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Debian Switches Back To GNOME From Xfce

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  • #16
    Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
    Also I hate that wayland stuff that will probably break my desktop more often than X does.
    So you're passing judgement on a technology that you haven't used?

    p.s. alt-tab is your friend. and beside of that, previously you had to go to a border and click the application, now you have to go to a corner and click the application. a trmordous big difference. i feel for you......
    It's amazing how much hate people have for different DEs, to the point where they see the rather minor differences between them as vast gulfs. I'm not a massive fan of KDE, but I don't really feel the need to go on the internet to slag it off, and call people who do prefer it idiots. 'Linux community' is an oxymoron.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Detructor View Post
      I love it how people say that Gnome3 is 'shit' and at the same time not giving one reason why it's 'shit'.

      Well, you may not like it, that's your own fault, sucks to be you. Gnome 3 is brilliant. It doesn't matter if you want to only use your keyboard or only use your mouse or use both, in all cases you can control the entire DE.

      Oh, but please stop comparing Gnome 3 to that stupid, commercial, data selling whore they call Unity. Thanks.
      Oh, you were doing so well, and then you go and do to Unity the same you're accusing others of doing to Gnome 3. Tsch, tsch...

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      • #18
        You guys should cool down and try to put more wisom in your life. You can never go wrong with more wisdom.

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        • #19
          Doesn't the recent gnome require systemd to be functional? How are they going to get around that?

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          • #20
            Originally posted by kaszak View Post
            Doesn't the recent gnome require systemd to be functional? How are they going to get around that?
            The dependency on systemd is increasing for sure. Debian can change the default in the future if they feel like. Having gnome as default covers whezzy for now. The future is unclear. Gnome will for sure end up being tied to systemd. So in reality it is not gnome which need to be accepted as default but systemd.

            Systemd is linux only and is not default at Ubuntu so nothing is future proof.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by funkSTAR View Post
              The dependency on systemd is increasing for sure. Debian can change the default in the future if they feel like. Having gnome as default covers whezzy for now. The future is unclear. Gnome will for sure end up being tied to systemd. So in reality it is not gnome which need to be accepted as default but systemd.

              Systemd is linux only and is not default at Ubuntu so nothing is future proof.
              From what I've seen (Debian users), a lot of people don't want systemd to be a default.
              1. When it breaks a system it's much harder to unbreak. On a server that needs 99.9999% uptime, this is a potential nightmare.
              2. Doesn't support, and the devs of systemd have said they will likely never support... anything other than the Linux kernel. Attempts were made to get systemd to work on other kernels besides Linux and these patches were REJECTED by upstream. So systemd is almost a form of Linux kernel "lock-in". Debian needs to support the kFreeBSD kernel as well and it's a lot simpler to choose something that works on everything than maintain two different standards for the boot process (by default). If systemd could ever work with kernels other than Linux, then it's far more likely to be the default in Debian.
              3. The performance gains of systemd quickly evaporate if the system is booted from an SSD.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
                Yes it is a tremendous difference for fuck's sake! When I write code for android I have an eclipse window (or netbeans) and an android emulator window. I like switching between them fast. Alt tab works but it sucks when I can't reach the keyboard or don't want to (sometimes I read in bed from a distance on a laptop and it's annoying to reach the keyboard when I can use the mouse). Going to a corner and them finding your window in the list is fucking annoying. With a taskbar I see where the damn program lies easier and can switch directly (plus I always have them in an order so that I don't actually have to look at where they are, I know where to go). It is faster stop argumenting that it isn't!
                1) You are saying that you use eclipse only with a wireless mouse sitting far from your desktop? My congratulations, i'll never be able to do that!
                2) There is the "dash to dock extension" that solves entirely your problem (i say this for others, i know you'll answer with the "i don't want to use an extension blah blah" refrain, in fact i assume you are using compiz alone or KDE with no panels, plasmoids etc.)
                3) Please, learn how to troll proper, you are very boring

                p.s. no, i'm not a gnome shell fan, i use KDE.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
                  Yes it is a tremendous difference for fuck's sake! When I write code for android I have an eclipse window (or netbeans) and an android emulator window. I like switching between them fast. Alt tab works but it sucks when I can't reach the keyboard or don't want to (sometimes I read in bed from a distance on a laptop and it's annoying to reach the keyboard when I can use the mouse).
                  wait, you say it is a temendous differnce when you write code for android etc. but alt+tab is not an option when you can't reach your keaybord.
                  how do you code for android mouse only?

