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The State Of PackageKit, AppStream, & Listaller

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Rexilion View Post
    To me, PackageKit is an equivalent of the AppStore for Linux. So? I think it's good. No one wants to be bothered by huge lists of packages containing libs and weird suffixes (-dev you say?).

    Seriously, what's the real difference between tapping on an icon to install AngryBirds, or clicking on an icon to install vsftpd as an FTP-server? They both install software the user is requesting. What is the latter (over)symplifying over the former?

    That said, I'm wondering how Gentoo is handling Packagekit with respect to useflags (haven't checked it out).
    PackageKit is a package manager abstraction. It's not bad by itself. I'm talking about things like Ubuntu Software Centre and the proposed openSUSE store.

    And oversimplificaton is important. For instance, YaST allows me to see the package size instantly. It also allows solving dependencies in a sane manner, instead of an all-or-nothing approach. That's important functionality and I don't want it to go away.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
      PackageKit is a package manager abstraction. It's not bad by itself. I'm talking about things like Ubuntu Software Centre and the proposed openSUSE store.
      Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
      And oversimplificaton is important. For instance, YaST allows me to see the package size instantly. It also allows solving dependencies in a sane manner, instead of an all-or-nothing approach. That's important functionality and I don't want it to go away.
      So? Provide an appstore with an 'advanced' button and presto!

      Besides, if you want (full) control. Go Gentoo (like I did).

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Rexilion View Post
        So? Provide an appstore with an 'advanced' button and presto!

        Besides, if you want (full) control. Go Gentoo (like I did).

        You don't have to switch whole god damn distribution and change complete mindset to install few packages or to just give you a little bit more information.For me Synaptic is ruler among them all but that's just me.I think it's a good point to simplify things and to make clear distinction between store and manager of packages.But nevertheless they all kinda suck at this.They all look horrible,not very usable for end user.

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        • #19
          Interesting, looking forward.

          Would like a stable package installation format and API.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by kUrb1a View Post
            You don't have to switch whole god damn distribution and change complete mindset to install few packages or to just give you a little bit more information.For me Synaptic is ruler among them all but that's just me.I think it's a good point to simplify things and to make clear distinction between store and manager of packages.But nevertheless they all kinda suck at this.They all look horrible,not very usable for end user.
            Take a look at Ubuntu's package manager. It looks really nice. Gives you the total size of each package, changelogs and version info. This is also the case for the updater.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
              I like my package managers just fine, thank you very much.
              Just because it's there doesn't mean you need to install or even use it. Are you implying that everyone should just forget about it since you don't want it? I hope not. That would be incredibly selfish and narrow minded.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by jayrulez View Post
                Just because it's there doesn't mean you need to install or even use it. Are you implying that everyone should just forget about it since you don't want it? I hope not. That would be incredibly selfish and narrow minded.
                Kind of lame, shooting first and asking questions later...

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by jayrulez View Post
                  Just because it's there doesn't mean you need to install or even use it. Are you implying that everyone should just forget about it since you don't want it? I hope not. That would be incredibly selfish and narrow minded.
                  Nope. I'm explicitly stating that I'm not a fan of the idea, with no other assumptions.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
                    I'm not talking about PackageKit. And I'm already using PackageKit, by the way. What I'm against is "app stores" (yay for copyright Apple terms?). They have useless features and way too simplistic interfaces. Package managers have worked just fine so far, I don't see the need for "app stores".
                    Oh. Well, I only ever use one app store. The Chrome one, where I get Chrome extensions and applications. It's very good IMO and I have nothing against it.

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                    • #25
                      You know what is the real problem with nearly all package formats? They are a chore to make. I have a real great load of respect to all the distros for packaging software. I have been using GNU/Linux for over 10 years now and I still can't wrap my head around making an rpm or deb of my own apps or scripts (seriously - the spec files have more code than some of my apps :-P ) (keep in mind that I'm only an amateur developer). I tried various other universal installers, but most of them are hard to use also (BitRock was pretty good, but that one is commercial). From what I've just seen Listaller isn't any better... Come on, can't we just agree on some packaging format that is effortless to create? :-P

                      I made 0install feeds/packages for my apps last weekend and the workflow is quite good despite some few annoyances (and there's a GUI app for making the package feeds!), so I'll stick with that for now.

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