Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Quest Of Finding Linux Compatible Hardware

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • The Quest Of Finding Linux Compatible Hardware

    Phoronix: The Quest Of Finding Linux Compatible Hardware

    While Intel is often looked at as being the most Linux and open-source friendly company among the major IHVs, as shown today in Intel's Linux Sandy Bridge Graphics Still Troubling, even in 2011 there are still serious Linux hardware issues to overcome. The Linux hardware support has a much better foundation than where it was at in 2004 when I founded Phoronix, and for hardware that's been in the marketplace for a few months old these problems quickly go away, but for new adopters it's the biggest challenge...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=OTAyNA

  • #2
    The quest for Linux-compatible hardware is actually quite simple:

    * Get any sound card except X-Fi.
    * Get an NVidia graphics card.

    That's all there is to it

    Comment


    • #3
      Well, sometimes you have to be careful about what network adapter or printer/scanner you get, but I guess that's not the kind of hardware Michael was referring to.
      Last edited by Nobu; 01-18-2011, 02:38 PM. Reason: Added "kind of"

      Comment


      • #4
        Thats a great use of the data generated from the PTS. Could help a lot of people determining what wifi chips are actually best supported. But how do you benchmark something like soundcards? People want to know if spdif out is working with some random application for example.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Nobu View Post
          Well, sometimes you have to be careful about what network adapter or printer/scanner you get, but I guess that's not the kind of hardware Michael was referring to.
          There is yet-to-be-announced support for USB devices. Wait, did I just say that?
          Michael Larabel
          http://www.michaellarabel.com/

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by crispy View Post
            Thats a great use of the data generated from the PTS. Could help a lot of people determining what wifi chips are actually best supported. But how do you benchmark something like soundcards? People want to know if spdif out is working with some random application for example.
            I haven't looked much into sound card support yet, but one rough estimate for that could be to look at the percent of people using a given sound card relative to other audio adapters, at least as a cursory way to see if something looks to be possibly supported well or not. And then use the commenting system to ask the active owners.
            Michael Larabel
            http://www.michaellarabel.com/

            Comment


            • #7
              Hey seen that article I had the following idea:
              You can display the performance of different combinations of hardware using PTS. You should also benchmark hardware comparing Windows and Linux performance.
              With this, users may have an idea of what hardware they will be buying.
              Meanwhile you could threat bad hardware vendors like SiS and Via, sending them the following message: "Hey VIA/SiS look at these benchmarks, see how NVIDIA, Intel and AMD give good results in our tests. Have you realized that your hardware aren' t there? Can you guess why?"
              This should make them fell very envy about not seeing their hardware in the recommended list.
              You could also create a list of the hardware that should be avoided.
              Printers, scanners and every other hardware should be also available.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by RealNC View Post
                The quest for Linux-compatible hardware is actually quite simple:

                * Get an NVidia graphics card.

                That's all there is to it
                Does Optimus work under Linux? I thought Nvidia made it clear that they would not support it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
                  Does Optimus work under Linux? I thought Nvidia made it clear that they would not support it.
                  <---- EXACTLY. Be careful people, on most optimus laptops having the nvidia chip is basically the same as having a rock weighting the same.

                  Michael: In price comparisons, please also consider non-US users. Most benchmark sites *cough*anandtech*cough*tom's hardware*cough* tend to forget we exist. We don't use dollars, don't have access to newegg, and don't have rebates. So a very valid price comparison or guide in the US is normally not applicable in Europe or other places in the world.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by [Knuckles] View Post
                    <---- EXACTLY. Be careful people, on most optimus laptops having the nvidia chip is basically the same as having a rock weighting the same.

                    Michael: In price comparisons, please also consider non-US users. Most benchmark sites *cough*anandtech*cough*tom's hardware*cough* tend to forget we exist. We don't use dollars, don't have access to newegg, and don't have rebates. So a very valid price comparison or guide in the US is normally not applicable in Europe or other places in the world.
                    Well, isn't it better it works for some of us rather than none of us at all?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by [Knuckles] View Post
                      Michael: In price comparisons, please also consider non-US users. Most benchmark sites *cough*anandtech*cough*tom's hardware*cough* tend to forget we exist. We don't use dollars, don't have access to newegg, and don't have rebates. So a very valid price comparison or guide in the US is normally not applicable in Europe or other places in the world.
                      I think I can get Amazon UK/etc supported, but for anything else I need to be informed of such foreign stores that have affiliate setups and pricing APIs. Nothing on OpenBenchmarking.org is manually pulled.
                      Michael Larabel
                      http://www.michaellarabel.com/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        You could get amazon.de (germany) to work as well
                        Then you'll have at least one (or 2 if you count Austria) Euro countries.

