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Fedora Proposal To Use Cinnamon Desktop By Default

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Roberto Dirksen View Post
    (Posted from my iPad mini, a post-PC device.)
    I'm trying to imagine you doing some serious work (like programming) on your post-PC device.

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    • #32
      Gnome 3 is very traditional and still follows the rules of the desktop metaphor.

      For example; if you don't organize your desktop and get piles of shit, stacked on top of each other. Just like in real life; you loose track of where your shit is going, and have to look under a pile of paper to see what's underneath. You can do this piece-by-piece (hitting the middle mouse button; I know, that's totaly a tablet thing) or by spreading your shit out all at once (top-left screen corner; also totaly Android).

      By the time your have figured out that you can actualy organize this with unlimited workspace (multiple workspace; soooo Windows Metro, I know), you don't have this problem anymore.

      Now I know that it is sooooo X.org that resizing windows isn't fancy-pants fence style programmed for synced screen updates, but what evahhhh...

      Now there is some room for improvement here; Gnome3 could realy benifit from more advanced tiling in Mutter 'n StuFF rIt3? But maybe then everybody is going to complain that it is sooo Windows 1.0... That would be an even worse thing than that stone-age commandline that is already making Linux look bad, as if it tries to copy DOS, but fails because they don't ever have the DIR command. My friend reads books and stuff and she told me to type ls -a, GOSH ohhhh... Mygod! They realy try to make things so complicated. NERDS! eeeeeellllll! No wonder nobody likes Lienucks!111

      ---

      I think I am gonna switch to oohbountu bcuz they copied Mac OS X better, because every1 nows Steve Jobs invented the dock.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by LightBit View Post
        I'm trying to imagine you doing some serious work (like programming) on your post-PC device.
        Don't strain yourself. Search for Diet Coda and Codea. This is just the beginning. I have no doubt people will be able to develop apps entirely on a tablet in a few years. Tablets will force software development to advance as well. The post-PC programming languages and tools will be much easier to use than what exists today.

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        • #34
          I just read that Gnome is bringing in a Classic Mode in the next release earlier today. Why would Fedora switch from Gnome to a fork that probably breaks some things when F19 will have a Gnome version that has a Classic Mode option for people that want something more like the Gnome 2 style? I am personally looking forward to more improvements to Gnome Shell myself. If I didn't like Gnome Shell though, I wouldn't expect everybody else to have to have to switch to my preferred desktop UI because I'm too lazy to change the default myself...

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Roberto Dirksen View Post
            Diet Coda and Codea.
            This is more annoying than Visual Studio.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Awesomeness View Post
              That's stupid because Cinnamon is a full-blown fork.


              Already done. That's what extensions are for.
              http://blogs.gnome.org/mclasen/2012/...happening-now/
              Actually Cinnamon isn't a full blown fork. Only mutter,nautilus, and gnome-shell are forked. The rest of Gnome 3 is the same for both. I am sure they can find a way to merge it if they try.

              As for my previous comment about Gnome-shell users being casual, i didn't mean that it is not possible to use it for productivity. Just that it is less effective at it.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by kigurai View Post
                If you don't like some piece of software, and have other options, then why should you use it?
                Maybe because I wasn't particularly impressed by KDE, I should drop down on every KDE article I see and announce that the developers are stupid because they are not catering to my needs?
                Yeah, that seems constructive.
                Nah, don't bother, it would be duplicate effort. funkSTAR already has you covered in that regard.

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                • #38
                  Requiem for the Dream of Linux Desktop

                  Because a lot of Linux users refuse anything new.

                  If things continued like this, sooner or later no newbies would want a Linux DE because of its decades-old UI.
                  Last edited by zxy_thf; 01-25-2013, 11:15 AM.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Roberto Dirksen View Post
                    Yes, stick with tradition. That's a great way to advance technology.

