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The GNOME Developers Put Out The First SeedKit Release

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  • The GNOME Developers Put Out The First SeedKit Release

    Phoronix: The GNOME Developers Put Out The First SeedKit Release

    The GNOME developers have announced their first public release (v0.1) of SeedKit, consisting of both the GNOME SeedKit Viewer and the SeedKit library. GNOME's SeedKit is designed to blend web technologies (namely HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript) into the GNOME desktop by allowing native user-interfaces to be written in these web technologies. SeedKit leverages GTK+, WebKit, and Seed to lower the barrier to creating new user-interfaces for the GNOME desktop. SeedKit was inspired by Palm's WebOS SDK and Mozilla's JetPack...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=ODUyNg

  • #2
    Forgive my ignorance...

    But doesn't XUL (used in Firefox) do this already? Why didn't they just integrate XUL instead of making this new SeedKit thing?

    Comment


    • #3
      It basically duplicates and somewhat extends HTML5.
      And I haven't used for serious any Flash/HTML5 app ever yet, hence I wonder if this is basically a waste of time and would it be better for the Gnome devs to focus instead on improving (improving as in "making it feel fast", not "translation updates and bug fixes") the Gnome desktop like making Nautilus (and gedit) be and feel fast (at least like Finder from Mac)?
      I'm not grumpy I really think so.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DDevine View Post
        But doesn't XUL (used in Firefox) do this already? Why didn't they just integrate XUL instead of making this new SeedKit thing?
        Sorta, yes.

        Firefox is it's own 'widget'. It's not a GTK app or a QT app... it's a XUL application. There are a handful of others like Thunderbird and there is a IDE that is XUL also.

        Firefox uses it's own HTML renderer to render the 'chrome' of the application... the buttons, the surrounds, the search bar etc etc. All that is rendered in a similar way that web applications are rendered and uses the same applications. Most everything, baring restrictions for security sake, that firefox does you can duplicate using web applications.

        In this case it's doing the similar thing for GTK/Gnome that Firefox does for itself. The reason they are using Webkit is probably that it's just much easier to work with then Gecko is.

        A few times in the past Gnome tried to integrate a html renderer... previously gecko and then gtkhtml. Gtkhtml was dreadful and Gecko integration left a lot to be desired... but webkit integration was done relatively quickly and well. So I guess they decided to run with it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by cl333r View Post
          It basically duplicates and somewhat extends HTML5.
          And I haven't used for serious any Flash/HTML5 app ever yet, hence I wonder if this is basically a waste of time and would it be better for the Gnome devs to focus instead on improving (improving as in "making it feel fast", not "translation updates and bug fixes") the Gnome desktop like making Nautilus (and gedit) be and feel fast (at least like Finder from Mac)?
          I'm not grumpy I really think so.
          Gnome has been focusing on improving performance the lightweight-ness of it's stuff for a long time. You can see it through the Gnome mobile initiative and Meego/Maemo (gtk versions) are a result of this. Also Gnome 3.0 is a result of this also. They removed a lot of old dependencies and whatnot.



          The goal of this is to make it easy to program applications for Gnome and to make integration into web stuff easier.

          Anything to make things easier and attract developers is time well spent.

          Comment


          • #6
            Here's the obligatory

            KDE already does it, post.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
              KDE already does it, post.
              KDE is very fast with new features. No one can deny that.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi there,

                As the main and only maintainer/developer of SeedKit, I'd like to thank Phoronix for the visibility offered to the project with this article. I hope this will bring a flow of testers and contributors in

                Let me just precise that SeedKit isn't currently a Gnome endorsed project, and shouldn't be presented as a "Gnome developers" effort. Hopefully, some of them will join the team soon.
                So no worry ,cl333r, about wasting of time and energy from their part

                The approach is indeed similar to what the MoFo does with XUL, apart that HTML/CSS/JS is tenfold more known to devs and designers and that you do not have to mess with complication like XPCOM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Alexandre Mazari View Post
                  Hi there,

                  Let me just precise that SeedKit isn't currently a Gnome endorsed project, and shouldn't be presented as a "Gnome developers" effort. Hopefully, some of them will join the team soon.
                  So no worry ,cl333r, about wasting of time and energy from their part
                  Could the title of the article be modified to reflect that by replacing "GNOME Developers" by "The SeedKit team" ? Thank you.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
                    KDE already does it, post.
                    Is it KDE or Qt? Also, what is the name of the tech?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by liam View Post
                      Is it KDE or Qt? Also, what is the name of the tech?
                      That was a bit tongue-in-cheek, i don't really know much about the Seedkit project. But it does sound like functionality present on the "other" desktop.

