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Yahoo Pays Canonical, Now They're The Ubuntu Default

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  • #16
    Good for Canonical! They have done a great job and this seams like a good way to make money. I will continue to use startpage for my search engine though.

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    • #17
      Interesting news! I wonder though how much $.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by monraaf View Post
        I'll also stick with Google, not because I have anything against Bing. But simply because in my experience Google's search engine is better and more usable than the alternatives around.

        I do like to see some more competition though. Google is getting a little too big.
        Google is big, yes. But open-source friendly. Microsoft is bigger, and actively deters the development of open-source software.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by deanjo View Post
          Hmmm, this might provide motivation for google to switch to another distro as their "linux of choice" for development.
          That kind of was my thinking there too, deanjo...

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          • #20
            Originally posted by monraaf View Post
            I'll also stick with Google, not because I have anything against Bing. But simply because in my experience Google's search engine is better and more usable than the alternatives around.

            I do like to see some more competition though. Google is getting a little too big.
            What kind of competition? It seems to me that search quality is not the competition. Only Google is providing such high quality search results. If the "competition" is competing then they aren't doing it in a way that benefits the consumer. Not if they aren't competing in quality, cost, or some other consumer measurable benefit.

            As to the size of Google, what is the critical mass that makes an organization bad? I don't see how size is necessarily proportional to evil. There are plenty of bad organizations in every size bracket, big and small.

            I'm not seeing competition that's attractive to me and size doesn't always matter.

            It also seems to me that Bing and Yahoo would do better to start competing for more than just the default slot. Google made it to the top without having that benefit. I think that says a lot. It also seems like the default game is all that MS and Yahoo are interested in playing. It isn't working but that's all they seem to be interested in.

            On one hand I'm glad that Canonical can plunder some of the blunder. On the other hand I wish the blunder wasn't there at all.

            Edit: Another thought on size: Ubuntu is the biggest Linux. Does that mean they are also the evil Linux?
            Last edited by Jimmy; 01-26-2010, 11:33 PM.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Jimmy View Post
              What kind of competition? It seems to me that search quality is not the competition. Only Google is providing such high quality search results. If the "competition" is competing then they aren't doing it in a way that benefits the consumer. Not if they aren't competing in quality, cost, or some other consumer measurable benefit.
              The question is how often you try other search engines? This is the Yahoo chance to show that maybe they are not that hopeless. I'm willing to give em a try. Would be lazy to do otherwise. And if it helps Yahoo to survive longer I see it as a very positive thing.

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              • #22
                An interesting note:
                It's worth noting that Yahoo's data retention practices are more privacy-friendly than Google's. Yahoo search records are anonymized after 90 days, a practice that will continue in the future. Google, on the other hand, keeps the data for three times as long and has faced criticism for its allegedly inadequate anonymization.
                (arstechnica.com)

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                • #23
                  So in order to get a share of Ubuntu users' search revenue, Canonical Inc. will default existing and new users to Yahoo!?

                  Certainly Canonical Inc. is aware that Yahoo! has collaborated with eg. the Chinese regime and decent people are languishing in the regime's jails as a result. Yahoo's Chinese arm remains aggressively pro-regime and recently strongly attacked Google for siding with the users' rights.

                  Clearly Canonical's intent on getting a share of Ubuntu users' search revenue spoils trumps any consideration of human rights or common decency here.

                  Then there is the question of decency wrt. Mozilla's own revenue agreement with Google. Does simple very minor rebranding give Canonical the right to deny Mozilla their development revenue??

                  Finally there's the little issue of user experience. People are using Google search for a reason and the Mozilla default option has not been controversial. Especially for users of open source software Google seems very unbiased towards proprietary, let alone Microsoft's proprietary search results.

                  Yahoo!Bing?

                  For me Canonical's slippery slope came apparent when they decided to integrate Canonical's proprietary Cloud service, even deceptively named Ubuntu One (as if it was part of the great humane open-source effort), into Ubuntu Linux.

                  Are these compromises really necessary just so that Canonical can employ a couple of more developers to work on canonical projects?

                  Are the users' representatives in the Ubuntu Community council all "company guys"?


                  (Apologies if you're seeing a dup. Submitted this opinion to LinuxToday as well)

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                  • #24
                    Certainly Canonical Inc. is aware that Yahoo! has collaborated with eg. the Chinese regime and decent people are languishing in the regime's jails as a result. Yahoo's Chinese arm remains aggressively pro-regime and recently strongly attacked Google for siding with the users' rights.
                    And Google hasn't?