                        I guess amazon.de will have a similar, if not the same, api as uk/us amazon.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Wow, that sounds really valuable Michael. An empirically-generated HCL (Hardware Compatibility List) for arbitrary distros and configurations.

                          Of course, the success of the system depends upon three things in particular that I can identify:

                          (1) People using the system extensively enough that all relevant hardware has been tested. If there aren't enough data points, then it just becomes another search engine that happily says "0 results found".

                          (2) How heavily can users rely upon the results provided by other users? Maybe there is a misconfiguration, custom software, or a special piece of hardware (e.g. vendor customizations on top of a IHV base chip, especially with e.g. laptop sound systems) that can skew the results. And of course any information that is expected to come from the user, rather than the operating system, is suspect, as users are often wrong about judging what they think their hardware is, intentionally or by accident.

                          (3) How much detail does the system go into about the things we care about? For example, a gamer will want to know whether graphics card X running driver Y can run game Z with reasonable performance and no rendering artifacts. Just because someone running graphics card X says "it works nice on Ubuntu" doesn't mean, then, that they were using the same driver, or that said driver will be able to run the game you care about. As a particular example, finding a graphics card / driver combo able to run games like Savage 2, Heroes of Newerth, or Unigine games would be an interesting exercise, in a hypothetical future world where some implementations of some Mesa drivers can render these games correctly. Right now it's very cut-and-dry: use Radeon HD4000 or later, or Nvidia G80 or later with the respective proprietary drivers. But in the future it may not be as obvious if r600g starts to support the extensions required by these games.

                          The value of such a database would be related to the depth of the data gathered, imho. Very general comments like "Works" (as in other HCLs) is almost completely useless in the case of complex hardware like GPUs, where you can say "Works" to some degree if it can start X -- and that's true for every card supported by vesa. And sometimes performance isn't the most important issue, either: I don't care if I can get 500 fps in a "benchmark" of Unigine, if all the effects aren't rendered and half the textures are black. Driver implementations can, and very often do, process API calls incorrectly without crashing or otherwise reporting an error, even if the resulting image is partially or completely messed up. Incorrect rendering is as damning, if not more damning, than bad performance. Automatically detecting correct rendering (or, alternatively, relying upon the user to report rendering issues) should become a crucial input for reporting results to the database.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by allquixotic View Post
                            (1) People using the system extensively enough that all relevant hardware has been tested. If there aren't enough data points, then it just becomes another search engine that happily says "0 results found".
                            I continue to be amazed at what I already find on the system... Very few hardware yields 0 results. Heck, I even ended up finding Sandy Bridge information dating back to mid December!

                            Originally posted by allquixotic View Post
                            As a particular example, finding a graphics card / driver combo able to run games like Savage 2, Heroes of Newerth, or Unigine games would be an interesting exercise
                            Write test profiles for HoN and Savage and you can easily find out.

                            Originally posted by allquixotic View Post
                            The value of such a database would be related to the depth of the data gathered, imho. Very general comments like "Works" (as in other HCLs) is almost completely useless in the case of complex hardware like GPUs, where you can say "Works" to some degree if it can start X -- and that's true for every card supported by vesa.
                            Only manual user data is inputting save name, identfier, and description from the Phoronix Test Suite. No other manual data is asked of the user.

                            Originally posted by allquixotic View Post
                            And sometimes performance isn't the most important issue, either: I don't care if I can get 500 fps in a "benchmark" of Unigine, if all the effects aren't rendered and half the textures are black...Automatically detecting correct rendering (or, alternatively, relying upon the user to report rendering issues) should become a crucial input for reporting results to the database.
                            The Phoronix Test Suite already supports this: http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=14380 and there will continue to only get more qualitative tests going forward.
                            Michael Larabel
                            http://www.michaellarabel.com/

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              LinuxBIOS

                              don't leave out coreboot support

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X