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  • #16
    Originally posted by Kivada View Post
    Then you have failed miserably at your job. Your automated tests are usually full of bugs as well. No two computers are identical and as such will never have identical results, hell, run to run the same machine can have very different results hence why you don't run the tests once for a real review to average out the numbers.
    Now now. The tests are run _at least_ 3 times, and only if the standard deviation is not out of acceptable levels. In other cases, you can have some tests run 5 or more times...

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by schmidtbag View Post
      With that in mind, you are visiting this website for the wrong reasons. Phoronix isn't and never has been a hardware recommendation website, nor is it a hardware enthusiast's website, nor is it a gamer's website. The website largely focuses on open source (mainly linux) news and progress within the open source community. For hardware related tests, its all about how far drivers have progressed in terms of features, stability, performance, and efficiency. The tests are also meant to show how linux is doing compared to other OSes. Why else do you think Michael still writes about hardware released over 10 years ago? That news IS relevant, because not everybody buys the latest and greatest and its nice to know if people can put new use to their retired systems. Michael might not use tests that resemble modern day desires, but they do very effectively show progress between platforms and drivers. Writing articles about games you prefer is not any more or less relevant to the purpose of tests posted on this website - they just simply give out more meaningful numbers.

      What I really don't understand, though, is if you think it's so easy to just download PTS and run the tests yourself, why is it any harder for you to run benchmarks of the games you care about on your own time? Keep in mind too, the nvidia drivers overall perform on par with Windows. Chances are, if there's a game you want to play that runs natively on Linux as well as Windows, you can get your answer by looking at Windows tests.
      Wrong, it is a hardware review site doing what all hardware review sites do when they don't have any hardware left to review...

      And that is regurgitate tech news. Theres nothing in any of Larabel's "news" articles that is directly his own research or work outside of drivel about a new version of PTS. Everything else can be found from a dozen other sites. Thus the only reason anyone ever comes here for is to look for hardware reviews.

      Comment


      • #18
        I work seven days per week, about 100 hours per week

        That's crap. If you really are putting in that much effort you're doing it wrong and your work suffers. I have a dislike of the grammar in the "articles", put being burnt out may be the source of my disgust of the content after the headlines. In addition, beneath the graphs in the reviews is a total waste of time to read. For a time after finding this site I would read that information, but it said nothing that wasn't in the graphic. l quickly changed to just reading the graphs as I skimmed along and now I just visit the site to use the site as a news aggregator. Currently I only click articles to get links, but am frustrated by the constant lack of relevant links and constant self promotion with the links to "my previous article." Don't bombard the reader with that spam. I know there's related links at the bottom of the page and I know how to search for more information. I am almost at the point I don't click any of the articles and instead just google the headline to get the story.

        The one thing I think you do well is gather and serve information and news relevant to my interests. Not any of the original content, I wish most of that could be blocked. I tried looking for alternates but haven't found one I like yet.

        I don't want you to think I just some troll, I am a customer that is feed up and looking to fire my service provider, you, if there are not improvements. This is your chance to sell me, keep me from hiring someone else. I have paid for open source development and media content I could get for free in the past from other companies. If you want me to pay you, or not outright leave, make changes. It's quality over quantity. The value of labour is subjective and the value of your product is not dependent on or even linked to the raw labour you are spewing out.

        Your first order of business should be to hire writers or outsource content while you take a vacation. Even after you return your productivity, and more so quality, will still be impaired as it will take some time for you to recuperate to your best. Even if you have to stop writing and just let automated scripts add headlines, that's good too.


        http://lifehacker.com/5894523/how-ma...have-a-problem
        http://www.businessinsider.com/why-w...or-you-2013-11
        http://www.inc.com/jessica-stillman/...s-useless.html
        http://blog.billbooks.com/8-hours-da...ivity-booster/

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        • #19
          Originally posted by schmidtbag View Post
          With that in mind, you are visiting this website for the wrong reasons. Phoronix isn't and never has been a hardware recommendation website, nor is it a hardware enthusiast's website, nor is it a gamer's website. The website largely focuses on open source (mainly linux) news and progress within the open source community. For hardware related tests, its all about how far drivers have progressed in terms of features, stability, performance, and efficiency. The tests are also meant to show how linux is doing compared to other OSes. Why else do you think Michael still writes about hardware released over 10 years ago? That news IS relevant, because not everybody buys the latest and greatest and its nice to know if people can put new use to their retired systems. Michael might not use tests that resemble modern day desires, but they do very effectively show progress between platforms and drivers. Writing articles about games you prefer is not any more or less relevant to the purpose of tests posted on this website - they just simply give out more meaningful numbers.