                    Changing the default search engine is two clicks away (literally), so just change it if you don't like it.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
                      And Google hasn't?
                      Hasn't what?

                      Collaborated with the Chinese dictatorship?

                      AFAIK the extent has been limited to censoring search results according to the Chinese Communist Party's whims (democracy, Tiananmen massacre, human rights, corruption, Tibet etc.) while informing the Chinese users that the results have been tampered with by the Party. Yahoo or MS-Bing never disclose what has been banned.

                      Google has refused to give the Chinese regime access to users' data, which is why they were targeted for spying and which is why they - unlike the other businesses which fully support the Chinese regime's information controls - actually spoke out.


                      Changing the default search engine is two clicks away (literally), so just change it if you don't like it.
                      Well imagine if Canonical took away Ubuntu users' choice to opt out from this boardroom deal altogether!

                      The previous arguments still stand. This is a fishy deal and done purely for dollars versus the users' expectations and experience, and against Mozilla who are unequivocally a far more important player for open source and software freedom than Canonical's rebadged Debian (although Ubuntu did initially start out by making all the right noises).

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by hanglekuk View Post
                        The question is how often you try other search engines? This is the Yahoo chance to show that maybe they are not that hopeless. I'm willing to give em a try. Would be lazy to do otherwise. And if it helps Yahoo to survive longer I see it as a very positive thing.
                        I try Bing from time to time. Since Yahoo will soon be Bing is there much of a point to trying Yahoo again? It's a lame duck that never really was that great (except when they were powered by Google of course). I have in fact tried Yahoo search many times over the years. Although they did have a number of other interesting offerings over the years, search just wasn't their cup of tea.

                        Some history: Yahoo->Altavista, then Yahoo->Google, then Yahoo->Altavista as an acquisition, and now Yahoo->Bing. Talk about a roller coaster.

                        Altavista was good when there was no Google.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by misGnomer View Post
                          So in order to get a share of Ubuntu users' search revenue, Canonical Inc. will default existing and new users to Yahoo!?
                          Seems fair to me. They are putting an OS together for you. It can be even claimed that they gave that extra step to bring linux to a broader audience. Changing the default search engine is pretty unintrusive, and you have the choice to change it later.


                          Certainly Canonical Inc. is aware that Yahoo! has collaborated with eg. the Chinese regime and decent people are languishing in the regime's jails as a result. Yahoo's Chinese arm remains aggressively pro-regime and recently strongly attacked Google for siding with the users' rights.

                          Clearly Canonical's intent on getting a share of Ubuntu users' search revenue spoils trumps any consideration of human rights or common decency here.
                          That's quite a stretch. You could also argue that Google is collaborating with tax dollars with the american government, and as a result hundreds of thousands are languishing dead in Iraq and Afganistan. You also know that Google collaborates with the chinese government, so your argument doesn't hold much.


                          Then there is the question of decency wrt. Mozilla's own revenue agreement with Google. Does simple very minor rebranding give Canonical the right to deny Mozilla their development revenue??
                          That is an interesting argument to debate. I don't know, in principle, since Mozilla has made a particular choice of license, nobody should be surprised about others taking the options that license offers and make changes as they see fit.

                          Finally there's the little issue of user experience. People are using Google search for a reason and the Mozilla default option has not been controversial. Especially for users of open source software Google seems very unbiased towards proprietary, let alone Microsoft's proprietary search results.
                          I don't think you can blame Ubuntu for not thinking about user experience. I myself don't agree with many of the choices they make, but I see where they're coming from. Changing the default seach engine is hardly an issue with regards to user experience. Again, you can change it if you don't like it.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Jimmy View Post
                            Edit: Another thought on size: Ubuntu is the biggest Linux. Does that mean they are also the evil Linux?
                            Carefull with that one. There are lots of crazy people in every community...

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                            • #29
                              Wow..

                              Ok - ubuntu is going downhill quick ... Now has me rethinking our linux strategy.. They do realize that yahoo will be powered by Bing (MS) eventually? LAME.

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                              • #30
                                an interesting decision. Quick to note, canonical likes money and actually wants to make it. A very risky move they are making.

                                I dont think they will have much of a problem changing back to google at any time should they need to.

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