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Ubuntu 13.10 Desktop Tests: Unity 7.1, KDE 4.11, Xfce 4.10, GNOME 3.8

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  • #31
    Originally posted by johnc View Post
    To me, Unity resembles OS X more than Windows 8. A very very buggy and inconsistent and ugly version of OS X.
    Say what you will about Ubuntu, at the very least you can't crash it by going سمَـَّوُوُحخ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ امارتيخ ̷̴̐خ .

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    • #32
      Originally posted by bwat47 View Post
      I do tech support for an ISP, so I deal with lots of average users. Most people could grasp the basics of the windows 7 interface alright, but everyone I've talked to that uses windows 8 gets utterly confused with the whole "switching between metro and classic desktop" thing, and not the metro interface itself. Having two totally different interfaces that get switched between often is very confusing and inconsistent. Another big issue metro has that gnome-shell or unity don't have is the fact that all [metro] apps are forced to run fullscreen, and can only be run from within the start screen (zero integration with the desktop) which annoys many people. With unity and gnome-shell you still run familiar windowed apps, that all run in the same environment and everything is well integrated. There is no bizarre switching between two totally different desktop interfaces, and having apps that only run in a certain "special" interface or any nonsense like that with gnome 3 or unity.

      I also wish people would stop saying unity and gnome-shell are "touch optimized" and not desktop optimized. Unity 7 is totally desktop optimized and not very touch friendly at all. have you ever tried to use unity on a touchscreen? Unity is a hell of a lot more keyboard and mouse friendly than touch friendly. The upcoming unity 8 will be far more touch optimized though, but the plan is for unity 8 to have a 'desktop mode' that works like unity 7 afiak so it should work as well on the desktop as unity 7 does, and as I mentioned I certainly wouldn't call unity 7 "touch optimized". Gnome-shell isn't very good on touchscreens yet either (although it is something they are working on), and like unity gnome-shell is very keyboard friendly and right now its a lot more 'desktop friendly' than 'touch friendly'. I use gnome-shell on my laptop and I like it much better than windows 8. I ran windows 8 for a few months on my gaming desktop but ended up going back to windows 7.
      Someone should build a Metro theme and some relevant Metro applets that mimic's W8 exactly. That way, we can all sit around the fire espousing the virtue's of Linux DE's with actual apples to apples arguments =D

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Charlie68 View Post
        In the end it always comes back to talk about Unity, this means that like it or not is crucial. I think Unity is one of the best Shell, I could not help it, dash and hud are fundamental for me. I am happy the tests and I hope that these Unity best ever.
        Yeah I have to agree. I wanted to prefer KDE because I like QT and the tight integration of their apps but I find that every time I install it I begin to tweak it to look like Unity. I can get pretty close but I still end up missing things like the HUD and meta keyboard shortcut. (QT doesn't allow you to use the meta key alone for binding) I still play with KDE/Gnome from time to time but it would take a lot of change to draw me away from Unity.

        I'm glad to know that I'm not sacrificing performance to use the desktop environment that I enjoy and that I find to be the most productive. I wish it was a supported option on OpenSUSE or Fedora, since I like using zypper/yast/yum/OBS, but I'm not surprised that it's not available due to all the patched gnome packages required to get it working.

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        • #34
          QUOTE=mrugiero;354550]Unity/GNOME-shell, the touch optimized but not so for an actual desktop UI.[/QUOTE]

          STOP SAYING THAT! Seriously, I'm so tired of that. Have you actually used GS with a touch device? I have, many times, and it's just not usable. W8 is so much better at being touch friendly it's not funny. I'm not trying to be a sick about this only trying to get people to stop spouting something that is just incorrect. Now if you want to say their intention was make it touch optimized you'd haves a stronger case.
          The sad thing is that GS isn't optimized for either paradigm... it's just a bit of a mess, but it wouldn't take a huge effort to salvage it.

