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Wayland Is Moving Along Well For Fedora 21

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  • #16
    Originally posted by liam View Post
    Drago commented on Christian's blog and provided a link to a kp commit that enables both 2d and 3d accel in xwayland. That patch is a few weeks old.

    Edit: given that 3d should be working in xwayland in 21 that checks of everything in the list save wacom.
    Great news. Looks like I'll be a Wayland tester when F21 arrives.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by doom_Oo7 View Post
      But if the game also links against Xlib, will it still work ? (e.g. linked statically against SDL)
      This depends on the version. If it's SDL1, it will try to link directly against Xlib and the game will run through XWayland. If it's SDL2 with a version before Wayland support was merged, it will dynamically open Xlib and go through XWayland. Any later version will dynamically open the wayland libs and run natively.

      Originally posted by emblemparade View Post
      Almost all Linux games rely on SDL, and if they're new enough then it's SDL2, which supports Wayland directly -- no need for XWayland. My guess is that you'll be able to game fairly well on Fedora 21. (As long as you're OK with the poor performance of the open source NVIDIA/AMD drivers.)
      Note that there are certain functions in SDL2 that are impossible to support in Wayland (eg. setting/getting global mouse cursor or window position), so even if a game relies 100% on SDL2 (no Xlib), it's still not guaranteed to work perfectly well on Wayland.

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      • #18
        Hope OpenSuSE move along too. Would be good to have KDE5 on Wayland on r600g

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Ancurio View Post
          Note that there are certain functions in SDL2 that are impossible to support in Wayland (eg. setting/getting global mouse cursor or window position), so even if a game relies 100% on SDL2 (no Xlib), it's still not guaranteed to work perfectly well on Wayland.
          Shouldn't these features be available through xdg-shell?

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          • #20
            Originally posted by newwen View Post
            Shouldn't these features be available through xdg-shell?
            Isn't the mouse-lock feature more games oriented than desktop? I believe it's still under discussion, not implemented yet, fot what I know.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by liam View Post
              Drago commented on Christian's blog and provided a link to a kp commit that enables both 2d and 3d accel in xwayland. That patch is a few weeks old.

              Edit: given that 3d should be working in xwayland in 21 that checks of everything in the list save wacom.
              So would this change the "not default before F23" conclusion or should I be resigned to it?

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              • #22
                Originally posted by newwen View Post
                Shouldn't these features be available through xdg-shell?
                No, I doubt there will be features exposed via xdg-shell that go against core wayland principles (ie. security and private information hiding).
                For reference, here's the current protocol: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/wayland/.../xdg-shell.xml

                Originally posted by valeriodean View Post
                Isn't the mouse-lock feature more games oriented than desktop? I believe it's still under discussion, not implemented yet, fot what I know.
                This is unrelated to mouse lock; you cannot simulate querying the global mouse pos & warping the mouse with mouse lock, unless you're expecting the app to do exactly one scenario (ie. constantly warping the mouse to the center).

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Kostas View Post
                  So would this change the "not default before F23" conclusion or should I be resigned to it?
                  No idea. I'm simply echoing what draco wrote on christian's blog.
                  My EXPECTATION is that it won't, but that f21 will still Just Work with wayland (if using intel/radeon/nouveau), except for wacom. If wacom get completed very soon (like, within the week), then they might change it...but that's extremely unlikely.
                  Personally, I've had zero luck running wayland outside of a live usb.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Ancurio View Post
                    This depends on the version. If it's SDL1, it will try to link directly against Xlib and the game will run through XWayland[. If it's SDL2 with a version before Wayland support was merged, it will dynamically open Xlib and go through XWayland. Any later version will dynamically open the wayland libs and run natively.
                    Correction from Ryan: SDL 1.2 also dynamically loads Xlib, like SDL2 does.

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                    • #25
                      SDL2 uses a rather special library loading mechanism, allowing users to replace SDL2 even if it was statically linked. Thus any SDL2-based game would be able to make use of future technologies added to SDL2 within the existing ABI. It's a cool forward-thinking feature.

                      From what I understand, Steam comes with its own SDL2 build rather than allowing games to use their own.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by emblemparade View Post
                        SDL2 uses a rather special library loading mechanism, allowing users to replace SDL2 even if it was statically linked. Thus any SDL2-based game would be able to make use of future technologies added to SDL2 within the existing ABI. It's a cool forward-thinking feature.

                        From what I understand, Steam comes with its own SDL2 build rather than allowing games to use their own.
                        Yes, but AFAIK that was merged after the Wayland support

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                        • #27
                          Well, we all know that we'll be needing XWayland support running for a very long time to come. Though newer apps using Gtk+ and Qt will be able to use Wayland directly, many essential program may never be upgraded, and of course not everything relies on Gtk+/Qt. XWayland will definitely add some unfortunate overhead, but that's just the nature of having to support legacy standards.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by emblemparade View Post
                            Well, we all know that we'll be needing XWayland support running for a very long time to come. Though newer apps using Gtk+ and Qt will be able to use Wayland directly, many essential program may never be upgraded, and of course not everything relies on Gtk+/Qt. XWayland will definitely add some unfortunate overhead, but that's just the nature of having to support legacy standards.
                            Actually, some Wayland devs have claimed that GL apps can run faster under XWayland, due to the zero-copy and reduced IPC stuff. I can't find a reference to it right now though.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Ancurio View Post
                              Actually, some Wayland devs have claimed that GL apps can run faster under XWayland, due to the zero-copy and reduced IPC stuff. I can't find a reference to it right now though.
                              I'm not sure that's still true now that DRI3 exists - I think they were talking about DRI2 then, and DRI3 brought some of those benefits to X.

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