Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Long time study show: war on drugs is a war against smart Humans.

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    Originally posted by Panix View Post
    He's a loon
    Hi five dude then we are zwo in this submarine vessel.

    Originally posted by Panix View Post
    but why do you want to ban someone?
    maybe just because he is a: "complete extremist" ???

    Originally posted by Panix View Post
    He's not hurting you
    if he feels like this? maybe my words are to hard for his sensitive soul ?
    maybe i should start talking about bunnies and flowers and rainbows and ponies "My little pony"



    Originally posted by Panix View Post
    posting his ridiculous ramblings so just don't read his posts. Problem solved.
    ramblings? i just stand for my rights



    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
      do you mean me? Or the poster, I am not shure if he is completly right with his view,
      why do you answer on a troll post ? Elyotna is just a troll.

      also think about this: heroin is more healthy than morphine because the morphine do a pseudo-allergic reaction on your body and the histamine from mast cells comes on your blood and hurt you in a allergic reaction.
      Heroin is the only Opiate without any histamine effect.
      because of my histamine-intolerance syndrome my doctor almost killed me with opiate as pain killers. because i'm allergic against nearly all Opiate/morphia

      because of this i only use GBL as a pain killer i even don't touch codeine.

      only Heroin is so clean it can not hurt you.

      Wikipedia: "which also had fewer side effects than morphine (in terms of histamine response)"

      you stigmatized one of the best medicine only the addiction is a problem but you can cure the addiction with Iboga http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibogain...ioid_addiction

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
        why do you answer on a troll post ? Elyotna is just a troll.

        also think about this: heroin is more healthy than morphine because the morphine do a pseudo-allergic reaction on your body and the histamine from mast cells comes on your blood and hurt you in a allergic reaction.
        Heroin is the only Opiate without any histamine effect.
        because of my histamine-intolerance syndrome my doctor almost killed me with opiate as pain killers. because i'm allergic against nearly all Opiate/morphia

        because of this i only use GBL as a pain killer i even don't touch codeine.

        only Heroin is so clean it can not hurt you.

        Wikipedia: "which also had fewer side effects than morphine (in terms of histamine response)"

        you stigmatized one of the best medicine only the addiction is a problem but you can cure the addiction with Iboga http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibogain...ioid_addiction
        sorry I meant as drug for fun, if I need something like morphine as painkiller I would consider (inform me more) about heroin. Do you use it for years and have your addiction under control? is gbl = heroin?

        I dont say that it is bad, but I have very much respect against heroin and I am not informed enough to just use it just like that, at least there are died some people which mis-used it, and as example there are no deaths from a overdose of thc.
        Last edited by blackiwid; 11-28-2011, 06:33 PM.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
          sorry I meant as drug for fun, if I need something like morphine as painkiller I would consider (inform me more) about heroin. Do you use it for years and have your addiction under control? is gbl = heroin?

          I dont say that it is bad, but I have very much respect against heroin and I am not informed enough to just use it just like that, at least there are died some people which mis-used it, and as example there are no deaths from a overdose of thc.
          no GBL isn't heroin.. GBL is legal in germany you can buy it without problems.
          http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butyro-1,4-lacton

          the problem is heroin is against the law in germany even for medicine its against the law.
          this is complete bullshit.
          I'm allergic against all legal versions from Opioid and morphine and codeine and heroin is the only i can use and its against the law.

          but yes I'm fine with GBL its very strong to and its not opioid based its "Body's own hormone-based" GBL break down to GHB in the body.

          GBL is so strong it can beat even heroin out of the body! but you need the anesthesia dosage of GBL 5-8g.

          this means you can make a heroin withdrawal on GBL infusion.

          Comment


          • #50
            I think people are missing the point

            The problem that the "propaganda" had against drugs was not the drugs themselves. Nobody is arguing that drugs can't be useful medically.

            The problem that everyone has with drugs, is the "experimenting" with drugs.

