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green energy (Germany) beat nuclear energy(France) in cost effiency!

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  • green energy (Germany) beat nuclear energy(France) in cost effiency!

    http://www.heise.de/tp/blogs/2/151961

    the basic electric energy price is lower in Germany than in France for more than 7 month now.

    France do have 74% nuclear energy but in fact nuclear is more expensive!

    (Base-Load) Germany: 4,357 Cent per Kilowatt hour (kWh)

    (Base-Load) France: 4,492 Cent per Kilowatt hour (kWh)

    France is 3,1% more expensive!

    and Peak load is much more expensive!

    (Peak-Load) 5.139 Cent per Kilowatt hour (kWh)

    (Peak-Load) 5.441 Cent per Kilowatt hour (kWh)

    its 6% more expensiv!

  • #2
    http://www.heise.de/tp/artikel/36/36930/1.html

    The Fraunhofer Society "Fraunhofer Society for the advancement of applied research"
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraunhofer_Society

    prove in a study that green energy beat Nuclear and Coal power plants!

    in fact wind energy costs are only: 6,5 Cent per kWh (onshore wind) offshore wind: 12,2 Cent per kWh

    big solar "Photoelectric" power plants do have the costs of: 10,7 Cent per kWh
    for small solar power plants like the one on a roof: 13,7 Cent per kWh
    RIGHT NOW! and the Future is even better for "solar" power.

    Now its a scientific fact in Germany GREEN energy beat Coal and Nuclear!

    no one can build a coal or nuclear power plant for 0,065-0,107€ per kWh!

    This is a fact!

    Comment


    • #3
      Thats great news - and from my view quite unexpected! Maybe it really was a good idea to phase out nuclear power.

      Comment


      • #4
        I guess Q has another alternate username or maybe just more idiots posting?

        Anyway, the German government highly subsidizes these energies, in particular, wind.

        But, that's too difficult for most to comprehend, apparently.

        Comment


        • #6
          Originally posted by Panix View Post
          I guess Q has another alternate username or maybe just more idiots posting?
          i do not have alternate user-name account except my "Michael" Account and my "Bridgman" Account.


          Originally posted by Panix View Post
          Anyway, the German government highly subsidizes these energies, in particular, wind.
          and again you are to stupid to understand the difference between subsidies and a "pay as you go financing model"
          subsidies are only if you pay TAX and the Government pay the subsidies but there is no TAX for green energy!
          and there is no Subsidies for green energy!
          if you don't want to you don't have to pay for "Green-energy" you can buy a Diesel-Generator-Power-plant and run on Diesel 100% then you use ZERO green energy and you pay ZERO in a pay as you go model!
          the german KFW bank also PAYS you the "Diesel-Generator" i do have a natural-Gas Power-Plant myself in the same way!

          in fact you are to stupid for "Germany" our laws are to complex for you sorry please stay away.

          Originally posted by Panix View Post
          But, that's too difficult for most to comprehend, apparently.
          you are the one who come up with lies like "Subsidies" in germany we only do have Subsidies for Nuclear energy and Coal energy but not for Green energy!

          Comment


          • #7
            Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
            i do not have alternate user-name account except my "Michael" Account and my "Bridgman" Account.

            and again you are to stupid to understand the difference between subsidies and a "pay as you go financing model"

            in fact you are to stupid for "Germany" our laws are to complex for you sorry please stay away.

            you are the one who come up with lies like "Subsidies" in germany we only do have Subsidies for Nuclear energy and Coal energy but not for Green energy!
            Even the German publication, Der Spiegel, mentions subsidization. I guess Germany benefits because they have enough stupid people to pull the wool over the eyes and fool enough people. They can keep the farce going. No wonder the MSM politicians are so happy.

            Comment


            • #8
              Originally posted by Panix View Post
              Even the German publication, Der Spiegel, mentions subsidization.
              then even a german publucation "der spiegel" can be wrong.

              read the LAW instead of a "NEWS Paper" then you get the truth and the truth is: ITS NOT A SUBSIDIZATION

              this proves again you are to stupid for german LAW and ORDER because you don't unterstand that german LAW is writen in LAWs not in NEWS-Papers LOL---

              really STOP being that stupid!

              Originally posted by Panix View Post
              I guess Germany benefits because they have enough stupid people to pull the wool over the eyes and fool enough people. They can keep the farce going. No wonder the MSM politicians are so happy.
              you talk about stupid people? but YOU ARE the WORST CASE of BEING Stupid! LOL!

              if you are to stupid to read a german law read the english wikipedia instead:

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Renewable_Energy_Act


              wikipedia : "The remuneration rates are not subsidies as such since they are not paid for by taxes. On the contrary, the “polluter pays principle” (OECD, 2006) is distributed to the consumer: who consumes more pays more. The remuneration rates are paid for by every consumer with the electricity bill.

              in fact there are no Subsidies!

              so stop your dirty Lies!

              Comment


              • #9
                I know I said that I wouldn't post on Q's threads any more, but I just had to post this link:

                Aluminium producer files for bankruptcy

                Note that the reason is high electricity costs: ""Production of metals, particularly aluminum, is at risk in Germany due to high electricity prices that are no longer internationally competitive," said Grillo.

                German users of over 20 GWh per year pay 11.95 euro cents per kWh, compared to 6.9 cents in France, according to energy.eu data for November 2011. Among the 27 EU countries only Cyprus, Italy, Malta and Slovakia have higher prices for heavy users of electricity."

                What were you saying again about the cost of electricity in Germany?