                  now when you indeed arn't in need of a keybord and use mouse only...
                  Going to a corner and them finding your window in the list is fucking annoying. With a taskbar I see where the damn program lies easier and can switch directly (plus I always have them in an order so that I don't actually have to look at where they are, I know where to go). It is faster stop argumenting that it isn't!
                  in BOTH cases you have a list of running programms, in BOTH cases you have to find it and click on it. The ONLY difference is that on gnome shell it takes a fraction of a second to get to the list first.

                  but wati! in gnome shell you see your windows additionally to the list just in front of you , easy to identify as down scaled windows.

                  sure it is an additional edge you have to go around but don't tell me it is that of a tremendous issue.
                  i can accept that it is not your taste and thus do not like it. but what you are trying to make out of it is simply stupid!

                  this is what you come up definding your gnome shell is shitty statement? if that's all please just shut up. you are just hilarious!

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                  • #24
                    but Gnome is a TROLL !

                    silly little scared Debian, who used to have guts, but now they have none, M$ wins, so go to gnome forget xfce ?
                    ..., and that sums up Debian, including their eventual, and cowardly shift to "systemd", in a nutShell.
                    Last edited by scjet; 11-11-2012, 01:38 PM.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by scjet View Post
                      silly little scared Debian, who used to have guts, but now they have none, M$ wins, so go to gnome forget xfce ?
                      ..., and that sums up Debian, including their eventual, and cowardly shift to "systemd", in a nutShell.
                      I doubt Debian devs will be keen to switch make systemd default anytime soon. It gets in the way of their kFreeBSD port, and they already have a decent custom init. And they still have Upstart(lol) as an option ;p

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by freedam View Post
                        2) There is the "dash to dock extension" that solves entirely your problem (i say this for others, i know you'll answer with the "i don't want to use an extension blah blah" refrain, in fact i assume you are using compiz alone or KDE with no panels, plasmoids etc.)
                        The problem with extensions is that they are hacks which are tightly coupled to a version of GNOME.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Sidicas
                          1. When it breaks a system it's much harder to unbreak. On a server that needs 99.9999% uptime, this is a potential nightmare.
                          2. Doesn't support, and the devs of systemd have said they will likely never support... anything other than the Linux kernel. Attempts were made to get systemd to work on other kernels besides Linux and these patches were REJECTED by upstream. So systemd is almost a form of Linux kernel "lock-in". Debian needs to support the kFreeBSD kernel as well and it's a lot simpler to choose something that works on everything than maintain two different standards for the boot process (by default). If systemd could ever work with kernels other than Linux, then it's far more likely to be the default in Debian.
                          3. The performance gains of systemd quickly evaporate if the system is booted from an SSD.
                          1. The two biggest linux server service companies are betting their future billion dollars business on it. That is good enough for me. Im sure though that some basement powerusers are too leet to deal with this so the go 100% hipster and tell another story on phoronix. Well I guess Im gonna stick with the proven business succes here, sorry if that means Im less leet than you

                          2. Yes this is effectly a lockin on Linux. But what is wrong with that? Sure it hits a snag when debian is trying be distroing everything but the kitchensink.

                          3. Systemds fast boot is more than a gimmick. It will cause less down time in unforseen events and during upgrades. Thats fine but nothing special. Having fast boot is the prime feature for infotainment systems in eg. cars. When you start the car, you expect feedback within 3 seconds. That is easy on systemd. Go look at the documentation and tools. It is a pleasure.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by randomizer View Post
                            The problem with extensions is that they are hacks which are tightly coupled to a version of GNOME.
                            1. Some are coupled with a version of GNOME.
                            2. Same as all the millions of custom GUI's or additions in MMORPG and other games (I find this idea brilliant by GNOME btw.)
                            3. And other DE have these gadgets or widgets and other stuff they add onto the desktop?

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                            • #29
                              Gnome3 and SystemD

                              Hi *!

                              Gnome works quite fine without SystemD. I use Gnome 3.4 on gentoo and there is no trace of systemd installed at all.

                              BTW. From my point of view Gnome3 is faster than Gnome2 -- faster startup and faster to work with, as much more is controllable via keyboard. Hell, even application startup only requires a keypress less: <Windows> + the first few letters of the app + return. On gnome2 it was <Alt>+<F2> + first few letters + return after some (short) time period, until the list of apps was generated.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
                                Yes but if you like your mouse it's a king size pain in the fucking ass. Switching between applications with the mouse is so horrible.
                                I read the whole thread and all your posts. Yet, I don't see your point. Moving the mouse to the top left corner is fast and clicking a large thumbnail of a window is also fast due to it's size. If you want it really fast, however, use the keyboard. <Alt><Tab> is your friend. I know that you don't have your keyboard with you all the time. But what could you do what needs a fast window switching, but no keyboard input?

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