          What I really don't understand, though, is if you think it's so easy to just download PTS and run the tests yourself, why is it any harder for you to run benchmarks of the games you care about on your own time? Keep in mind too, the nvidia drivers overall perform on par with Windows. Chances are, if there's a game you want to play that runs natively on Linux as well as Windows, you can get your answer by looking at Windows tests.
          The title tag in the HTML header for the phoronix.com landing page says: "[Phoronix] Linux Hardware Reviews, Benchmarking, & Gaming"

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Kivada View Post
            Wrong, it is a hardware review site doing what all hardware review sites do when they don't have any hardware left to review...

            And that is regurgitate tech news. Theres nothing in any of Larabel's "news" articles that is directly his own research or work outside of drivel about a new version of PTS. Everything else can be found from a dozen other sites. Thus the only reason anyone ever comes here for is to look for hardware reviews.
            Well, news reporting is by definition reporting something that someone else is doing. Original research is not news reporting.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by jason View Post
              Your first order of business should be to hire writers or outsource content while you take a vacation. Even after you return your productivity, and more so quality, will still be impaired as it will take some time for you to recuperate to your best. Even if you have to stop writing and just let automated scripts add headlines, that's good too.
              It's already been covered multiple times that advertisements on Linux sites is crap compared to Windows sites and that's why that many other sites out there that have focused on Linux quality articles over quantity have failed (H Online, etc).
              Michael Larabel
              http://www.michaellarabel.com/

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Kivada View Post
                Wrong, it is a hardware review site doing what all hardware review sites do when they don't have any hardware left to review...
                If I'm wrong then why are more than half the articles not related to hardware? But even if it was a hardware review site, how is owning a Titan, 780Ti, an R9 290 and an R9 270 is considered not having any hardware left to review? Seriously you're just arguing for argument's sake. This website doesn't revolve around the latest and greatest hardware or games, and thinking it should otherwise would end up resulting in completely changing the purpose of the website. 90% of the articles have nothing to do with what you want, because they're not supposed to be. If this was a gaming linux website, most of the articles written would be irrelevant.

                And that is regurgitate tech news. Theres nothing in any of Larabel's "news" articles that is directly his own research or work outside of drivel about a new version of PTS. Everything else can be found from a dozen other sites. Thus the only reason anyone ever comes here for is to look for hardware reviews.
                .....are you kidding me right now? Since when is ANY news website, no matter how big or small, is always about their own personal research? That has to be the dumbest thing I ever heard in the 5 years I've been on this website - there are trolls who have said things with more substance than that. Besides, name at least 2 other existing websites that collectively report the same things that phoronix does. Off the top of my head, the Linux Foundation news is more corporate level stuff and the H (to my knowledge) is shut down. Phoronix may be the only website that consistently reports on linux hardware news, but just because that's the only reason you visit, that doesn't summarize it as a hardware review site.

                You need to be a lot less ego-centric. This website is for anything open source or the good for open source - what you're looking for is explicitly not that.

                Comment


                • #23
                  I fully support you Michael. Phoronix is quite useful as it is, and automated benchmarking is a necessity for believable results.

                  My wishlist:
                  1) radeontop support (GPU usage graph for all >= r600 cards, on any driver)
                  2) frame times for all GL apps

                  These would allow you to create some quite interesting data. For example, "At which point, on each card and driver, does this game turn gpu-limited" "peak latency comparison across all games and drivers", and so on. I dare to guess that each of those would get decent interest and exposure.

                  Both are Linux-only solutions, so no Windows exposure, but still rarely reported on topics. Heck, if PTS wasn't in PHP I'd have contributed both features myself already

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by curaga View Post
                    I fully support you Michael. Phoronix is quite useful as it is, and automated benchmarking is a necessity for believable results.

                    My wishlist:
                    1) radeontop support (GPU usage graph for all >= r600 cards, on any driver)
                    2) frame times for all GL apps

                    These would allow you to create some quite interesting data. For example, "At which point, on each card and driver, does this game turn gpu-limited" "peak latency comparison across all games and drivers", and so on. I dare to guess that each of those would get decent interest and exposure.