                      Qt provides a Webkit widget, as well as the ability to use js scripting which can access Qt libs. KDE extends that with javascript bindings to their libraries as well. Apps like Kate are using javascript plugins, and I think Amarok does as well. As a whole, it sounds kind of like that + webkit based plasmoid tech that KDE has. And of course Qt has been CSS themeable for a while.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Any more details?

                        Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
                        That was a bit tongue-in-cheek, i don't really know much about the Seedkit project. But it does sound like functionality present on the "other" desktop.

                        Qt provides a Webkit widget, as well as the ability to use js scripting which can access Qt libs. KDE extends that with javascript bindings to their libraries as well. Apps like Kate are using javascript plugins, and I think Amarok does as well. As a whole, it sounds kind of like that + webkit based plasmoid tech that KDE has. And of course Qt has been CSS themeable for a while.
                        I did a few quick searches but couldn't find anything. In fact, according to the official Qt site, Qt doesn't support js (http://qt.nokia.com/products/program...nguage-support).
                        Again, a name, or link, would be great.

                        Thanks!

                        Best/Liam

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by liam View Post
                          I did a few quick searches but couldn't find anything. In fact, according to the official Qt site, Qt doesn't support js (http://qt.nokia.com/products/program...nguage-support).
                          Again, a name, or link, would be great.

                          Thanks!

                          Best/Liam
                          They call it ECMAScript (the standard javascript implements) or Qt Script.

                          http://doc.trolltech.com/qq/qq02-fun...qt-script.html
                          http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.6/scripting.html

                          Here's a link to how it's used within Kate:
                          http://docs.kde.org/development/en/k...scripting.html

                          And i know i just read a blog about one of the new features in KDE4.5 plasma is that the entire desktop is scriptable now in javascript, so that distros or sysadmins can script that certain plasmoids (or taskbars, etc.) should be present, their location, etc.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
                            And i know i just read a blog about one of the new features in KDE4.5 plasma is that the entire desktop is scriptable now in javascript, so that distros or sysadmins can script that certain plasmoids (or taskbars, etc.) should be present, their location, etc.
                            Here's the plasma scripting i was talking about:
                            http://techbase.kde.org/KDE_System_A...sktopScripting

                            And KWin is getting scripting as well - someone created a game of pong using windows as the paddles for a proof of concept:
                            http://rohanprabhu.com/?p=56
                            http://rohanprabhu.com/wp-content/up...7/kwinpong.txt

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post
                              They call it ECMAScript (the standard javascript implements) or Qt Script.

                              http://doc.trolltech.com/qq/qq02-fun...qt-script.html
                              http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.6/scripting.html

                              Here's a link to how it's used within Kate:
                              http://docs.kde.org/development/en/k...scripting.html

                              And i know i just read a blog about one of the new features in KDE4.5 plasma is that the entire desktop is scriptable now in javascript, so that distros or sysadmins can script that certain plasmoids (or taskbars, etc.) should be present, their location, etc.
                              Thanks alot! However, you have to admit they really buried that info, though
                              Trolltech did some nice work there. I especially like the ability to mix QtScript and C++.
                              There is some interesting convergence happening with KDE and Gnome, here. Since GIR got into place, there's been a rush to make use of it. Gnome Shell is doing something interesting here by writing the entire gui in js. I've been working with it, and it is so much faster/easier to read and make substantial changes to the code.
                              It's only for the good that both desktops allow for this kind of development.

                              Best/Liam

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