            The human body is so vastly complicated that most people don't even have an idea, of how much there is to know. And drugs can have all kinds of effects, which can change depending on what's already happening in your body at the time. There's a reason they tell patients not to eat anything the night before surgery, up through the surgury itself. Because the anathesiologist doesn't want any surprises.

            To make the problem worse, drugs can have vastly different reactions if you take other drugs at the same time. For example, I take a simple mild little pill on a daily basis. But, when i got a athlete's foot, the doctor subscribed me a pill to help it clear up faster, and didn't bother to check if I was taking other pills, and for two weeks I felt like I had absolutely no energy.

            Anethesiologists have to study for YEARS just to make sure the patient comes out of surgery alive, and they only use a handful of drugs. Admittedly, those drugs are so nightmarish-ly powerful, that no doctor would ever dream of encountering them anywhere outside of the operating theatre (hence the Michael Jackson fiasco). But still...

            The point is, there are medical professionals, who do valid long term scientific studies, and have a knowledge base that has been built up over CENTURIES of tried and tested drugs, known side effects. Possible problems under certain conditions, allergic reactions, how it affects other drugs, etc...

            The problem that the "proganda" has against drugs, is that it sells the idea to people, especially the people who are above average intelligence (they tend to think they're smart enough to do anything), that it's safe to "experiment" with drugs. People don't die from over dose every time they take drugs, they die because there was something that they didn't know. For example, they might not have known that if you take Drug X, it will multiply Drug Y's potency by 2. Or, they didn't know that if you only ate sugar (like Ice cream) for breakfast, you may crash especially hard if the drug and your abandunt sugar supply runs out simultaneously.

            The "druggies" out there, that are dying from OD, or getting horribly addicted, are the INTELLIGENT people who thought they understood something that was far more complex than they ever dreamed it would be. And, no you're suggesting that Drugs should be made legal, which would open to the gates to morons as well...

            At the end of the day, what I'm saying, is that I think the way the law is set up, is actually pretty good. Where ignorant morons who THINK they understand drugs, have to break the law to get them, but people who actually need the drugs, can get them vary easily with a simple prescription from a medical professional that is qualified to make that assessment.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by StephanG View Post
              people who actually need the drugs, can get them vary easily with a simple prescription from a medical professional that is qualified to make that assessment.
              you are simple a liar in this point because the most drugs are against the law even for medical use and no medical professional can give it away.
              you can't get "Heroin" for example.
              and you can't get LSD.

              you talk about smart people's failure but you fail here to.

              another failure from you is the "experimenting" argument because "experimenting" is Personal-Research.

              you just claim that "Research/Personal Research" is bat and you use the word "Experimenting" to give it a bad "sound"

              for example i only know my sickness because i do Research in the past because no doctor found my histamine-intolerance.
              The substance benzoic acid is potentially deadly for histamine-intolerant people. which I tested on myself gave the crucial clue.

              Research is a hard and dangerous work you can not do Research if you only do My little Ponys and bunnys and soft and icecream and sugar sweet stuff.

              In history of Research they also kill people in the past and billion of people after that benefit from this human killing action.

              science and research is immoral.
              Last edited by Qaridarium; 11-29-2011, 10:19 AM.

              Comment


              • #52
                I am not informed enough to say if its good to allow heroin or not, but for now I belive you, because you know more then I do. But on party-drug side we should allow soft drugs (the catorisation should be looked over again thats maybe not perfectly right seperated but a startpoint) because 1. nobody died from using mariuana but many many died from alkohol, so if we allow alkohol we must allow weed else its totaly arbitary. Then there is the cancer argument that is also strong in my opinion. So thats the arguing in pro and contra (in this case only pro ^^) but we should also allow them just because the people are adult, they should know what they are doing, if thats not true we did something really wrong in education and as community or family, and even than, most people are responsible enough to know what they are doing, and just to protect a minority (even that we do not succed, in countrys where its legal to buy or use mariuana less people use it) its not ok to disrespekt the adultness of the mass.