                    If you don't like Gnome 3, it means you're too stupid to learn new things.
                    Technology and UI design have nothing to do with each other. Windows 7 uses almost the same UI design with Windows 95, but i think it is way more advanced...

                    And no, calling everybody who doesn't like Gnome 3 stupid isn't an argument at all. And there is not much to learn about it anyway. It is really simple. It just isn't designed with Workstations and traditional desktop in mind...

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by zxy_thf View Post
                      Because a lot of Linux users refuse anything new.

                      If things continued like this, sooner or later nobody would want a Linux DE as it resembled decades-old UI.
                      Well, cars have had the same (many) decades-old UI (steering wheel, brakes, gearbox etc) but i am pretty sure most people don't mind. In other words: Just because an idea is old, doesn't mean it is less valuable, AKA change just for the sake of change is bad...

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Roberto Dirksen View Post
                        Don't strain yourself. Search for Diet Coda and Codea. This is just the beginning. I have no doubt people will be able to develop apps entirely on a tablet in a few years. Tablets will force software development to advance as well. The post-PC programming languages and tools will be much easier to use than what exists today.
                        Just for the record; PC stands for Personal Computer. Post-PC era stands for post-PersonalCompute era, and it obviously means that Cloud-services are doing the computing and present the data and the interface over HTML/native apps.

                        In case you've misunderstood the Apple's marketing department:
                        1. They clearly see the iPad as a product that fills the void between smartphones and laptops;
                        2. iOS was first introduced without an SDK because webapps could just as easily do the job. That is why you can bookmark webpages as icons on the homescreen, however; webapps don't generate revenue and small startups can't afford gigantic server costs and so the appstore was a drop-in replacement to lower the barrier to entry;
                        3. Programming and post-PC are not realy compatible terms.

                        Anyone trying to use an iPad to program applications hasn't realy understood anything about the very purpouse of the iPad, whatsoever. Now there are people who researched the idea of visual programming, but thus far any attempt in R&Ding this dumb idea has "Microsoft Frontpage" written all over it.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by zxy_thf View Post
                          Because a lot of Linux users refuse anything new.
                          No, you miss the point. What Linux users refuse is having some committee force a limited approach to computing on them without having the ability to change it.

                          Linux users are accustomed to modifying their system to fit their preferences and to optimise their workflow. Traditionally, all desktops have presented you with a vanilla default and allowed you to modify it to your needs.

                          What Linux users do not like is when somebody comes and says that using your desktop the way you like it is verboten.

                          Linux people have been running innovative desktops for decades, some of the stuff I've seen would make the "innovative kiddies" crap their pants and cry for mummy. It's not innovation people object to, it's the removal of features coupled with a holier-than-thou use-it-or-drop-dead attitude.

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                          • #43
                            So back with F15 they decided to switch to GS, back in the day when touch screen laptops were nonexistent.

                            Now when even Microsoft ditched the traditional "desktop" paradigm in win8, now when touch enabled laptops/tablets are ubiquitous, now they say they want to move back to the traditional desktop.

                            WTF Fedora?

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                            • #44
                              Openbox, Fluxbox, AwesomeWM, KDE3, KDE4, Gnome2, Gnome3, LXDE... I tried em all... the only one that had a (imo) legitimate feature my current DE doesn't offer the option of was AwesomeWM, but it lacks a great many other features.

                              My current DE is Xfce. With the exception of 'looking flashy', what do any of these other DE's actually offer over it? Nothing, and the others that match it's featureset are slower... and the rest don't have enough panel customisation.
                              Last edited by korrode; 01-25-2013, 11:56 AM. Reason: forgot to mention LXDE when listing DE's i tried

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by korrode View Post
                                My current DE is Xfce. With the exception of 'looking flashy', what do any of these other DE's actually offer over it? Nothing, and the others that match it's featureset are slower... and the rest don't have enough panel customisation.
                                *high five*

                                I agree -- if you need a "classic" desktop, why would you use another DE? KDE and GNOME are actually slower than Unity.

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