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  • #16
    Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
    Wow, people still care about murderFS?
    Time to let it die. If I was in charge of upstream, I'd just tell them to drop dead if/when submitted. The big distros aren't going to include it either way (bad association), otherwise if there was actually anything particularly useful about it, they would have picked up development on it.

    I really don't see what the big deal about this is. Just let it die already. Not every bit of code is destined for the linux kernel. Most code dies, and the only reason anyone even remembers THIS dead code, is because of its CRIMINAL ASSOCIATION.
    Reiser4 had some very cleaver mechanisms that haven't been replicated by any other FS out there. As I mentioned before the intelligent data compression was the reason I moved to it. There is little reason for good code to die

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Azpegath View Post
      I disagree.
      Saying you disagree without saying WHAT you disagree with suggests that you're just being a douchebag and probably haven't even read what you're disagreeing with.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by FireBurn View Post
        Reiser4 had some very cleaver mechanisms that haven't been replicated by any other FS out there. As I mentioned before the intelligent data compression was the reason I moved to it. There is little reason for good code to die
        Its obsolete code being dragged along by diehard fans of a convicted felon. There is nothing special about it. Compression isn't even that useful on the filesystem level -- most large file types already incorporate compression, word processor documents, videos, audio, images.... everything that will actually consume a significant amount of space is *already compressed* -- double compression just eats cpu time without benefit. Partition level compression is obsolete, and even in the very RARE case where it makes sense, easily worked around. There is no need for the filesystem itself to include compression, leave that to somewhere else.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
          duhhhhhh
          Grow up........................

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          • #20
            Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
            Wow, people still care about murderFS?
            Time to let it die. If I was in charge of upstream, I'd just tell them to drop dead if/when submitted. The big distros aren't going to include it either way (bad association), otherwise if there was actually anything particularly useful about it, they would have picked up development on it.

            I really don't see what the big deal about this is. Just let it die already. Not every bit of code is destined for the linux kernel. Most code dies, and the only reason anyone even remembers THIS dead code, is because of its CRIMINAL ASSOCIATION.
            Steve Jobs comes to hell and sees Steve Ballmer there, standing knee-deep in the blood pool.
            SJ: "What the ack are you doing here?"
            SB: "Im standing here as punishment for the people and careers which I destroyed".
            ...
            SJ: "Where is Bill?"
            SB: "Right here, Im standing on his shoulders."


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            • #21
              Is there any advantages to reiserfs anymore? Now that we have ext4 and btrfs?

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              • #22
                If ReiserFS ever wants to get included into the kernel, the first step would be to fork and rename it to something other then Reiser. As long as it has that name to it, it will forever remain the bastard child. I know it sounds like a stupid reason but it will continue to carrry the "murderer" stigma.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                  If ReiserFS ever wants to get included into the kernel, the first step would be to fork and rename it to something other then Reiser. As long as it has that name to it, it will forever remain the bastard child. I know it sounds like a stupid reason but it will continue to carrry the "murderer" stigma.
                  As much as it pains me to agree with you (we've had our differences in the past), that is absolutely right. But equally unlikely. I think its gone past the realm of filesystems now, it has become a tribute to reiser and is only still being given life support for just that reason.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                    If ReiserFS ever wants to get included into the kernel, the first step would be to fork and rename it to something other then Reiser. As long as it has that name to it, it will forever remain the bastard child. I know it sounds like a stupid reason but it will continue to carrry the "murderer" stigma.
                    So if Torvalds kills his wife Linux will be a crap operating system not worth using???

                    At least i like to think that the kernel people responsible for inclusion or not have much more brain than someone who cant separate people/person from "products/technologies".

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
                      So if Torvalds kills his wife Linux will be a crap operating system not worth using???
                      No, the murder isn't what made it crap. The DECAY made it crap (by modern standards).
                      If Linus decided to murder his wife (you have any idea how rare that is? Not even worth worrying about, Linus is a GOOD GUY, unlike Reiser, who was a total douchebag from day 1), the fact that he was the overseer rather than the "whole project" means that it will continue. The fact also remains that the Linux kernel is NECESSARY, whereas murderfs is not -- nobody uses it, nobody would lose a fortune because it suddenly vanished. The only people who stand to gain from this are reiser himself and his fans who "continue his work in his absense". There are so many differences between the two that it is impossible to know where to begin on this.

                      At least i like to think that the kernel people responsible for inclusion or not have much more brain than someone who cant separate people/person from "products/technologies".
                      This is a difficult one to point out. You must realize that there ARE people who would support the position that technology developed through crimes, especially SEVERE ABNORMAL INHUMAN crimes, like cruelty, murder, experimentation on people against their will, etc., should be discarded. I know how unreasonable that sounds, but it is a position taken by a huge number of people. In the very least, one would have to break the association.