                For medical use, you should at least have to sign a few times some papers who informs you about the risks, because here in germany most people just take what the medic tells them, without question it. So you should at least know that its dangerous what you are doing, but if thats granted and a medic also thinks thats what you should take now, than it should be legal.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                  I am not informed enough to say if its good to allow heroin or not,
                  to allow heroin is not my point. my point is research and Medical use should be free. right now only research is free but not medical use. its complete bullshit to allow morphine but not heroin as medicine.
                  my neighbor is ill and she use morphine from the doctor as a painkiller on a daily basis but this makes she very FAT and she blows up like a marshmallow from the morphine because of the histamine reaction.
                  she really needs "Heroin" but the Doctor can't give it away.
                  she is really in a end-stage of illness you really lose nothing to give Heroin to these broken people.

                  another point is she want do a withdrawal but she can't do it alone and the Doctor don't help she ask her Doctor for "Iboga" but its against the LAW .
                  the Doctor can not use Iboga to help here do a withdrawal this is complete bullshit!

                  LAW and ORDER in "Drug use" is just a WAR against humans nothing more!

                  Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                  but for now I belive you, because you know more then I do.
                  hey cool

                  Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                  But on party-drug side we should allow soft drugs (the catorisation should be looked over again thats maybe not perfectly right seperated but a startpoint) because 1. nobody died from using mariuana but many many died from alkohol, so if we allow alkohol we must allow weed else its totaly arbitary.
                  this Rhetoric just fails! alcohol is dangerous and should be against the law.
                  the real point is marijuana should be allowed because its healthy many ill people use it as medicine.
                  if you make law on an logic: alcohol should be against the law and marijuana is allowed.
                  or just allow all drugs and if someone dies on alcohol its just the "freedom"
                  dieing from drugs is "Freedom of chose"
                  if you compare heroin to alcohol then heroin is "healthy" to the body.

                  make alcohol against the law or allow all dugs there are no other valid point of views.

                  Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                  Then there is the cancer argument that is also strong in my opinion. So thats the arguing in pro and contra (in this case only pro ^^) but we should also allow them just because the people are adult, they should know what they are doing, if thats not true we did something really wrong in education and as community or family, and even than, most people are responsible enough to know what they are doing, and just to protect a minority (even that we do not succed, in countrys where its legal to buy or use mariuana less people use it) its not ok to disrespekt the adultness of the mass.
                  here you are complete right! its a complete failure if a adult can not smoke marijuana .

                  sure its complete brain-death.

                  Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                  For medical use, you should at least have to sign a few times some papers who informs you about the risks, because here in germany most people just take what the medic tells them, without question it. So you should at least know that its dangerous what you are doing, but if thats granted and a medic also thinks thats what you should take now, than it should be legal.
                  try this with alcohol the box of papers will not end if you need to sign every single dangerous risk of alcohol.

                  read the wikipedia page about it if you print it in small letters its 40-50 pages.

                  we really do have a educational problem most people don't know the fact that Heroin do not have any bad effect on the body health (only risk is overdose and addiction) but alcohol is in daily usage but its full of risks.

                  but yes educational problems everywhere educational problems.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Hmm, wow.
                    I didn't read this whole thread, because it is definitely running out of control --> VERY VERY STUPID.

                    Q: You've made some weird claims in this thread. You started by linking to an article written in German to support your claims that "drugs are good". I can't read German, but I know that this is not the case. Based on the progress of this thread, it seemed that they found some link between intelligence and drug use. One theory (which is WHACK) is that the drugs cause the intelligence. I guarantee that this is NOT the case. First off, an intelligence test is not really a test of intelligence. It is a test of the ability to make certain connections, mathematically, logically, but not an overall assessment of the quality of thought. There is a LOT more to having complete and advanced brain function than to be able to score extremely high on an IQ test. In fact, very often there are people who have SEVERE brain disorders that score EXCEPTIONALLY well on IQ tests.

                    LSD *may*, under some circumstances, cause a boost in IQ score. Ok, I'll admit that it is possible, but not because it causes an IMPROVEMENT in brain function. It simply shorts the brain out and causes connections to be formed where otherwise there would be none. This isn't an improvement, it is DAMAGE. You've mentioned that LSD causes a reduction in FEAR -- well FEAR exists for a REASON --> It keeps you from DYING by doing STUPID CRAP. LSD causes people to jump off buildings because they think they can FLY. They may score higher on an IQ test, but the side-effects are REALLY REALLY STUPID.