                Comment


                • #10
                  Originally posted by Shielder View Post
                  I know I said that I wouldn't post on Q's threads any more, but I just had to post this link:

                  Aluminium producer files for bankruptcy

                  Note that the reason is high electricity costs: ""Production of metals, particularly aluminum, is at risk in Germany due to high electricity prices that are no longer internationally competitive," said Grillo.

                  German users of over 20 GWh per year pay 11.95 euro cents per kWh, compared to 6.9 cents in France, according to energy.eu data for November 2011. Among the 27 EU countries only Cyprus, Italy, Malta and Slovakia have higher prices for heavy users of electricity."

                  What were you saying again about the cost of electricity in Germany?
                  the energy costs for consumers are "Higher" but only because of a higher profit rate for the energy "companies"

                  the base-load energy is cheaper in Germany and the peak-load energy is cheaper in Germany but only if you a "energy company" the energy companies SELL IT TO THE CONSUMERS AT A HIGHER LEVEL TO MAKE MORE PROFIT!

                  you do criticism on "Capitalism" instead of GREEN energy.

                  just do the Math think like a energy company you buy cheaper base-load and cheaper peak-load power and you sell it to max out your "PROFIT"

                  in Germany a "Aluminium producer" don't pay for "green energy" also they are free do run there own power plant on diesel or gas or coal then they don't need any energy from bad evil companies.

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    Hmmm, if electricity prices are higher because electricity companies are profiteering, why are they all reporting losses?

                    Electricity prices are higher because of subsidies. From the article:

                    The industry should not suffer, said Grillo, because of "electricity price rises that result clearly from the state support system for renewable energies, and especially photovoltaics."

                    Subsidies have encouraged power companies and property owners to add about 25 GWe of solar capacity, mainly in the last five years. This produced 2.4% of Germany's power in the 12 months to February, according to statistics from the International Energy Agency (IEA), while the remaining 12 GWe of nuclear capacity gave 15.3%. By far the bulk of German power comes from fossil fuels, some 71%.

                    The IEA data also shows German power exports down by 0.9% in the year up to this February, and imports up by 7.7%.
                    No subsidies? Lower costs? If there really were lower costs with renewable energy, why does the renewable energy industry need subsidies?

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      I'd say renewables are quite expensive in the construction phase. Lower costs once operational. If you want to construct an offshore windfarm or a dam for hydroelectric energy, costs mount very quickly. Also the nuclear issue is causing losses - the decommissioning process is lengthy, costly and complex for the German energy firms.

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        When speaking about green energy, please don't forget that the actual plant (where green electricity is produced) is only half the story. The problem is, you have to produce just enogh electricity to cover the actual demand in each moment. So at 10% green energy in the whole system, it's easy, but if you would like to go 100% green, you have to store the electricity when available and release it when needed. The only way I know of is flooding a higher altitude region by pumping water uphil when there is to much electricity and then driving a classic water plant whe demand is higher. I can't imagine the cost for this, let alone the environmental impact.

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          As Q already said, the money the renewables get is by actually producing something while you get subsidies for producing nothing. Maybe he shouldn't use insults all the time but well, that's another story. Also energy prices are actually lower the less the portion of nuclear energy in the net. Maybe you people should actually get your facts straight when talking about stuff in a foreign country first.

                          http://www.heise.de/tp/blogs/2/151961 only available in german, sorry

                          And why are the energy companies creating losses. Well, how do you avoid taxes and at the same time move the politics towards your position? You get the point.

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            Originally posted by Shielder View Post
                            Hmmm, if electricity prices are higher because electricity companies are profiteering, why are they all reporting losses?
                            wow now you really beat the wrong pupped if a Coal,Nuclear,bullshit-energy company reporting losses then its the green energy fault? LOL ??
                            The price in the market is "true" and if a company with "bullshit-power-plants" can not compete in this price range then its there own fault.
                            if a company reporting losses on the current energy price and other companies make money on the current energy price then its there own fault.
                            but yes in your DREAM Communism world a company always must make profit even if they use bullshit like Coal or nuclear power plants.

                            right now we do have a market cleansing in Germany bad and old and worst power plants will be opted out just because the energy costs are so "low"


                            Originally posted by Shielder View Post
                            Electricity prices are higher because of subsidies. From the article:
                            in my knowledge there are only subsidies for COAL and NUCLEAR and yes you are right Germany MUST turn OFF the Subsidies for COAL and NUCLEAR !

                            prove for the coal subsidies: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAG_Deu...G#Subventionen

                            and for nuclear: "Das Deutsche Institut für Wirtschaftsforschung sieht in der begrenzten Deckungsvorsorge eine implizite Subvention. Da die möglichen Schadenssummen um ein Vielfaches höher sind, muss der Staat für darüber hinausgehende Schäden aufkommen. Müssten die Kraftwerksbetreiber allerdings mögliche Schäden vollständig versichern, wären deren Versicherungsbeiträge erhöht, was sich direkt auf die Wirtschaftlichkeit auswirken würde.[56] Laut einer Greenpeace-Studie wäre Atomstrom um bis zu 2,70 Euro pro kWh teurer, falls bei Kernkraftwerken die gleichen Haftungsregeln gelten würden wie in allen anderen Wirtschaftsbereichen.[57]"

                            http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernkraftwerk

                            The German Institute for Economic Research admit that nuclear get 2,70€ per kWh subsidies !


                            Originally posted by Shielder View Post
                            No subsidies? Lower costs? If there really were lower costs with renewable energy, why does the renewable energy industry need subsidies?
                            in germany there are only subsidies for nuclear and coal. but not for green energy!

                            Comment

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