                    Both are Linux-only solutions, so no Windows exposure, but still rarely reported on topics. Heck, if PTS wasn't in PHP I'd have contributed both features myself already
                    I think PTS already supports the GPU usage that is done by RadeonTOP. I need to check to see what else it supports, but at last check PTS already directly monitors the Radeon, Intel, and binary AMD/NVIDIA drivers with GPU usage through gpu.sensor Phodevi sensor that can be enabled via MONITOR=gpu.usage environment variable. Phoronix Test Suite 5.0 will push the game much further with monitoring.
                    Michael Larabel
                    http://www.michaellarabel.com/

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by schmidtbag View Post
                      With that in mind, you are visiting this website for the wrong reasons. Phoronix isn't and never has been a hardware recommendation website, nor is it a hardware enthusiast's website, nor is it a gamer's website.
                      No it's not hardware recommendation website. I don't need it to be. I have my own brain for that. But seeing that AMD latests card fails to even launch half of games, and seing that some 600 seria Nvidia kicks arse of this AMD card - enough for me to say i dont want AMD and i want Nvidia card. There are many other news i also enjoy.

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                      • #26
                        no one disagrees man

                        Originally posted by jrch2k8 View Post
                        keep the good work michael and don't listen to the forum whiners, if they want it so badly they can make a profile and contribute it to PTS and i agree is a perfect valid point to not run manual tests.
                        Michael got point.
                        But people ask for it. I have seen many requests on forums.
                        You think its gonna hurt Phoronix to provide articles that are relevant to readers?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Nobody cares what card runs OpenArena fastest, or how fast.

                          Lots of people care how fast different cards run Serious Sam 3, or Metro LL.

                          The truth is that Michael's articles aren't showing what people want. But we're still showing up to his site anyway, and generating ad revenue. So he can keep on posting whatever he wants as long as he's making a living off the site.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by dimko View Post
                            No it's not hardware recommendation website. I don't need it to be. I have my own brain for that. But seeing that AMD latests card fails to even launch half of games, and seing that some 600 seria Nvidia kicks arse of this AMD card - enough for me to say i dont want AMD and i want Nvidia card. There are many other news i also enjoy.
                            I think you quoted the wrong person, but at least you helped solidify my point.

                            @smitty3268
                            People might not care about the results of open arena but what we do care about is the progression of GPU drivers, which the tests thoroughly resemble. The point of the tests is to show progress, not what games run best.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by schmidtbag View Post
                              I think you quoted the wrong person, but at least you helped solidify my point.

                              @smitty3268
                              People might not care about the results of open arena but what we do care about is the progression of GPU drivers, which the tests thoroughly resemble. The point of the tests is to show progress, not what games run best.
                              People come here for many reasons, this is only one.
                              So far i have not seen comments like: "Michael, what about full implementation of openGL 4.1 on AMD drivers in game?", so far we have seen only "Michael, make us tests of game X", where X is game people are interested in on card they are interested in.

                              At the end of the day, Michael may as well test some open source games only, which we should know better, but he did go into testing Source engine games, didn't he? How is that relevant to what you are saying?

                              At the end of day NO ONE gives 2 fu**s about openGL, everyone cares if his game is working or his PC or will the game they want to buy work on PC they want to own. Exception is developers, but clearly site is not for them.

                              Let me put it into perspective, If I know my new GPU will work nicely and i don't have to sell my soul for it to me and most readers - is more important than knowing state of drivers, why do i care? I care not for driver as long as i can play my game on my PC. And this is what people were asking.

                              I am not whining, I am not begging, i am happy with my PC as it is. Thanks to this site i have good PC i am happy with. I know what will play nicely on it and what not. Others are not, and I voice their opinion.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Serge View Post
                                Well, news reporting is by definition reporting something that someone else is doing. Original research is not news reporting.
                                Wrong again, even the smallest local blogs and free news papers do their own reporting instead of just copy and pasting from a mailing list.

                                I have pointed out several times things that should be happening, like whens the last time we had an in depth interview with a dev or project head for any project, be it a closed source audio editor or an open source CAD program?

                                Most of you think I may be a troll, I'm not, I just want a site that isn't an insult to the OSS and Linux community which Phoronix is and it is entirely due to Michael Larabel.

                                We deserve better then this.

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