once! This is not effectivly possible using text files. Despite this fact: Every text file is a binary in times of multi-cultural Unicode.
                      7. Systemd shell scripts are known as unit files in an extra simple language better fitting its purpose
                      8. I never saw a gui of systemd.
                      Last edited by ulenrich; 01-28-2013, 02:06 PM.

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