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  • OpenSUSE Looks To Switch To Btrfs For Next Release

    Phoronix: OpenSUSE Looks To Switch To Btrfs For Next Release

    With today's release of openSUSE 13.1 Beta has come some more interesting news about the future of the German-founded Linux distribution: they're hoping to switch to the next-generation Btrfs Linux file-system as their future default file-system...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTQ2NTY

  • #2
    Originally posted by phoronix View Post
    Phoronix: OpenSUSE Looks To Switch To Btrfs For Next Release

    With today's release of openSUSE 13.1 Beta has come some more interesting news about the future of the German-founded Linux distribution: they're hoping to switch to the next-generation Btrfs Linux file-system as their future default file-system...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTQ2NTY
    OpenSUSE is not a conservative distribution...i hope they will aim for Wayland support in the next release as well along with btrfs.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
      OpenSUSE is not a conservative distribution...i hope they will aim for Wayland support in the next release as well along with btrfs.
      Actually openSUSE is usually conservative on their releases. They never make last minute changes to package versions on a planned release after the freeze date even though newer versions would appear before the goldmaster date. PulseAudio and systemd are an excellent examples of openSUSE's policy of not pushing "the new fad" until it matures. They will offer them as an optional install but stick to the tried and tested until their replacements are in good shape.

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      • #4
        btrfs seems to be still unstable according to amount and severity of bugs reported to kernel bugzilla

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        • #5
          Originally posted by JS987 View Post
          btrfs seems to be still unstable according to amount and severity of bugs reported to kernel bugzilla
          That needs much more data to assert. What bugs and is there any comparison with how other filesystems are doing?

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          • #6
            Originally posted by RahulSundaram View Post
            That needs much more data to assert. What bugs and is there any comparison with how other filesystems are doing?
            Unexact comparison:
            bugs reported last 12 months according to https://bugzilla.kernel.org/query.cgi
            btrfs - 79
            ext4 - 26

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            • #7
              Could eventually be the next distro for new users.

              OpenSuse has always had the potential to be the next big Linux distro due to its ease of installation and long term support. However, here is a small list of reasons why I passed over OpenSuse (it mostly had to do with the way their repositories are split up)

              • I get that Yast is different (and that's not a bad thing) but installing common applications that are needed right away is not a friendly way to teach new users how to add Yast repositories.
              • Installing a different version of KDE that didn't come with the installation requires to match up several repositoires. It isn't intuitive at all. Why would you want to only update KDE applications only when the next big point release has quite a number of Plasma Workspace fixes? Plus, it seems pointless now that Plasma 1 is in maintaince mode.
              • It seems that the rolling release is actually a repository that depends on a stable installation. Also, users need to reinstall properiary graphic drivers themselves if they use Tumbleweed (thankfully, I have Intel hardware).
              • The milestones releases works differently then most distros. They seem to contain their own repository and don't seem to update at all until the next milestone release. For instance, if one milestone comes out a week before a beta 2 version of some software comes out, you have to wait three weeks for the next milestone to come out in order to get it.

              If a user on this forum can explain what I did wrong or what I missed when it came to OpenSuse's repositories, I would really appreciate an answer. Also, I think that OpenSuse should come out with a true rolling release model to compete with the fact that Ubuntu is "always stable" at any point in its release now.
              Last edited by CTown; 09-19-2013, 12:52 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by CTown View Post
                OpenSuse has always had the potential to be the next big Linux distro due to its ease of installation and long term support. However, here is a small list of reasons why I passed over OpenSuse (it mostly had to do with the way their repositories are split up)

                • I get that Yast is different (and that's not a bad thing) but installing common applications that are needed right away is not a friendly way to teach new users how to add Yast repositories.
                • Installing a different version of KDE that didn't come with the installation requires to match up several repositoires. It isn't intuitive at all. Why would you want to only update KDE applications only when the next big point release has quite a number of Plasma Workspace fixes? Plus, it seems pointless now that Plasma 1 is in maintaince mode.
                • It seems that the rolling release is actually a repository that depends on a stable installation. Also, users need to reinstall properiary graphic drivers themselves if they use Tumbleweed (thankfully, I have Intel hardware).
                • The milestones releases works differently then most distros. They seem to contain their own repository and don't seem to update at all until the next milestone release. For instance, if one milestone comes out a week before a beta 2 version of some software comes out, you have to wait three weeks for the next milestone to come out in order to get it.