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          • #35
            kde

            why my favorite kde sucks so much?
            i dont feel that it is a slow desktop
            im running it on my old p4 32 bit processor with 1Gb ddr1 ram pc with all default effects enabled and it is doing very well
            :-(

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            • #36
              Originally posted by mrugiero View Post
              Which is the common point with Unity/GNOME-shell, the touch optimized but not so for an actual desktop UI.
              Yeap, as mentioned, Unity is by far not touch-optimised. For instance, you can't use the scrollbars if you use it with a touchscreen. At all. Because the scrollbars are 2 pixels wide and you need to hover your mouse on them to get a scroller widget (good luck hovering with touch!).

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              • #37
                Aren't you supposed to scroll via gestures when using a touch screen?

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by smartalgorithm View Post
                  why my favorite kde sucks so much?
                  i dont feel that it is a slow desktop
                  im running it on my old p4 32 bit processor with 1Gb ddr1 ram pc with all default effects enabled and it is doing very well
                  :-(
                  well that's because it's not really, the issue appears to be:
                  #1. Michael used Xrender as opposed to Raster which is the standard and better Qt Backend,
                  #2. Oxygen and the related GTK themer apparently have some significant overhead issues that other Qt theme engines such as QtCurve don't have..

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                  • #39
                    Looks like Michael has basically used the defaults that came with Kubuntu

                    Is xrender and oxygen the defaults on other KDE distros or is this specific to kubuntu?

                    If it is the default on other distros, when the real question is why are the KDE devs using non-optimized settings?

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                    • #40
                      really?

                      Originally posted by Luke_Wolf View Post
                      well that's because it's not really, the issue appears to be:
                      #1. Michael used Xrender as opposed to Raster which is the standard and better Qt Backend,
                      #2. Oxygen and the related GTK themer apparently have some significant overhead issues that other Qt theme engines such as QtCurve don't have..
                      what interesting is that i cannot feel any difference between xrender and qt backend ahahah

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by liam View Post
                        STOP SAYING THAT! Seriously, I'm so tired of that. Have you actually used GS with a touch device? I have, many times, and it's just not usable. W8 is so much better at being touch friendly it's not funny. I'm not trying to be a sick about this only trying to get people to stop spouting something that is just incorrect. Now if you want to say their intention was make it touch optimized you'd haves a stronger case.
                        The sad thing is that GS isn't optimized for either paradigm... it's just a bit of a mess, but it wouldn't take a huge effort to salvage it.
                        That's actually what I meant. The intention is that. Since they don't fit me, I don't use them. I only tried them a long time ago.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by fossy View Post
                          Is xrender and oxygen the defaults on other KDE distros or is this specific to kubuntu?
                          On my system, openSUSE 12.3, oxygen-gtk is the default for gtk themes, but the default Qt render mode is raster.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by smartalgorithm View Post
                            what interesting is that i cannot feel any difference between xrender and qt backend ahahah
                            How is that even possible? XRender doesn't support vsync, so you should be getting a crapload of tearing.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by fossy View Post
                              If it is the default on other distros, when the real question is why are the KDE devs using non-optimized settings?
                              The default is for GTK apps to use the Oxygen theme, because it blends in with the KDE theme as closely as possible. They could optimize it, but only by making the GTK apps look less like the KDE ones.

                              They obviously think that KDE users will primarily be using QT apps, and that blending in visually with that is more important than performance for any GTK apps the user might want to run.

                              The issue doesn't (necessarily) affect Qt/KDE apps - just GTK, so they probably aren't all that concerned about fixing it.

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                              • #45
                                Unity 7 Touch

                                Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
                                Yeap, as mentioned, Unity is by far not touch-optimised. For instance, you can't use the scrollbars if you use it with a touchscreen. At all. Because the scrollbars are 2 pixels wide and you need to hover your mouse on them to get a scroller widget (good luck hovering with touch!).
                                You can tap once on thin orange line, the handle appears, then you gan drag it anywhere you want.

                                or you can simply scroll by dragging the contents with two fingures (or one fingure if you set it up).

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