                    The connection between intelligence and drug use is also probably in the REVERSE DIRECTION, i.e., the same phenomenon that causes one to be more intelligent may also prompt one to be more susceptible to addictions, or, as has been pointed out, all work and no play makes Q a druggie.

                    There are also other things; sociopaths have an increase in the amount of WHITE MATTER -- internal brain wiring. These people often show higher IQ levels, but at the expense of having a reduced sense of MORALITY. These people are also known to be much more susceptible to addictions because they are focused on instantaneous gratification rather than long term planning.

                    You've also made claims that certain abusable drugs are good because they're available by prescription... parkinsons? Sure.... but its a situation where there IS no perfect solution. Drugs make things bad, but so does the disease. It doesn't mean that the drugs cause a benefit in someone who is actually HEALTHY.


                    There is also a question of whether substances are or are not addictive. There are certain definitions; that a person could go off the drug without ill effects. The big question is DO THEY WANT TO. People get psychologically conditioned to want to feel good, so whether the drug is or is not PHYSICALLY addictive, a person can become PSYCHOLOGICALLY addicted to it. In fact, EVERYTHING that anyone can perceive as "feels good" is something you can be psychologically addicted to.

                    As far as end of life treatments go, I may agree with you. In some instances, it may be better to make someone *feel* good than to let them suffer right until the end. The only problem with this is that making it available for SOME people, makes it possible for others to steal and abuse it.
                    Last edited by droidhacker; 11-29-2011, 01:09 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
                      this Rhetoric just fails! alcohol is dangerous and should be against the law.
                      the real point is marijuana should be allowed because its healthy many ill people use it as medicine.
                      if you make law on an logic: alcohol should be against the law and marijuana is allowed.
                      or just allow all drugs and if someone dies on alcohol its just the "freedom"
                      dieing from drugs is "Freedom of chose"
                      if you compare heroin to alcohol then heroin is "healthy" to the body.

                      make alcohol against the law or allow all dugs there are no other valid point of views.
                      hmm I think my english is bad because that is exactly what I tried to say


                      try this with alcohol the box of papers will not end if you need to sign every single dangerous risk of alcohol.

                      read the wikipedia page about it if you print it in small letters its 40-50 pages.

                      we really do have a educational problem most people don't know the fact that Heroin do not have any bad effect on the body health (only risk is overdose and addiction) but alcohol is in daily usage but its full of risks.
                      but drugs are not only a logical stuff it needs a cutlure, so you are maybe right with heroin, but you cannot say to people in one day heroin is the worst drug who kills fast people and then one day later lets give it free in the supermarket. So to sign 1-2 papers does not hurt much, but maybe very sick people who are to ill to even sign some papers but there maybe some realtives could sign them for them, that would be a big improvement at least. I do not want to take heroin in next time so I am to lazy to read to much about it right now. But I will keep in mind what you did say and if I am very ill and need such painkillers I inform myself. But addiction (strong addiction) is also a big problem espacialy if you wanna use it just for fun so that you maybe do some crime to get more and so on, but ok if sick people who are starving there would be no problem with giving them. So maybe its better to not hinder it at all.

                      I vote for the pirates, they will have soon a party congress on which they have 2 drug proposals, one is very progressive to also allow all drugs at least for medical use if not even totaly. So lets hope that this proposal goes through and maybe maybe someday (2013) there are anough votes for a collition without cdu+spd with green party + left party and pirates, then hopefully much change here. I am also for a basic income grant thats also problematic to bring to reality, so I would be glad for a soon coming stop of sanktions of hartz4, that I mean with my proposal that maybe some warning papers would calm down conservative people.


                      but yes educational problems everywhere educational problems.[/QUOTE]

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Using drugs is for poor, stupid,dump, ppl , just like those who smoke cigarette!