                      However, in this particular case, the filesystem itself is.... not so impressive. It may have been impressive back when it was conceived, but not now. There is certainly nothing revolutionary about it.

                      IMO, the best way to deal with murderfs is to take all pieces of it that actually *make sense* (if any), and incorporate THOSE CONCEPTS into other filesystem projects... like EXT4 or BTRFS. There is no need to deify a murderer by incorporating his life's work into something as **GOOD** as Linux.

                      I think we can all agree that knowledge is a good thing, but I do also believe that you can take and apply the knowledge without the reference implementation.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                        unlike Reiser, who was a total douchebag from day 1
                        I prefer to think of him more as a "nutjob". The boy clearly didn't have all his marbles.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
                          So if Torvalds kills his wife Linux will be a crap operating system not worth using???
                          It really has nothing to do with its capabilities. Linux isn't LinusOS either but yes it is probable that if Linus did such a thing that it would retain a distasteful stigma that would hurt adoption. It's just like why the US did not carry on the V-2 name into the Redstone series of rockets despite it being a clear decedent of the V-2 and even had the same scientist in charge of the program. A brand carries a lot of weight in peoples perceptions.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                            A brand carries a lot of weight in peoples perceptions.
                            I know and what keeps surprising me everyday is the stupidity of people around me and in general.

                            The technical side of ReiserFS and how good, bad, modern or whatever can be and should be debated (i am not the one to do that) and argued as much as possible. What Hans Reiser did -or what kind of person he is- is something that has nothing to do with the tech and as i said its pretty stupid to connect the two things. Things like that CAN happen.


                            Originally posted by droidhacker
                            This is a difficult one to point out. You must realize that there ARE people who would support the position that technology developed through crimes, especially SEVERE ABNORMAL INHUMAN crimes, like cruelty, murder, experimentation on people against their will, etc., should be discarded. I know how unreasonable that sounds, but it is a position taken by a huge number of people. In the very least, one would have to break the association.
                            I wasn't trying to generalize. The fact remains that ReiserFS is not a "product" developed by murdering someone and neither Hans is a sub par programmer because of the murder. The murder just happened.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by bwat47 View Post
                              Is there any advantages to reiserfs anymore? Now that we have ext4 and btrfs?
                              reiserfs (v3) still has some advantages. ext4 is still hampered by some of the ext2 structure... so dynamically growing ext4 is just not going to be all that fast when done dynamically... and (IMHO) it may not even be possible in certain situations.

                              But, regardless, if maintenance of reiserfs v3 isn't done anymore, it will eventually die off due to code aging.

                              For now, maintenance continues for the SUSE enterprise variants.

                              Ext4 is NOT a revolutionary step.

                              Btrfs might be, but remember, it's Oracle driven... and Oracle isn't on anyone's "nice list" for Christmas.

                              Variable, variable, variables.... I think there's room for a few more filesystems... and there are some out there. They just need to get some more traction (support)... maybe that's Reiser4 (without Hans)... maybe it's ocfs2 (Oracle again) or nilfs2 or other.... who knows?

                              I think we're all banking on btrfs right now... but I do worry a bit of the Oracle-ness of that one....

                              I think a NinaFs might be an interesting filesystem to create....

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                                I prefer to think of him more as a "nutjob". The boy clearly didn't have all his marbles.
                                I prefer to look at him as an insane genius. And like most males, the ability to be almost schizophrenic at will. There's the genius code nerd Hans, and there's the Hans that kills when convenient.... two sides (at least).

                                Even today, he's trying to get his sentenced lightened because "genius nerd" Hans is wanting desperately to take ideas into reality.... but he made a HUGE error with regards to human life... and so, genius or not, he must serve time and it should be painful. He caused a lot of pain. Is he "stupid"? No. I don't think so. I think he's very, very, very confused when it comes to juggling multiple elements of his own life. When focused on something that is not "murder"... I think he's great. Let's face it, even with regards to murder (cover up), he wasn't a genius. It's not really his strength. He's now trying to get a retrial... but how can you convince a jury you didn't do it when you eventually led police to the spot where the body was buried? I feel sorry for Hans.... but not terribly so. He certainly points out all that can be bad about being human... while also show the good points as well.. sigh....

                                So.. kudos to the "genius nerd"... and shame on the Hans that does not value human life.

                                Hint to future filesystem developers... love your wife!

                                nuff said.

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