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Fedora Proposal To Use Cinnamon Desktop By Default

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  • #71
    Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
    Actually, they are trying to make a similar move: Not to replace multi-monitor desktop with arm terminal touchscreens of course, but shifting the focus to consumer devices like tablets and smartphones and make desktop an afterthought. This shift in focus is clear for anyone even half-knowledgable of the industry...
    Desktop an afterthought? Where did you get that idea from? I gues you mean commercial operating system developpers. That means Microsoft and Apple. Well let me give you a wakeup call: these desktops are already very mature. The market that Apple created interest for with the iPad is the tablet market. That shit is new and requires a lot of attention. But that doesn't mean that desktops are an afterthought.
    Windows 8 has very specific desktop improvements, like:
    -More shotcut keys;
    -Better useability (tiling in multi-monitor setups, non-transparent theme, more space for icons in the taskbar, single point of all settings, better file-transfer dialog);
    -Userspace file system (useless for Metro).

    Apple flattened iMacs, came out with ultrabooks and high resolution displays, duplicated iOS advancements, better cloud integration and better backup.

    Afterthought my ass.

    You can like Gnome shell all you want. No one says that Gnome Shell isn't a nice GUI for its intended audience. We are simply arguing about its suitability as a workstation GUI. Fedora is not a tablet distro and is definitely NOT a casual desktop usage distro: It is a distro targeted at Power-Users and above and a testbed for Red Hat so its focus should be in productivity, not tablet and all-i-do-is-facebook-and-media kind of usage...
    Gnome shell isn't designed for tablets, just because it has a black taskbar on top. And secondly what exactly makes Mutter any less usefull than the number one productivity champion called Windows? Last time I checked, Windows didn't even feature multiple workspaces...

    As for Gnome 3 extensions, don't make us laugh, seriously... Most of them are useless and broken. And there are not many to begin with...
    That was not the point. I was debunking a bullshit statement claiming that Gnome devs try their best to make Gnome 3 uncustimizeable. That's clearly bullshit. Just because there aren't many good extentions because nobody likes to make them, does not change the fact that he's wrong.

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    • #72
      Originally posted by kickback999 View Post
      Gnome 3 is crap. It takes longer to do stuff like minimise a window or even select a new program to load.
      It is awful and it single handedly pushed back the Linux cause by a good 3 years.
      BYEBYE GNOME 3

      Due to gnome 3 I switched to CentOS and Sabayon MATE.
      Bad move by Fedora and I hope they put it right by moving to Cinnamon.
      My experience is the opposite. With Gnome 3, I never minimize any windows (there is no point in doing it). I launch any application in a fraction of a second by pressing one button, typing a few letters and enter. It only takes some time to get used to.

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      • #73
        Originally posted by jukk View Post
        I launch any application in a fraction of a second by pressing one button, typing a few letters and enter. It only takes some time to get used to.
        Funny. I've been launching programs like that for 12 years now.

        Is getting this functionality in 2013 really something to boast about? :P

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        • #74
          Originally posted by kickback999 View Post
          Gnome 3 is crap. It takes longer to do stuff like minimise a window or even select a new program to load.
          It is awful and it single handedly pushed back the Linux cause by a good 3 years.
          BYEBYE GNOME 3

          Due to gnome 3 I switched to CentOS and Sabayon MATE.
          Bad move by Fedora and I hope they put it right by moving to Cinnamon.
          If you don't like it, why spill hate on it. Its not like you are stuck with it. You can install any other desktop.

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          • #75
            Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
            Funny. I've been launching programs like that for 12 years now.

            Is getting this functionality in 2013 really something to boast about? :P
            I kindly replied to kickback999 and told him that it is possible to launch an application in Gnome in this way.

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            • #76
              Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
              Network transparency, object component model, semantic indexing, unified PIM storage shared between all your applications, standard components and APIs ready for rapid application development, consistent configuration mechanism for all your apps, consistent DBUS-based communication, etc. KDE and GNOME offer all these things because their aim is to provide a complete desktop environment, not just a WM and a panel.

              XFCE is a very basic desktop environment. Nothing bad with that, mind you. If you don't need the additional stuff a desktop environment provides, then you will be happy with lighter setups.
              Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
              Network transparency, object component model, semantic indexing ... consistent configuration mechanism
              ohh they're all brick-and-mortar features that add a lot of free value and synergy

              Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
              unified PIM storage shared between all your applications
              ew

              Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
              standard components and APIs ready for rapid application development
              Only matters to developers. Newb developers.

              Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
              consistent DBUS-based communication
              I guess I can give you that one, doesn't create any drawbacks for me personally, but I can see some people enjoying more expansive app/session intercommunication.
              Also, Xfce has been getting enhanced in this area with recent releases.
              Last edited by korrode; 01-25-2013, 07:43 PM.

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              • #77
                Originally posted by korrode View Post
                ohh they're all brick-and-mortar features that add a lot of free value and synergy
                No, they are features that some people like and want to have.

                I didn't say that YOU have to like them or care. KDE and GNOME have always tried to give you a consistent, complete desktop which allows you to do all your daily work efficiently. And the requirements for desktops have grown in the last 15 years. Some people like more minimalist stuff, and that's OK.

                Personally, I don't use most of that. But network transparency is a must-have feature, IMHO.

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                • #78
                  Originally posted by varikonniemi View Post
                  So back with F15 they decided to switch to GS, back in the day when touch screen laptops were nonexistent.

                  Now when even Microsoft ditched the traditional "desktop" paradigm in win8, now when touch enabled laptops/tablets are ubiquitous, now they say they want to move back to the traditional desktop.

                  WTF Fedora?
                  Are you serious? They don't plan to switch from gnome shell. Someone has written a proposal. The other proposal, that they should support bsd kernel was a parody on this proposal. No one take it serious besides some troll at phoronix forum...

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                  • #79
                    Originally posted by Akka View Post
                    Are you serious? They don't plan to switch from gnome shell. Someone has written a proposal. The other proposal, that they should support bsd kernel was a parody on this proposal. No one take it serious besides some troll at phoronix forum...
                    I don't think that they will move away from GNOME Shell, they are the main developer behind GNOME.

                    What is more telling is that other major distributions have moved away from it. Ubuntu and Mint, for example, and non-GNOME distros like Mageia and OpenSUSE are also gaining. Fedora is the only major distro where you get GS by default.

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                    • #80
                      Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
                      I didn't say that YOU have to like them or care. KDE and GNOME have always tried to give you a consistent, complete desktop which allows you to do all your daily work efficiently. And the requirements for desktops have grown in the last 15 years. Some people like more minimalist stuff, and that's OK.
                      It's just hard for me to see it that way. Prior to Xfce, the environments I spent the most time with were Fluxbox and Openbox, I feel non-minimalist enough as it is running Xfce.
                      I don't know what your 'daily work' entails, but Gnome, nor KDE, allow me to work any better than Xfce. I will say though, I do quite a lot of deviating from Xfce's default settings and a huge amount of modification to the panels to get them to the state i'm happy with, however, with only one exception, all theses changes are made through the GUI settings areas. (The one exception being the (still easy) task of making the "Run..." entry in the menu use gmrun instead of Xfce's built-in run dialogue. I usually launch my run dialogue with super+r anyway, but I still ofc want the menu entry to work too.)

                      Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
                      Personally, I don't use most of that. But network transparency is a must-have feature, IMHO.
                      When you say "network transparency", do you mean much other than easy ability to browse SMB shares?

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