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                          hmm I think my english is bad because that is exactly what I tried to say
                          OK yes nice

                          Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                          but drugs are not only a logical stuff it needs a cutlure, so you are maybe right with heroin, but you cannot say to people in one day heroin is the worst drug who kills fast people and then one day later lets give it free in the supermarket. So to sign 1-2 papers does not hurt much, but maybe very sick people who are to ill to even sign some papers but there maybe some realtives could sign them for them, that would be a big improvement at least. I do not want to take heroin in next time so I am to lazy to read to much about it right now. But I will keep in mind what you did say and if I am very ill and need such painkillers I inform myself. But addiction (strong addiction) is also a big problem espacialy if you wanna use it just for fun so that you maybe do some crime to get more and so on, but ok if sick people who are starving there would be no problem with giving them. So maybe its better to not hinder it at all.
                          you are right its the "culture" and the "culture" isn't logical.

                          but hey strong addiction isn't a problem because the humans found the addiction killer "Iboga"
                          1 and only pill of Iboga can beat Heroin a life time. It's like vaccinating
                          Iboga is a vaccinating against addiction.

                          Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
                          I vote for the pirates, they will have soon a party congress on which they have 2 drug proposals, one is very progressive to also allow all drugs at least for medical use if not even totaly. So lets hope that this proposal goes through and maybe maybe someday (2013) there are anough votes for a collition without cdu+spd with green party + left party and pirates, then hopefully much change here. I am also for a basic income grant thats also problematic to bring to reality, so I would be glad for a soon coming stop of sanktions of hartz4, that I mean with my proposal that maybe some warning papers would calm down conservative people.
                          yes the pirates are a very nice hack in the BRD's system.
                          yes the pirates are very important.

                          i hope they beat the others away!

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Drugs are good for you, and I have the pics to prove it!







                            and this is what you ingest when you're ingesting GHB.





                            Enjoy!

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              Hmm, wow.
                              I didn't read this whole thread, because it is definitely running out of control --> VERY VERY STUPID.
                              And you want join the stupidness? this "I didn't read this whole thread" prove you are not carefully. you are just a part of the stupidness if you are not fully carefully.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              Q: You've made some weird claims in this thread.
                              its maybe weird for you because you search for an logical system but i work/write source based and if some scientists make research with an weird result then i pick it up. some of the stuff are also additional tested by my self.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              but I know that this is not the case.
                              because why do you know its not the case? do you have any sources ? self testing experience? To write this is easy the hard part is to prove it. no one will believe you if you don't prove it.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              Based on the progress of this thread, it seemed that they found some link between intelligence and drug use. One theory (which is WHACK) is that the drugs cause the intelligence. I guarantee that this is NOT the case.
                              you already lose your "Guarantee" because there are many Nootropics and cognitive enhancers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic

                              but yes you can prove this wrong for every single substance you can do it easily just because you are the 1337 droidhacker

                              or are there still some doubt, and trans-humanism is still possible?

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              First off, an intelligence test is not really a test of intelligence. It is a test of the ability to make certain connections, mathematically, logically, but not an overall assessment of the quality of thought. There is a LOT more to having complete and advanced brain function than to be able to score extremely high on an IQ test. In fact, very often there are people who have SEVERE brain disorders that score EXCEPTIONALLY well on IQ tests.
                              It does not matter what you test and how you test it. it is only important to recognize whether a drug is helping by what you do to be better.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              LSD *may*, under some circumstances, cause a boost in IQ score. Ok, I'll admit that it is possible,
                              this is not "may" be so its tested and retested multiple times.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              but not because it causes an IMPROVEMENT in brain function.
                              you can not prove your claim here.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              It simply shorts the brain out and causes connections to be formed where otherwise there would be none. This isn't an improvement, it is DAMAGE.
                              and again you can not prove your claim because there is no "damage"
                              also the scientist fact is against your claim because LSD force the brain into a more Parallelism oriented work process because it separates the brain areas and reduce the blocking functions to shut down unused parts of a brain. normally the brain try to focus on 1 threat and try to shut down unused parts to save energy. on LSD single threat tasks over several brain regions are broken up into a multi threat task action.
                              in simple words: LSD break the energy save system of the brain and unlock(force) the multi threat features of a brain.

