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What Linux Users Are Saying About GNOME In 2012 (Part 1)

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  • #46
    Originally posted by kigurai View Post
    Most users on Phoronix. There, I fixed it for you.
    Not true. Probably every poll shows KDE and Unity are more popular than gnome 3. I bet Cinnamon is more popular as well.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Roberto Dirksen View Post
      If you don't like Gnome 3, you're most likely doing something stupid. Instead of getting frustrated, try thinking about the best way to accomplish your task. You'll find that the way you used to do things in Windows and Gnome 2 were not that efficient after all.
      ...and GNOME 3 is not efficient at all. Its organization of interface is plain stupid.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by rafirafi View Post
        Today it's possible to have a perfectly supported PC/laptop if you use latest intel sandy/ivy bridge gpu. If you choose a stable distro, put all updates in automatic mode, install xfce which is similar to what "people" expect from a computer it's not so hard to use. Sure there is not the same manpower or coherence for linux, and the software offer is not the same than for windows but it's not so bad.
        your not looking at the broader problems (as far as h/w support), but instead only looking at gpu support (what about countless other h/W devices?). As one small example - with proaudio interfaces, you better know EXACTLY what you are buying, how well-supported the card is (and is it flaky, which some tend to be under linux). How about various quirks (that sometimes require intervention/config) for certain intelHDA devices? how about certain MBs that don't work well? (ie: things like crappy/flaky inplementation of usb / firewire / etc)... But on the topic of GPUs - i don't like Intel's gpus, and they wouldn't be something i would recommend to anyone i know. they are okay, but nothing special... ~ mind you i am biased because i use GPU intensive apps.. (but then again, so does everyone else i know).

        Originally posted by rafirafi View Post
        For the cinnamon memory leaking... I used the recommanded ppa, at one release they announced a big memory leak was fixed but it was not for me. The only other issue was when using qemu fullscreen, the resolution was sometimes broken after but I don't know perhaps it was qemu not the mutter fork. Frankly I don't have the courage to compile to test, I switch to the infamous xfce/kwin couple which is rock solid/beautiful.
        i don't know about the QEMU/fullscreen bit, nor about the 'recommended ppa' ~ since i don't use Ubuntu. But i know running cinnamon-git in Archlinux doesn't seem to have a big-ugly memory leak. It's too bad that you ran into problems - i wouldn't have used cinnamon (even 6 months ago) but i have been really enjoying the experience, since i switched a month (or so) ago..

        xfce/kwin eh? ...sounds like it could be an interesting combo (I've never tried it).

        cheerz
        Last edited by ninez; 12-19-2012, 08:21 PM.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by kigurai View Post
          Also, users generally do not know what they really want, regardless of what they may think.
          This is the kind of arrogant coder crap I can't stand.

          I may not be a coder but I know exactly what I want, I want the Gnome 2 UI with an up to date codebase. Not a shitty ripoff of Metro and iOS.

          So I'm stuck using Mate as it's the only thing left that actually does WTF it's supposed to.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Kivada View Post
            This is the kind of arrogant coder crap I can't stand.
            This is not arrogance or an insult. Users are not stupid. It is just pointing out that you might not now what you really want if you haven't seen it yet.

            I may not be a coder but I know exactly what I want, I want the Gnome 2 UI with an up to date codebase. Not a shitty ripoff of Metro and iOS.

            So I'm stuck using Mate as it's the only thing left that actually does WTF it's supposed to.
            Hopefully MATE will work for you, because Gnome 2 is gone.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by rafirafi View Post
              And don't told me they just listen their users, I remember reading on their mailing list that they can't listen because the only users speaking are thoses which are not happy and it's not something relevant.

              And if the users aren't happy you are doing something wrong. It doesn't matter that they aren't selling anything, they had a working product and decided to scrap it for something that most of their users don't like.

              See what happens whenever the CEO of Netflix opens his yap for reasons this is a bad idea.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by kigurai View Post
                This is not arrogance or an insult. Users are not stupid. It is just pointing out that you might not now what you really want if you haven't seen it yet.
                You still assume too much...

                Oh, but we have seen it already, if I had liked it I would have probably liked Android, iOS or Metro, or what KDE have been working on. I didn't like any of those, I've only ever liked Gnome2 since KDE3 died. It used to be I liked Apple's OS X UI as well as KDE3 and Gnome2. None of the "modern" UIs appeal to me in any way. I don't even use a composited desktop as it adds no real usefulness over multiple desktops for me.

