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Mono 2.8 Is Out With C# 4.0, Better Performance

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  • Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
    Is this how mature languages work? Because if so, just give me immature C# which I can compile with any compiler and have that single binary run on every supported OS *and* CPU architecture, without recompilation or strange compatibility issues. It just works (and I have done this time and time before). And if I need the extra speed, I'll inject native code into the hotspots and precompile the rest at installation time.
    It sounds like a call for newbies who can't program in C/C++, but mono allows them to make some shitty programs which suffers from huge memory leaks, terrible programming techniques and terrible performance. But hey, it just compile. ;P

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    • Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
      In short, some UI features seem to be significantly easier to implement in Mono/GTK# compared to C/GTK+. Ergo, the former seems to be a more productive environment for UIs.
      I didn't disagree but that's why I made the example for QT/KDE.
      Also, it's a bit unfair to compare the current GTK+ to the one 13 years ago. If Gimp was maiden today it wouldn't needed so much time to implement this feature.

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      • Well BlackStar does raise some valid concerns. But GIMP, just like Photoshop on the Mac, shouldn't require a single windows. Adobes explenation for single window on Win32 was that the Windows WM sucked, so they had no choice but to make it a single window.

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        • Well BlackStar does raise some valid concerns. But GIMP, just like Photoshop on the Mac, shouldn't require a single windows. Adobes explenation for single window on Win32 was that the Windows WM sucked major balls, so they had no choice but to make it a single window.

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          • Originally posted by Apopas View Post
            I didn't disagree but that's why I made the example for QT/KDE.
            Also, it's a bit unfair to compare the current GTK+ to the one 13 years ago. If Gimp was maiden today it wouldn't needed so much time to implement this feature.
            I agree. Then again, this feature was implemented in v2.7.1, presumably using GTK+ 2.18 (September 2009 release) which is quite modern. I haven't checked but Pinta is likely using either GTK# 2.18 or 2.20 which shouldn't be all that different. The main difference is that Pinta uses C# which is much more suitable for UIs (lambdas, events, garbage collection, modern module system).

            Obviously, Pinta is a much smaller and leaner project with faster turnaround times which explains a large part of the difference. But still, 1 month vs 1 year is quite significant.

            I agree that Qt is much more productive than GTK+, however, if a bit more arcane to setup and use. More productive than GTK#? Honestly, no idea.

            I know however, that I won't touch C++ unless I am being paid to do so (as I was in my last job). It's a powerful tool, but unlike Python or C# it's not fun to use - and I want my hobbyist programming to be fun, not onerous.

            @kraftman: why don't you spend a couple of years becoming familiar with a few different programming languages, first? One day you'll be looking back to those posts of yours, feeling ashamed. Just sayin'.

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            • Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
              Well BlackStar does raise some valid concerns. But GIMP, just like Photoshop on the Mac, shouldn't require a single windows. Adobes explenation for single window on Win32 was that the Windows WM sucked major balls, so they had no choice but to make it a single window.
              Single window with tearable panels! Best of both worlds.

              The response has been overwhelmingly positive.

              Edit: Windows WM is painful.

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              • Originally posted by BlackStar View Post
                I agree. Then again, this feature was implemented in v2.7.1, presumably using GTK+ 2.18 (September 2009 release) which is quite modern. I haven't checked but Pinta is likely using either GTK# 2.18 or 2.20 which shouldn't be all that different. The main difference is that Pinta uses C# which is much more suitable for UIs (lambdas, events, garbage collection, modern module system).

                Obviously, Pinta is a much smaller and leaner project with faster turnaround times which explains a large part of the difference. But still, 1 month vs 1 year is quite significant.
                There are few concerns with this comparison. We don't know if this was important for GIMP developers or they just made it for fun, we don't know how many people were working on both sides, how much time they were spending on it etc. I'm sure it's easier to implement something like this using c#, but easier doesn't automatically mean better (I don't know which implementation is smarter or more optimal). It would be great if Novell would be making some really important apps which would compete with Windows equivalents rather then pushing c# everywhere and thus look like MS evangelists.

                @kraftman: why don't you spend a couple of years becoming familiar with a few different programming languages, first? One day you'll be looking back to those posts of yours, feeling ashamed. Just sayin'.
                At first I have to become more familiar with the languages I'm interested in.

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                • Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
                  GIMP, just like Photoshop on the Mac, shouldn't require a single windows. Adobes explenation for single window on Win32 was that the Windows WM sucked major balls, so they had no choice but to make it a single window.
                  You say it as if it were a bad thing. I don't know whether that really was the initial reason to implement a single window UI in Photoshop for Windows. In any case, it turned out to be the right decision from the usability point of view. No matter what wm you use, floating windows are a sick mess. Gimp users have been asking for single window mode since forever, and usability experts agreed with them--this isn't even news. I suggest you people stop justifying what it was a major flaw in this program. It'll be here at last, and you'll even have the possibility to keep making your life harder in floating mode if you can't keep your masochist inclinations under control.

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                  • @Yotambien,
                    Errrrr... O... K... I'm just pointing out the situation here. I also use Krita for screwing around with bitmaps, BTW...

                    And if you think about it: multiple desktops. So it's actualy a bit of a moot point...

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                    • Sundays working are not good for the mood.

                      Sorry, man.

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