                              the result is a normal person use 10% of the brain and a LSD user do use more than 90% of the brain.
                              a LSD brain consume over 10 time more energy.
                              its like a CPU if you overclock it or unlock more cores it burns more energy.

                              you can watch this with an fMRT LSD blows the energy away like hell.

                              its like driving a unlimited speed German Autobahn with 400km/h in 10 card in the same time.

                              its so called a Synästhesie.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              You've mentioned that LSD causes a reduction in FEAR -- well FEAR exists for a REASON --> It keeps you from DYING by doing STUPID CRAP. LSD causes people to jump off buildings because they think they can FLY. They may score higher on an IQ test, but the side-effects are REALLY REALLY STUPID.
                              you only do polemic here because LSD heals you if you have morbid fear.
                              also you can not prove your claim that lsd makes you jump off buildings.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              The connection between intelligence and drug use is also probably in the REVERSE DIRECTION, i.e., the same phenomenon that causes one to be more intelligent may also prompt one to be more susceptible to addictions, or, as has been pointed out, all work and no play makes Q a druggie.
                              LSD for example is proved to not make any addiction.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              There are also other things; sociopaths have an increase in the amount of WHITE MATTER -- internal brain wiring. These people often show higher IQ levels, but at the expense of having a reduced sense of MORALITY. These people are also known to be much more susceptible to addictions because they are focused on instantaneous gratification rather than long term planning.
                              you also can heal sociopaths with LSD it increase the social interest .

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              You've also made claims that certain abusable drugs are good because they're available by prescription... parkinsons? Sure.... but its a situation where there IS no perfect solution. Drugs make things bad, but so does the disease. It doesn't mean that the drugs cause a benefit in someone who is actually HEALTHY.
                              GBL for example increases the life expectancy proved by a german university.

                              why not use it?

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              There is also a question of whether substances are or are not addictive. There are certain definitions; that a person could go off the drug without ill effects. The big question is DO THEY WANT TO. People get psychologically conditioned to want to feel good, so whether the drug is or is not PHYSICALLY addictive, a person can become PSYCHOLOGICALLY addicted to it. In fact, EVERYTHING that anyone can perceive as "feels good" is something you can be psychologically addicted to.
                              and you don't count addiction killer drugs like Iboga?

                              and for LSD for example its proved there is no addiction at all not physically and not psychologically.

                              Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                              As far as end of life treatments go, I may agree with you. In some instances, it may be better to make someone *feel* good than to let them suffer right until the end. The only problem with this is that making it available for SOME people, makes it possible for others to steal and abuse it.
                              there is a end of life treatment studies of LSD and its proved LSD help them to accept that the life is limited and they don't need to have fear about this because its the basic of the nature. also LSD kills cancer pain because in dosages it separates body and mind this means the body feels pain but the mind is far far away and don't focus on the pain anymore.

                              ↑ Peter Gasser: LSD-assisted psychotherapy in subjects with anxiety symptoms associated with advanced life-threatening diseases http://www.maps.org/research/lsd/swi...LDA1010707.pdf

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by AnonymousCoward View Post
                                Drugs are good for you, and I have the pics to prove it!
                                do you think all drugs are like Crystal/Methamphetamin ?
                                and the germans use Crystal/Methamphetamin in the world war 2 without your claimed effect.
                                the most destructive effect about this drug is the impure street shit in the drug.

                                this means in fact the prohibition make them more ill than the drug.


                                Originally posted by AnonymousCoward View Post
                                and this is what you ingest when you're ingesting GHB.
                                i use a 99,9% clean syntese purely version not your impure car washing version.

                                Originally posted by AnonymousCoward View Post

                                Enjoy!
                                also this picture is proved not a GBL cleaner. its a natrium caustic soda based cleaner.
                                Last edited by Qaridarium; 11-29-2011, 06:14 PM.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X