                So currently I have only 1 DE with a small dev team that may or may not be able to keep the project in a state that is usable in the years to come. otherwise I have nothing I like.

                I've used everything but WebOS, and most of what I see out there is crap.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Kivada View Post
                  You still assume too much...
                  Just relaying what seems to be the consensus of the software engineering world.

                  Oh, but we have seen it already, if I had liked it I would have probably liked Android, iOS or Metro, or what KDE have been working on. I didn't like any of those, I've only ever liked Gnome2 since KDE3 died. It used to be I liked Apple's OS X UI as well as KDE3 and Gnome2. None of the "modern" UIs appeal to me in any way. I don't even use a composited desktop as it adds no real usefulness over multiple desktops for me.
                  And you are entitled to your opinion. If you asked users in general if they want to go back to a non-composited desktop I am quite sure you would get another opinion though.

                  So currently I have only 1 DE with a small dev team that may or may not be able to keep the project in a state that is usable in the years to come. otherwise I have nothing I like.
                  I've used everything but WebOS, and most of what I see out there is crap.
                  Seems like you have a problem then, which is unfortunate. Still not sure how bitching about GNOME3 will help you in any way. What you are doing is throwing gasoline on a fire of bad attitude which I hope you can agree solves nothing.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Kivada View Post
                    And if the users aren't happy you are doing something wrong. It doesn't matter that they aren't selling anything, they had a working product and decided to scrap it for something that most of their users don't like.
                    I have yet to see someone provide numbers that the GNOME user base is decreasing. I would be very surprised to find that this is the case. Maybe unity (which I suppose can be considered not-GNOME) "stole" some users, but apart from the ranting on Phoronix people I meet seem generally pleased of GNOME3 after the initial "WTF? Stuff is different!"-phase.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by kigurai View Post
                      I have yet to see someone provide numbers that the GNOME user base is decreasing. I would be very surprised to find that this is the case. Maybe unity (which I suppose can be considered not-GNOME) "stole" some users, but apart from the ranting on Phoronix people I meet seem generally pleased of GNOME3 after the initial "WTF? Stuff is different!"-phase.
                      I don't like gnome-shell. ~ so here is one user... That being said, i do like (most) of the gnome3-stack, so technically, i am a happy gnome-user, but the upstream UX - GS just blows in comparison to the alternatives, imo ~ So i am a happy gnome-user but that is only because i can pick what shell to use and am not stuck with GS' crappy UX ...

                      and fyi, Unity didn't 'steal' users - Gnome was unable to convince Ubuntu that GS was worthwhile (ie: they gave their users away). They obviously weren't able to convince any of the linuxMint people either, nor a bunch of random people who had used gnome (for years and years), who now have either A). moved away from gnome; ie: kde, xfce, etc or B). have ditched Gnome-Shell for Cinnamon, pantheon, Unity, compiz, etc.

                      Gnome (actauclly technically Gnome-Shell's) potential userbase certainly scattered, and i highly doubt it has recovered to where it was before Gnome3 was released... ~ and you do not need any numbers to prove that (it's called use common sense). Once upon a time Gnome(2) was the default DE on the most popular distribution(s) (Ubuntu/Mint), now Unity is 4 Ubuntu (yes, some people will swap in GS, but not all or even likely most). LinuxMint forked Gnome-shell and created Cinnamon (ie: their userbase is mostly using cinnamon, with a fraction using Gnome-Shell aka: 'the upstream gnome experience'). Right there, you have a lot of users whom aren't using GS... Aside from that, lots of people have switched to other environments, that were likely gnome-users, just a couple of years ago(yes, some probably switched back but some did not).

                      I think you are silly to not see this on your own and instead want numbers (you don't need them, dude!).

                      that being said: is gnome's <current> userbase declining? -> who knows, but i tend to think probably not.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by kigurai View Post
                        I have yet to see someone provide numbers that the GNOME user base is decreasing. I would be very surprised to find that this is the case. Maybe unity (which I suppose can be considered not-GNOME) "stole" some users, but apart from the ranting on Phoronix people I meet seem generally pleased of GNOME3 after the initial "WTF? Stuff is different!"-phase.
                        It seems you have missed the party. Gnome lost many of its users when gnome shell came out. Every poll I saw confirms my observations and there are statistics at archlinux page that I follow and they also confirm this. But hey, we're perfect (and have lost self-preservation instinct), why bother?