                If a user on this forum can explain what I did wrong or what I missed when it came to OpenSuse's repositories, I would really appreciate an answer. Also, I think that OpenSuse should come out with a true rolling release model to compete with the fact that Ubuntu is "always stable" at any point in its release now.
                I'm fairly new to Linux but I've ended up on Opensuse. I'd very much like to support a default distro. Ubuntu is clearly beyond the pale: Unity, Upstart, Mir plus the spy ware business. So I'm interested in your critique. Do you think Opensuse are open to reason? Opensuse seem to cut a good balance between Stability and cutting edge.
                Last edited by Rich Oliver; 09-19-2013, 01:36 PM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by JS987 View Post
                  Unexact comparison: bugs reported last 12 months according to https://bugzilla.kernel.org/query.cgi btrfs - 79 ext4 - 26
                  Well the feature set isn't comparable so a raw count doesn't mean much especially if you are just looking at bugs reported vs confirmed. Also most of the bugs are not reported in the kernel bugzilla anyway.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    From linus' git, also known as 3.12-rc1+ (a version later than what OpenSuse is shipping):

                    Btrfs is highly experimental, and THE DISK FORMAT IS NOT YET
                    FINALIZED. You should say N here unless you are interested in
                    testing Btrfs with non-critical data.
                    Does that sound stable or finished to anyone?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by curaga View Post
                      From linus' git, also known as 3.12-rc1+ (a version later than what OpenSuse is shipping): Does that sound stable or finished to anyone?
                      That configuration snippet needs to be updated. The more current status update is at https://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page "The filesystem disk format is no longer unstable, and it's not expected to change unless there are strong reasons to do so. If there is a format change, file systems with a unchanged format will continue to be mountable and usable by newer kernels. The Btrfs code base is under heavy development. Every effort is being made to keep it stable and fast. Due to the fast development speed, the state of development of the filesystem improves noticeably with every new Linux version, so it's recommended to run the most modern kernel possible. "

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by CTown View Post
                        If a user on this forum can explain what I did wrong or what I missed when it came to OpenSuse's repositories, I would really appreciate an answer. Also, I think that OpenSuse should come out with a true rolling release model to compete with the fact that Ubuntu is "always stable" at any point in its release now.
                        Have you tried any recent opensuse?

                        one click - it cant get any simpler
                        most common repos can be found in the community repo list. Select what you want and go.
                        if by chance you need a custom repo it usually comes down to a single url.

                        Originally posted by RahulSundaram View Post
                        "The filesystem disk format is no longer unstable ... The Btrfs code base is under heavy development
                        Seem to be conflicting statements. How can it be stable with expectation for minimal changes, but yet be under heavy development, which suggests many changes. Maybe they were better saying actively developed. Im skeptical right now to move from EXT4 to BTRS.
                        Last edited by Pickle; 09-19-2013, 02:16 PM.

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                        • #13
                          BTRFS for openSUSE 13.2!!!!

                          You discuss, as if they want to make it default for 13.1
                          I think you misunderstood the artikle, as I did in the first place. Read again. Talk is about switching to BTRFS for 13.2 not 13.1. The suse-news is clear on that:
                          "A discussion has been going on about making this future-oriented file system the default on the next openSUSE. That won’t be but btrfs is still a prominent option during installation so any relevant testing and bugfixing will benefit many openSUSE 13.1 users. And, more importantly, we aim for having it default in the future."
                          https://news.opensuse.org/2013/09/19...1-beta-is-out/

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Pickle View Post
                            Seem to be conflicting statements. How can it be stable with expectation for minimal changes, but yet be under heavy development, which suggests many changes. Maybe they were better saying actively developed. Im skeptical right now to move from EXT4 to BTRS.
                            It means the format on disk is stable (and compatible between releases) but the code in the kernel is changing a lot. The same way you can define a stable h.264 format years ago, while constantly updating the x264 project code to add improvements.

                            Basically, it means that you may run into bugs (or more likely bug fixes/enhancements) with all the changes going on, but it shouldn't become incompatible or completely stop working just because of a kernel update.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You can also just put your critical data for example your $HOME under a different partition using ext3/4 and the rest (/) under btrfs and play with it and help with the testing process. For my desktop workload it's been perfectly stable so far.

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