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by kigurai View Post
                          Just relaying what seems to be the consensus of the software engineering world.
                          Wrong, it's a grand experiment, that is failing miserably. The only reason we are going to be stuck with this new design is because the behemoth that is Windows is force feeding it to the world who will have no choice but to to accept it.

                          That the Gnome devs are following this trend is utterly moronic.

                          As the others have said, the Gnome user base has shattered considerably, I switched to Mint 13 from Ubuntu 11.10 running Gnome Fallback, XFCE, KDE4, LXDE and Unity because of having a real Gnome2 implementation in having a Mate only version, before that I saw no reason to ever use Mint but now it's all I use and all I recommend.

                          And as I've had to ask too many times already... Is everyone supposed to be an expert in every programming language just to use a computer? If so please go get a belt sander and some 40 grit paper and use it to wipe your ass.

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                          • #58
                            I actually like Gnome-Shell. I got used to it after 3.0 was released. It took a few weeks to change my work-flow, but I've been a Gnome user since 1.0. Having said that, the 3.6 release was the one that made me try KDE.. (I did come back to Gnome, but am seriously considering Cinnamon now).

                            All the Gnome-shell releases up to 3.4 were pretty nice in my opinion, with extensions taking over much of the perceived missing functionality; however, with 3.6, I coudln't figure out how to minimize Nautilus. It just sat there taking up the full screen. After searching, I learned that the minimize button was removed from nautilus. How stupid is that? Also, the sorting method was changed with no easy way of going back to the default sorting that I've been used to since Gnome 1.0. Several other features were either pulled or dumbed down in Nautilus. Since I use the Filemanager on a daily basis, I thought, no problem, I'll switch to a more advanced FM; however, thats not 100% possible, because Nautilus also draw the desktop, so clicking on any files on the desktop automatically launch Nautilus and not my new Filemanager.

                            Not to mention the stupid lock screen, where you are supposed to slide it up with a mouse to unlock. That might work in Android, or on my tablet where I've got a touch interface, but this is a desktop OS, and why the hell would I want to use a touch paradigm with a mouse?

                            If 3.6 didn't dumb down nautilus to the point of unusability, didn't add the retarded slide lock, and didn't add the big, ugly and non-transluscent action bar at the bottom of the screen, then I'd probably still like Gnome-Shell. Unfortunately, I'm running Arch Linux and have already upgraded to 3.6 and cannot go back to 3.4
                            Last edited by gururise; 12-22-2012, 09:29 PM.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by gururise View Post
                              ....Several other features were either pulled or dumbed down in Nautilus. Since I use the Filemanager on a daily basis, I thought, no problem, I'll switch to a more advanced FM; however, thats not 100% possible, because Nautilus also draw the desktop, so clicking on any files on the desktop automatically launch Nautilus and not my new Filemanager.
                              If 3.6 didn't dumb down nautilus to the point of unusability, didn't add the retarded slide lock, and didn't add the big, ugly and non-transluscent action bar at the bottom of the screen, then I'd probably still like Gnome-Shell. Unfortunately, I'm running Arch Linux and have already upgraded to 3.6 and cannot go back to 3.4[/QUOTE]

                              You don't have to downgrade nautilus, their is a file manage called 'nemo' that is a fork of nautilus 3.4 (available in aur, forked by linux mint) ... I was going to switch, but i got used to the new version. The only thing that is annoying is that the search function is as quick when doing searches in concession. everything seems to be okay, other than i kinda with it still had the regular toolbar...

                              and fyi (i don't know off-hand) but you can substitute the file-manager in Gnome (ie: have dolphin, marlin, etc open files). I think it is a setting somewhere in dconf-editor.

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                              • #60
                                You don't have to downgrade nautilus, their is a file manage called 'nemo' that is a fork of nautilus 3.4 (available in aur, forked by linux mint) ... I was going to switch, but i got used to the new version.
                                LOL. I highly doubt your story differs from the majority. It is so easy to fork, rant and hate in an unjust manner. When it comes to easy desktop file maanagement Nautilus 3.6 is so much more pleasant in day to day use.

                                Best part; It is entirely possible to USE Nautilus 3.6 and PRETEND you hate it on the forums. Of course the hate is dying rather quickly by now. The "fork batshit bataillion" is going nowhere and Ubuntu moved on.

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